$10 for AD Wedding Photography

[SLCC]

Hey, i have a friend who is been paid for a $10 Ang Bao as the Main Photographer for taking a AD wedding, Does anyone has the experience before ???

I have a student also had this bad experience, hum.....I should say is as bad as you! His friend ask him to be the Photographer for his AD wedding and his friend wants him to take in digital. This student of mine don't have the digital camera (cos he just sold away all his camera), so he rent a digital camera from some one at $100 per day. He was told to be at the bride house early in the morning at 5am. He also drove his car for the whole day paying for his own patrol and give his friend a Ang Bao at $188(cos his friend also give him a invitation card for the dinner).

Let don't say about the service that he serve for the whole day, the total cost he spend for the camera renting, car patrol and Ang Bao already about $300 plus liao! you know how much he get his Ang Bao? Is really a BIG ANG BAO is ......... only $8! He was so angry! What kind of friend is this! Of cos his friend mind think is a must for his friend to help him, but one whole day only $8......hum......a bit......jia lat lay!

To them your images turn out good is a must cos you are the main photographer but if your images don't out well then this will your fault! Why must we help them and get to blame at the end of the day when images don't turn out well and get $10 only when the images turn out well?

That why I alway say don't test how good is your relationship with your friend/friends by this way. Just tell them the price that you are offering them, take it or leave it is the best way to you and your friend!

 

[SLCC]

1) actually i started working at 8pm, but stll damn tired after the shoot
2) Yes , i give them a ang bao, suppose to give $50, but seeing the $10 was so angry woh, so I give them $30...

Actually you don't have to give any Ang Bao to thre couple cos you are give you "BIG ANG BAO"----your service to them for the whole day! They save at least few hundred dollars for the photographer fee.

Just give return what ever images that you think you want to on cd, don't do any processing for them. Since they "auto mode" out of order then let them know your "auto mode" also pai liao! :bsmilie:

 

[SLCC]

My apology, I am just a newbie ... I am just a learner, but my wed friends enaged me to be their photographer with another friend of mine ( 2 photographers in all, myself and a friend ) ... I am not trying to spoil the market but if U were me in this situation, receving a $10... dun u feel being insulted ???

Hum.....to your friend you only worth $10 but to you they are also worth only $10! Never mind learn a lesson now and say no in future.

No matter how $10 is really too low! Is really too much! :angry:

 

[janshim]

Hey, i have a friend who is been paid for a $10 Ang Bao as the Main Photographer for taking a AD wedding, Does anyone has the experience before ???

That sounds just like a couple of episodes I personally encountered shooting a wedding as favours to family relatives. Turns out to be quite an experience I don't want repeated. Both times, once I received a $100 ang pow and another time $200, equivalent to 1/8 of my usual rate for doing the same amount of work. No more family favours!

Feel free to post a comment http://shimworld.wordpress.com


Jan

 

[kiwitan]

u should just resize your photos into thumbnail sizes and printed out onto 50 4R photos. That should cover the $10 he paid you.

I did not put a copyright in the CD... or U mean u wanna me to do that ???
No way to a friend , even to a just ok friend

 

[duallies]

u should just resize your photos into thumbnail sizes and printed out onto 50 4R photos. That should cover the $10 he paid you.

LOL:bsmilie: i like this..

 

[wanzw]

That sounds just like a couple of episodes I personally encountered shooting a wedding as favours to family relatives. Turns out to be quite an experience I don't want repeated. Both times, once I received a $100 ang pow and another time $200, equivalent to 1/8 of my usual rate for doing the same amount of work. No more family favours!

Feel free to post a comment http://shimworld.wordpress.com


Jan

i have read that post and have fallen in love with it always ask people to direct their attention to that. let them understand, photographer not only take camera and flash. :thumbsd:

 

[janshim]

i have read that post and have fallen in love with it always ask people to direct their attention to that. let them understand, photographer not only take camera and flash. :thumbsd:

Hi there. I would like to add that photography especially digital is so much more involved than shooting film ever was. We are not paid enough for the time we spend before, during and after a wedding event. I was going to write about this separately but since opportunity to discuss this is here I'll post what comes to mind (taking a breather from post processing a recent wedding of > 1000 images).

