my first thoughts on the k20d

[sbc]

:bsmilie: either ur DFA 100mm has problem, or DFA 100mm dun work well with K20D.^^; K20D is slightly faster for me in studio with both FA 35-70mm and Tamron 17-50mm.

Well it has the same 'problem' with both my K10D and K20D. Plus the 'unable to focus lock problem' is about 1 out of 15, and when the light is low.
Don't know if it is really faulty, because I did a focus test and it was spot on. No BF or FF, and the photos are really sharp! So I just have to live with it's strength and weakness.

 

[sbc]

U sure u did the test on M mode? Think creampuff and I both find the EV does nothing on M mode.

Well I am sure it is in M mode. Do the extreme test. Put +3ev compensation and press the green button. Then take a picture. You will find the picture very over expose.

Er...unless you guys are talking about totally something else? :bsmilie:

 

[flowerpot]

Ok, just got back from a studio shoot with my K20D. There are a couple of things I noticed.

1. AF - I don't find any improvement over my K10D in a studio enviroment. THe speed for achieving focus lock depends a lot on the lens. With a 18-55II, it was very fast, I had no problem shooting fast as it locks EVERY time. But with the DFA100, :sweat:, I can point the focus sensor at the eye and yet it can't lock! Instead the focus indicator will blink, telling me it can't find focus. Both cameras gave the same problem.

2. DR - Sometimes we CAN have too much of a good thing. With the K10D and its 'clipped' DR, I can burnt out the white background and black out the black background at will. But with the K20D, the DR is so wide it picked out every shade and texture of the background. :bsmilie: I had a hard time tuning the studio lights to achieve the effect I want, which is pure white and pure black background.

That's it. I will 'report' more on the sport shooting aspect of the K20D when I get my DA*300.

1) my FA50 macro also cannot lock in low light, it will go in and out, in and out :bsmilie:

2) same thing happen when i when for a studio recently, suppose to be high key but the background was a tiny grey, strobe not enough power (already f16) or K20D just manage to squeeze in that little white detail to prevent it from being pure white :bsmilie:

 

[scorpioh]

Well I am sure it is in M mode. Do the extreme test. Put +3ev compensation and press the green button. Then take a picture. You will find the picture very over expose.

Er...unless you guys are talking about totally something else? :bsmilie:

emm, the EV button is not available in M mode. The only ways to adjust your exposure in M mode is really by turning the dials for aperture, shutter speed and iso (holding on to OK).

 

[longko]

Well I am sure it is in M mode. Do the extreme test. Put +3ev compensation and press the green button. Then take a picture. You will find the picture very over expose.

Er...unless you guys are talking about totally something else? :bsmilie:

:bsmilie: ok I stand corrected. It works after I test it with AF-360FGZ again.

 

[longko]

1) my FA50 macro also cannot lock in low light, it will go in and out, in and out :bsmilie:

There's a trick to try overcome this. Try ask me when we meet, need to show personally.

 

[flowerpot]

U sure u did the test on M mode? Think creampuff and I both find the EV does nothing on M mode.

Well I am sure it is in M mode. Do the extreme test. Put +3ev compensation and press the green button. Then take a picture. You will find the picture very over expose.

Er...unless you guys are talking about totally something else? :bsmilie:

the EV will not work under normal circumstances, but if u press the green button, the K20D will attempt to correct the exposure for you and take the EV compensation into account. Try it, point at a scene, without any EV compensation press green button, look at the shutter speed and aperture, next point at the same scene do some EV compensation, press green button again, im sure there is some changes to the shutter speed or aperture which takes the EV compensation into account...

 

[sbc]

to reduce dynamic range, just up the contrast in pp

or just use levels, clip the highlights and shadows

I know how to do that, but that is beside the point. I had to hand over all the RAW files to the designer. I shouldn't make him adjust each and every file right? I had to get the exposure as perfect as possible so that I don't hear 'complain' that my pictures have to be 'touch up' in Photoshop because I cannot even get the exposure correctly. :nono:

It is 1 thing to be shooting for fun/myself. It is totally different if you are shooting on assigment. With digitals, photos are viewed immediately on the notebook in the studio, where everyone, including the client will see the results. You don't want to be giving excuses like ' oh, you can edit that out in Photoshop' kind of things. You get condemned on the spot as a photographer.

Of course these things can be done in Photoshop, but I am just saying tongue-in-cheek humour how good the K20D DR is. Sorry if you didn't get it.

 

[longko]

the EV will not work under normal circumstances, but if u press the green button, the K20D will attempt to correct the exposure for you and take the EV compensation into account. Try it, point at a scene, without any EV compensation press green button, look at the shutter speed and aperture, next point at the same scene do some EV compensation, press green button again, im sure there is some changes to the shutter speed or aperture which takes the EV compensation into account...

Ya it changed the shutter and aperture which makes it retarded especially u use M mode to set the shutter and aperture u desired. BUT the EV comes useful on flash in M mode. Normally our flash EV only compensate up to +1.0, but with this EV it adds another +3.0 which makes it idea when u ceiling bounce.

 

[sbc]

1) my FA50 macro also cannot lock in low light, it will go in and out, in and out :bsmilie:

2) same thing happen when i when for a studio recently, suppose to be high key but the background was a tiny grey, strobe not enough power (already f16) or K20D just manage to squeeze in that little white detail to prevent it from being pure white :bsmilie:

Hey flowerpot! So Both of us we totally agree that:

1. Macro lenses sucks at quick focusing

2. The K20D DR is fantastic

But just a small note. F/16 is quite small aperture, if you want to do high key and the strobe has not enough power, shouldn't you open up the aperture even more? Say f/8? That will surely burnt out the background.

