what is the difference between Gary Fong's Lightsphere and Stofen Omnibounce

[espn]

Hmm.. quite uncomfortable with the last diagram.. hope someone can prove me wrong.. but in the diagram above, there is no difference with using direct flash..

Hi boss, my words are from my own dictionary and nothing to do with azone's diagram. Just using his illustration in showing how the light moves when using an omnibounce.

What I'm trying to say is that, omnibounce softens the light output as compared to direct flash, and there is a difference in the final output between direct and bounced flash.

Of course, I might be wrong...

 

[espn]

Yes, it is not correct, omnibounce, it means lights bounce from all direction (Omni direction), including behind the flash/camera, the LS also work in the same principle, but with bigger diffuser.

The front of the subject will received the most of direct light from the flash and some diffuser flash light bounce off the ceiling and walls, the side, and other area of the subject will received most of the diffuser flash bounce off the ceiling and walls, hence that where the softness come from.

If anyone can understand this, he/she will understand why omnibounce don't work well in open areas (bounce card works better in open area than omnibounce) and why LS is better then omnibounce.

Yep... catchlights got it right, I agree with him totally. The omnibounce/LS/LSII are all diffusers.

 

[lsisaxon]

Hi all, am quite new to flash photography... and after reading this post, guess have gleaned much from it ;p but a few qns here which i hope you guys can advise:

I tend to shoot more in indoors environment and own a stofen omnibounce.

1) Has anyone compared the difference in the effect using the omnibounce compared to a bounce card? Assuming ceiling is low enough for bounce flash, which will produce a nicer picture?
If ceiling is low enough, I don't see the need to use an omnibounce or bounce card, just point your flash head up to the ceiling. It produces a very even and nice lighting to your subjects.

I have encountered a situation where the ceiling is low enough but it is coloured. No ceiling bounce for that situation.

2) When using a omnibounce, do you bounce off the ceiling or do you point it directly to your subject. If both mode can be used, when to use which mode.
It all depends on whether you are shooting film or digital. For film, I have no problems pointing directly at my subjects. For digital, it helps to point 45 or 60 degrees up, so u don't "burn" your subjects. As mentioned above in Qn 1, there is no need to use an omnibounce if ceiling is low.

I do not have any problems with that, my digital body handles flash exposure pretty well. No prizes for guessing which make I use.

3) You won't be able to bounce flash from the ceiling if it is too high... how high is too high??
If ceiling is high, the bottom half of your subjects can get underexposed, so there's no point using an omnibounce! Omnibounce actually reduces flash power by 1 f-stop (if I remember correctly). Using a bounce card works for me in such situations. As for the height, there's really no hard and fast rule on a distinction between high vs low. It all depends on the GN of your flash, flash compensation etc. You will have a better idea with trial and error...all comes with experience
Thanks man!

Omnibounce is made in such a way that when you point 60 degrees upwards, a portion of it will still scatter light in the direction of the subject. You will still get some catch light although most of the power will be used in illuminating the surrounding. If your shots have the bottom half underexposed, you probably have not understood how the omnibounce work and use it to your advantage. You can tilt the head down to 45 degrees if that happens.

 

[lsisaxon]

Which is why i shrug when I see people using 70-200mm + LS or omnibounce + direct flash at models. Really beats me.. but oh well me not pro I keep quiet better

Those are real PROs okie.. :thumbsup: Dunch pray pray..

 

[pokiemon]

So to summarise,

Technical aspect
Direct flash - like shining a torch
Flash card - diffuses 180º. $8 or make your own.
OB - diffuses the light 270º. $40. cool factor.
LSII - diffuses light 360º more evenly cos of shape of sphere $89. ET comes home.

Common situations you can apply flash...

1. Outdoor - use direct flash (if necessary). doesn't make sense to use a diffuser.

2. Indoor low ceiling e.g. goodwood park, hyatt - use direct flash bounce off ceiling. light falls evenly with illuminated background. angle depends on how far your subjects are. don't forget to watch out for mirrors on ceiling (don't ask me why there are mirrors on ceilings)!!

3. Indoor high ceiling e.g. ritz, four seasons, fullerton, marriott, grandcopthorne - use direct flash with OB or LSII e.g. table shots at wedding. if subject is not covered halfway by table, use LSII.

4. Indoor portrait - use direct flash with LSII

5. Indoor with subjects at a distant e.g. fashion shows - use direct flash with increased intensity.

also equally important is to understand your flash. e.g. ettl, second curtain sync, intensity etc.

 

[espn]

Those are real PROs okie.. :thumbsup: Dunch pray pray..

I ever saw one lady at a fashion shoot, her flash is always 90 deg upwards.

And the place she was shooting at?

Raffles City atrium :bsmilie:

 

[lsisaxon]

I ever saw one lady at a fashion shoot, her flash is always 90 deg upwards.

And the place she was shooting at?

Raffles City atrium :bsmilie:

PRO mah.. As long as PRO anything also can one.. What is logically not possible to common people like us is possible to them.. I have not reached that stage yet.. so please don't comment my shots as PRO shots. I need effort to shoot those, try and try until get it... Not like PRO.. Pray pray a bit can easily get those what we think is impossible shots, one shoot one kill somemore... Looooonnnngggg way to go for many of us...

 

[espn]

PRO mah.. As long as PRO anything also can one.. What is logically not possible to common people like us is possible to them.. I have not reached that stage yet.. so please don't comment my shots as PRO shots. I need effort to shoot those, try and try until get it... Not like PRO.. Pray pray a bit can easily get those what we think is impossible shots, one shoot one kill somemore... Looooonnnngggg way to go for many of us...