My wedding day package includes:
1. One black pocket album with 300 4R Kodak matt prints or two albums with 400 prints
2. One DVD with post processed JPEG images (printed disc)
3. Three sets High Definition DVD Slideshow (Dolby Digital 5.1) CD soundtrack by client

My rate for this has been B$1,500 for the above package and it's beginning to make less sense when you look at the amount of time spent reviewing and post processing for mini-lab prints. Next comes sorting the images for the DVD Slideshow which is another time-consuming on its own. I live in a town approximately three hours return drive from where 98% of my clients are based (Brunei capital) so the journey is exhausting at the end of a very long day. A typical Chinese wedding take 16 hours out of a useful day, after that a couple of weeks of work to deliver the prints and Slideshow .. you tell me if it makes economic sense after you do the maths. Yet newbie photogs and clients alike fail to understand this and expect their photographs to magically appear the next day!

In between editing, I get called out for event shoots every other day (think about the amount of time I spent on the road), I've experienced burnt out countless times when you just want to call it quit. Back in July, I was contracted by EAIC (East Asian Insurance Congress) to cover the EAIC 2006 here and the programmed called for 5 days and 4 nights of shoot, I hired one pro photographer for the entire duration, the state of mind we found ourselves in on Day 4 of the event was more intense than the aftermath of a wedding, I must say. Result - 22GB of JPEGs!

At any major event including weddings that we usually shoot solo, we put our gear and health at risk all the time. Backup body, L lenses, Flashes, Quantum Turbo batteries, Laptop, power supplies, chargers of all sorts, etc .. by the time we finish "pang teh" we literally collapse while the batteries are being charged and images downloaded to the laptop, backed up to portable USB drives and a copy of that burned to DVD. Just cannot take any chances!

The recent wedding I did on Dec 3 before my Singapore vacation with the family, I had a super busy and exhausting birthday for my daughter on Dec 2 (invited many classmates whose parents were also invited, highlight of which were the 2-storey high pool bouncers that the kids enjoy so much). Anticipating this hectic weekend, I engaged a professional photographer to split the wedding shoot. The way we work with other pros goes like this .. out of mutual respect, we share the job 50-50 and I get a copy of the images right after the wedding shoot. So I shoulder the task of post processing and everything else within the scope of work. To avoid any complication with time line, always synchronise all camera clocks so when you sort regardless of camera brand, you sort it by Time/Day to get the entire set of photos right before you start the work.

Apologies if I seem long winded. It's a tough life we lead and it's not getting any easier.

 

[CreaXion]

That sounds just like a couple of episodes I personally encountered shooting a wedding as favours to family relatives. Turns out to be quite an experience I don't want repeated. Both times, once I received a $100 ang pow and another time $200, equivalent to 1/8 of my usual rate for doing the same amount of work. No more family favours!

Feel free to post a comment http://shimworld.wordpress.com


Jan

In my opinion, if u are doing a family favour, I dun see anything wrong with receiving a $100 Ang Pow. That shd cover part of your processing cost. Labour cost of course not included. Well it is a favour afterall or else it is not classified as a favour. You might as well charge them.

When I do for friends and relatives, I dun give ang pow. Just shoot, process, print and give. The developing cost shd be approximately the cost of the ang pow if we give to them. Just make our service free or else it is not called a favour.

 

[wanzw]

in response to janshim's post

time sync is very important when it comes to event shoot. i personally had the chance to be in an event shoot just early dec. around 18gb of photos for 3 days. and you know what? we have to PP them all almost every night to make sure we have prints to sell the next day. or else we won't be earning anything.

there was this group photo session and it was a severely screwed up case that cost my boss a lot of money. reason being? the association itself never planned it properly and expected us to do the logistics for them. so in the end very little was done and the last day i spent my hours trying to explain to the guests why the photos never came out while my boss was printing like crazy at the photo lab and my assistant covering the night DnD.

to be frank with you. i wouldn't want to work for that kind of money. i rather sit down and do a 9 to 5 job. but what drives me is the passion to shoot. as i want to stress further, i shoot for the sake of good photographs, not the business part. i get very fed up at customers who do not appreciate a single effort that comes from us. they expect and assume everything to do be done and taken for granted for.