 

[creampuff]

I noticed the EV adjustment in M mode in the exif. Just checked again dialing in more compensation and it works like sbc said. Hmm, a useful feature if one has a lens that consistently over or under exposes.

 

[sbc]

emm, the EV button is not available in M mode. The only ways to adjust your exposure in M mode is really by turning the dials for aperture, shutter speed and iso (holding on to OK).

Are you talking about the K10D or K20D?

 

[creampuff]

sbc, got the DFA 100 too and it is a hunter when the lights are low. :bsmilie:
The hunting probably wouldn't be a big matter had Pentax chose to keep the focus limiter like on the F/FA 100.

 

[flowerpot]

Ya it changed the shutter and aperture which makes it retarded especially u use M mode to set the shutter and aperture u desired. BUT the EV comes useful on flash in M mode. Normally our flash EV only compensate up to +1.0, but with this EV it adds another +3.0 which makes it idea when u ceiling bounce.

:think: good point i never though of that...

its abit late my wife is sleeping, i cannot try it now but i remember the +1 on the flash unit and +1 on the camera fn (flash compensation) is not link, which means +1 on the flash unit and +1 on the camera fn(flash compensation) will means +2 in total, anyway i could be wrong, i did the experiment sometime ago to understand the flash behavior , din write it down so im not sure.

 

[sbc]

I noticed the EV adjustment in M mode in the exif. Just checked again dialing in more compensation and it works like sbc said. Hmm, a useful feature if one has a lens that consistently over or under exposes.

Glad you agree. In fact I found out that my DFA100 and 18-55 gives different exposure using exactly the same setting 1/60, f8.0 in a controlled enviroment (studio flash). I cannot remember which one is 1/2 stop brighter. I think it is the 18-55. But the 18-55II is closer to the DFA100 in exposure.
So let's say I am using the 18-55 outdoor in M mode. Instead of remembering to dial in 1/2 stop under (either Av or Tv) I just dial in -1/2EV comp. Then I just center the indicator and I will get correct exposure everytime.

 

[flowerpot]

Hey flowerpot! So Both of us we totally agree that:

1. Macro lenses sucks at quick focusing

2. The K20D DR is fantastic

But just a small note. F/16 is quite small aperture, if you want to do high key and the strobe has not enough power, shouldn't you open up the aperture even more? Say f/8? That will surely burnt out the background.

f8 ? then my subject also washout leh, the strobe enough power, just that using light meter adjust strobe output till f16, suppose to be strong enough to wash out the white back drop, but my cam still pick up a tiny little grey...maybe light meter not accurate...:bsmilie:

 

[longko]

:think: good point i never though of that...

its abit late my wife is sleeping, i cannot try it now but i remember the +1 on the flash unit and +1 on the camera fn (flash compensation) is not link, which means +1 on the flash unit and +1 on the camera fn(flash compensation) will means +2 in total, anyway i could be wrong, i did the experiment sometime ago to understand the flash behavior , din write it down so im not sure.

It depends on which flash u using as they have diff power. The EV on body will force the flash to blast with more power. So if at ISO200 & EV0 it's already at full power, the EV+3 won't see any diff. Which was the case in my initial testing where I commented the EV serve no use.:bsmilie:

 

[longko]

f8 ? then my subject also washout leh, the strobe enough power, just that using light meter adjust strobe output till f16, suppose to be strong enough to wash out the white back drop, but my cam still pick up a tiny little grey...maybe light meter not accurate...:bsmilie:

Can't u just adjust the power of the strobe for f8 setting? I dun use light meter so dun really get how it works.:bsmilie:

Edit: misread^^;

 

[longko]

f8 ? then my subject also washout leh, the strobe enough power, just that using light meter adjust strobe output till f16, suppose to be strong enough to wash out the white back drop, but my cam still pick up a tiny little grey...maybe light meter not accurate...:bsmilie:

Can't you just add another flash or strobe for backdrop?

 

[sbc]

:think: good point i never though of that...

its abit late my wife is sleeping, i cannot try it now but i remember the +1 on the flash unit and +1 on the camera fn (flash compensation) is not link, which means +1 on the flash unit and +1 on the camera fn(flash compensation) will means +2 in total, anyway i could be wrong, i did the experiment sometime ago to understand the flash behavior , din write it down so im not sure.

Guys you have to remember that flash EV controls the flash and normal EV controls both the flash and Av/Tv values.
So if you are on Av priority, +1EV(normal EV) will increase the flash output AND slow the Tv to achieve 1 stop over.
If you are on Tv, +1EV will increase the flash output AND open(if it can) the Av to achieve 1 stop over.
But if you are on manual, it can't adjust the Av and Tv, so it will just increase the flash to get 1 stop over.

If you are using FLASH EV comp instead, it will only control the output of the flash and ignore the background(it has to be far enough) light level.
So if you set flash +1EV, the result will be something like the fill flash will be 1 stop over and yet the background exposure remains.

Of course to test this out, you have to do it outdoor when there is enough light for correct exposure. Then by changing the flash ev, you can control the amount of fill flash. However if you change the normal EV instead, it will change both the fill flash and the background exposure level.

In a dark room, there is no available light; the only source is the flash, so both type of EV will behave the same way.

Hope this helps