That's why I want to learn from you ma.. you PRO liao leh :thumbsup:

 

[lsisaxon]

So to summarise,

Technical aspect
Direct flash - like shining a torch
Flash card - diffuses 180º. $8 or make your own.
OB - diffuses the light 270º. $40. cool factor.
LSII - diffuses light 360º more evenly cos of shape of sphere $89. ET comes home.

Common situations you can apply flash...

1. Outdoor - use direct flash (if necessary). doesn't make sense to use a diffuser.

2. Indoor low ceiling e.g. goodwood park, hyatt - use direct flash bounce off ceiling. light falls evenly with illuminated background. angle depends on how far your subjects are. don't forget to watch out for mirrors on ceiling (don't ask me why there are mirrors on ceilings)!!

3. Indoor high ceiling e.g. ritz, four seasons, fullerton, marriott, grandcopthorne - use direct flash with OB or LSII e.g. table shots at wedding. if subject is not covered halfway by table, use LSII.

4. Indoor portrait - use direct flash with LSII

5. Indoor with subjects at a distant e.g. fashion shows - use direct flash with increased intensity.

also equally important is to understand your flash. e.g. ettl, second curtain sync, intensity etc.

What I think of LSII since you say that it illuminates 360 deg (I haven't used one). You lose half the amount of light illuminating things which don't need to illuminate. And I think it might only be useful when you're using Metz 60-series.

 

[lsisaxon]

That's why I want to learn from you ma.. you PRO liao leh :thumbsup:

Wah.. I dowan to be PRO leh... I still cannot accept myself shooting rooflessly (make that ceilinglessly) with omnibounce at 90 degrees. Only thing I can think of is to use it to trigger slaves with minimum effect on the subject.

 

[catchlights]

I ever saw one lady at a fashion shoot, her flash is always 90 deg upwards.

And the place she was shooting at?

Raffles City atrium :bsmilie:

So funny meh?

One or two months back, I saw a cosmetic counter hire someone set up at studio light to shoot a makeover, at the same location you mention, one light set up, with reflector place beneath the subject, the studio light (I think is a 500w mono blk) also point upwards..... OMG!! my ex 4k flash head also not that powerful to do that!!? really amazing!! this is a set up that I can't find in any studio lighting books....

 

[espn]

What I think of LSII since you say that it illuminates 360 deg (I haven't used one). You lose half the amount of light illuminating things which don't need to illuminate. And I think it might only be useful when you're using Metz 60-series.

Nope... Metz 60 series don't need omnibounce or diffuser or whatsoever... it's good enough alone

 

[espn]

So funny meh?

One or two months back, I saw a cosmetic counter hire someone set up at studio light to shoot a makeover, at the same location you mention, one light set up, with reflector place beneath the subject, the studio light (I think is a 500w mono blk) also point upwards..... OMG!! my ex 4k flash head also not that powerful to do that!!? really amazing!! this is a set up that I can't find in any studio lighting books....

Eh he needs to light up the sun to reflect down to the reflector and back to the subject, this is how a PRO works ok... MSS...

 

[catchlights]

Eh he needs to light up the sun to reflect down to the reflector and back to the subject, this is how a PRO works ok... MSS...

By the way, from the sound of the flash pop, I don't think he is fire the flash at full power...

 

[lsisaxon]

Nope... Metz 60 series don't need omnibounce or diffuser or whatsoever... it's good enough alone

Hahaha... yeah.. maybe.. imagine full power into your subject's eyes...

 

[lsisaxon]

By the way, from the sound of the flash pop, I don't think he is fire the flash at full power...

PRO tio si PRO... :thumbsup: It's for the rest of the people there to see lah.. Free advertisement.. Who say flash must be for phtotgraphy only? Now I finally understand what's on PRO's mind.. Don't think I will ever be one..

 

[Cheesecake]

So to summarise,

Technical aspect
Direct flash - like shining a torch
Flash card - diffuses 180º. $8 or make your own.
OB - diffuses the light 270º. $40. cool factor.
LSII - diffuses light 360º more evenly cos of shape of sphere $89. ET comes home.

Common situations you can apply flash...

1. Outdoor - use direct flash (if necessary). doesn't make sense to use a diffuser.

2. Indoor low ceiling e.g. goodwood park, hyatt - use direct flash bounce off ceiling. light falls evenly with illuminated background. angle depends on how far your subjects are. don't forget to watch out for mirrors on ceiling (don't ask me why there are mirrors on ceilings)!!

3. Indoor high ceiling e.g. ritz, four seasons, fullerton, marriott, grandcopthorne - use direct flash with OB or LSII e.g. table shots at wedding. if subject is not covered halfway by table, use LSII.

4. Indoor portrait - use direct flash with LSII

5. Indoor with subjects at a distant e.g. fashion shows - use direct flash with increased intensity.

also equally important is to understand your flash. e.g. ettl, second curtain sync, intensity etc.

no leh, to really summarise, everything jus use LSPJII. no problem. :thumbsup:

 

[catchlights]

no leh, to really summarise, everything jus use LSPJII. no problem. :thumbsup:

You're really a hardcore LSII PJ supporter... :bsmilie: :bsmilie: :bsmilie:

 

[Cheesecake]

You're really a hardcore LSII PJ supporter... :bsmilie: :bsmilie: :bsmilie:

no la, good stuff and knowledge mux share. :thumbsup:

 

[freecloud]

Hi boss, my words are from my own dictionary and nothing to do with azone's diagram. Just using his illustration in showing how the light moves when using an omnibounce.

What I'm trying to say is that, omnibounce softens the light output as compared to direct flash, and there is a difference in the final output between direct and bounced flash.

Of course, I might be wrong...

Some posts in this thread mentioned that there is almost no difference between direct flash and omnibounce at open area.

But I have the similiar opinion with espn. The omnibounce at least can soften the light.

Can anyone give comments on this opinion?