hell the event lasted from 8am to around 12am everyday for 3 days. then my boss and i have to return to my house to upload all the CFs and do the post processing, just to select the photos that are deemed ok to be put on sale the next day. agreed upon by the association for us to sell the prints. in the end thanks to the crap planning the booth was not set up and efforts to 4am in the morning gone to waste. mind you we have to start the next day at 7am. WTF!

sometimes how i can wish the photographer will just be doing the photography business and let another mate do the business part. it is quite impossible for one to work solo. business + shoot. my boss is solo. i was just free lancing for him this december, and i got to learn all the behind the scenes that no aspirisng photographers will want to see and know. or rather, the ugly side of photography business. but one will just have to live with it or else no rice bowl already.

i have read your blog and understand that your works are of the finest quality and you put in great effort in producing the final products, at such short periods of time! the couple/family not being appreciative sometimes just turns one off man.

i still have so much more to speak of, just that i cant find one that is willing to listen. my close friends do not share the same hobby as me.

must say that i have experienced a lot. through the various events i have undertaken this month along with the article that you have posted.

long winded too. LOL.

life is not easy. and your wedding packaging is too demanding for a soloist. charge higher.

 

[janshim]

In my opinion, if u are doing a family favour, I dun see anything wrong with receiving a $100 Ang Pow. That shd cover part of your processing cost. Labour cost of course not included. Well it is a favour afterall or else it is not classified as a favour. You might as well charge them.

When I do for friends and relatives, I dun give ang pow. Just shoot, process, print and give. The developing cost shd be approximately the cost of the ang pow if we give to them. Just make our service free or else it is not called a favour.

If you read my Blog in its entirety, you'll realise it's not about the money. I had planned on giving my images as well as DVD slideshow as gift to the B & G but instead of being appreciative, good intentions turned sour as I was lectured not by the B & G but by their aunt who wanted me to shoot and who also apparently consolidated all complaints and offloaded them onto me. I cared less whether they gave me an ang pow or not but it's customary to do so.

http://shimworld.wordpress.com/2006/11/03/pro-for-nothing-and-insults-for-free/

 

[CreaXion]

If you read my Blog in its entirety, you'll realise it's not about the money. I had planned on giving my images as well as DVD slideshow as gift to the B & G but instead of being appreciative, good intentions turned sour as I was lectured not by the B & G but by their aunt who wanted me to shoot and who also apparently consolidated all complaints and offloaded them onto me. I cared less whether they gave me an ang pow or not but it's customary to do so.

http://shimworld.wordpress.com/2006/11/03/pro-for-nothing-and-insults-for-free/

Sorry did not read your blog and sad to hear abt it.

 

[raincool2005]

Sorry but have i offend u in a way or another ??? sorry
I hope I'm not the one who makes ur blood boils

same feelings here... if i would u... i will convert all pic into black and white !

 

[janshim]

in response to janshim's post

time sync is very important when it comes to event shoot. i personally had the chance to be in an event shoot just early dec. around 18gb of photos for 3 days. and you know what? we have to PP them all almost every night to make sure we have prints to sell the next day. or else we won't be earning anything.

there was this group photo session and it was a severely screwed up case that cost my boss a lot of money. reason being? the association itself never planned it properly and expected us to do the logistics for them. so in the end very little was done and the last day i spent my hours trying to explain to the guests why the photos never came out while my boss was printing like crazy at the photo lab and my assistant covering the night DnD.

to be frank with you. i wouldn't want to work for that kind of money. i rather sit down and do a 9 to 5 job. but what drives me is the passion to shoot. as i want to stress further, i shoot for the sake of good photographs, not the business part. i get very fed up at customers who do not appreciate a single effort that comes from us. they expect and assume everything to do be done and taken for granted for.

hell the event lasted from 8am to around 12am everyday for 3 days. then my boss and i have to return to my house to upload all the CFs and do the post processing, just to select the photos that are deemed ok to be put on sale the next day. agreed upon by the association for us to sell the prints. in the end thanks to the crap planning the booth was not set up and efforts to 4am in the morning gone to waste. mind you we have to start the next day at 7am. WTF!

sometimes how i can wish the photographer will just be doing the photography business and let another mate do the business part. it is quite impossible for one to work solo. business + shoot. my boss is solo. i was just free lancing for him this december, and i got to learn all the behind the scenes that no aspirisng photographers will want to see and know. or rather, the ugly side of photography business. but one will just have to live with it or else no rice bowl already.

i have read your blog and understand that your works are of the finest quality and you put in great effort in producing the final products, at such short periods of time! the couple/family not being appreciative sometimes just turns one off man.

i still have so much more to speak of, just that i cant find one that is willing to listen. my close friends do not share the same hobby as me.

must say that i have experienced a lot. through the various events i have undertaken this month along with the article that you have posted.

long winded too. LOL.

life is not easy. and your wedding packaging is too demanding for a soloist. charge higher.

I feel your pain. With the EAIC event, the organisers learnt from their previous overseas experience that the shoot and print model does not work and gave us up to a month to deliver the images. This is the first time that such a huge event did not offer print sales and that suited me very well. I am sure the mini labs were upset they lost a significant sales potential. I'm a big advocate of digital-only services because of where I live, when I am not required to submit prints I can easily Fed-Ex my images on printed CD/DVD to the clients and it would only cost me $5.00 compared to 3 hours commute, delivery time, fuel cost, meals and parking.

A copy of the opening day group photo at the steps of International Convention Centre can be seen here http://www.shimworld.com/images/EAIC.jpg Guest of Honour with EAIC Secretariat and Keynote speakers and other foreign delegates, many more of whom did not appear in the group photo. This image was handed to Asia Insurance Review where 800 copies were said to have been printed and distributed the next day in 8x12 print. At this event I met CNN's Lorraine Hahn and got her to autograph a photo of me and her from a previous event in Brunei. I also met and photographed with legendary retired Manchester United's Midfielder Striker, Lou Macari who made an appearance with AIG.

 

[wanzw]

I feel your pain. With the EAIC event, the organisers learnt from their previous overseas experience that the shoot and print model does not work and gave us up to a month to deliver the images. This is the first time that such a huge event did not offer print sales and that suited me very well. I am sure the mini labs were upset they lost a significant sales potential. I'm a big advocate of digital-only services because of where I live, when I am not required to submit prints I can easily Fed-Ex my images on printed CD/DVD to the clients and it would only cost me $5.00 compared to 3 hours commute, delivery time, fuel cost, meals and parking.

A copy of the opening day group photo at the steps of International Convention Centre can be seen here http://www.shimworld.com/images/EAIC.jpg Guest of Honour with EAIC Secretariat and Keynote speakers and other foreign delegates, many more of whom did not appear in the group photo. This image was handed to Asia Insurance Review where 800 copies were said to have been printed and distributed the next day in 8x12 print. At this event I met CNN's Lorraine Hahn and got her to autograph a photo of me and her from a previous event in Brunei. I also met and photographed with legendary retired Manchester United's Midfielder Striker, Lou Macari who made an appearance with AIG.

yup. the associaton shoot we had a group photo of similar proportions. that was the only major sales revenue.

digital pictures only. i dun think singapore will appreciate. take things for granted already. :bsmilie:

i can imagine the effort you took to photograph that group picture. finding a staircase long enough and having proper lighting and everyone's attention. great job!:thumbsup:

 

[Perry]

long time ago (15years), i oso help a friend. FOC and he gave me a $28 angpao. poor thing. help is one thing but not at $28 loh! anyway, i know him well and i know he is a stingy person.

nvm lah! let be happy and move on loh!

 

[djork]

Hey, i have a friend who is been paid for a $10 Ang Bao as the Main Photographer for taking a AD wedding, Does anyone has the experience before ???

I've been paid $20, but it's my cousin. so I don't mind. So does your friend mind?

 

[ConnorMcLeod]

Never have dealing with friends in any form. U pay more u angry. U pay less he/she angry. What's the point? :dunno:

 

[ConnorMcLeod]

To avoid any complication with time line, always synchronise all camera clocks so when you sort regardless of camera brand, you sort it by Time/Day to get the entire set of photos right before you start the work.

Smart trick! :thumbsup:

 

[janshim]

Smart trick! :thumbsup:

After you and your associate have just completed 22GB (yes, that's Gigabyte) of images from an event only to realise that there's approximately 3 minutes difference between camera bodies, it's a hard lesson you learn and not likely to forget anytime soon. In a large conference, a 3 minute difference when you're covering an entire convention centre of people moving about can become a post processing nightmare when it's time critical. Fortunately, our deliverable for the 5 days and 4 nights event were JPEG images on DVD only.