Roxanne: Episode 1 - Part 1

[grantyale]

Easy Zec. There are always different kinds of posts by different kinds of people. An easier way out is to pick up whatever you think rational and helpful while ignoring those you find less constructive.

 

[knoxknocks]

dun want to OT on your thread. I agree that there'll always be comments that are unwarranted. Just ignore them.

Photography is about yourself. Just keep shooting and learn to improve along the way by reading and observing.

I'm not an expert in portraits, but you've done a decent job as a newbie. Just that most of the poses are more or less the same with the same type of cropping. Vary it a little, and you'll get a more interesting series.

Just my 2 cts.

 

[Zeckson Chow]

To add on, they seemed to have forgotten what Wolfgang said on his email earlier about this type of unwholesome attitude and calling names at people. They seemed to forget that moderators and administrators are watching out on this all the time.

I am sure what I am doing now is not defensive but to highlight to everybody who is reading this that such unwholesome acts and attitude is not welcomed here in ClubSnap. Mocking at fellow CS members, calling model names, all these are uncalled for.

If moderators come back to me and said that what I am doing now, by standing up for myself and for the model, is wrong, I will quit this place. :thumbsd:

 

[Zeckson Chow]

Grantyale and Knoxknoxks, thanks guys. At least I know there are some guys here who are mature.

 

[kennyleong]

COOL...! COOL...ZC.. whats that rush to quit?

 

[Norest]

Hey dude, ignore the gossipers and just concentrate on improving your photos. The way I see it, maybe you should go get some books from the library and have a feel of how portraits should be taken. Go read up on basic design theory and understand the color wheel. Once you have seen enough, try to emulate what the professionals are doing and from there find your own style.

My two cents.

 

[poohbear]

PoohBear, does this sound like a constructive comment to you? Capitalize the words with exclaimation marks. I am very sure he knows what he is writing. I still remembered when he used the word "freaking" on one of my threads when I asked about convex lines. And in public forums, MSN, IRC, etc., capitalization of your words represent that you are stressing on it and caps with "!" at the back will mean a different thing, more emphasizing on the mood. Do you think I should still be sitting there talking nicely?

Look at other comments. They are constructive because they pinpointed out the wrongs and highlighted them to me so that I can take note. You do not see me replying to them in the way I replied to TMC (and some other people which may participate after reading this).

If I am defensive, I would have argued with everybody when they commented. But I didn't do so. In fact, I sat down with them and discuss and also agreed on the findings. This is called discussion. What TMC was doing was totally of a kids' playfulness and mentality. He might know a lot (which to me he claimed to be since he was so loud) but this is definitely not the way to reply to someone he doesn't know and has no direct relationship with.

It is either he is doing it on purpose or he has serious problems on his writing. "It's your freaking lens", "Yeah, you hear it right the first time. It's your freaking lens." And he commented that it was his way of speech and style for "non-abusive" interaction -- What childish talk is this?

You have been following all my threads and I am sure you know what I am talking about. To make things worse, some of them even mock at me in some other threads along with another bunch of people (you guys know yourself). Yes, my skills are poor. I don't have the knowledge. But that doesn't mean that they could gather and mock at me like this. If I am so good, would I be here posting and asking questions? I would be a pro already. Especially when they even called names to the model as "bapok"! My goodness!

Let me quote you what one of my friends who is a full time professional photographer working in Amsterdam said, "Zec, stop wasting time in ClubSnap. Some people just don't have the correct attitude."

I am beginning to wonder too.

Thanks for reading.

Aiya ......... U dun get what I mean .....I'm saying relax and look at it another way .... no need to get defensive everytime pple starts slamming you and starts a series of compo style retaliation . I must highlight to you that this is a internet forum and there will be all sort of people around. It's just like army what .... u dun expect everybody to be nice gentleman and talk powderful english . Anyway , if you step back a little and ponder on all the comments , u'll learn much much more , be it photography or non-photography related. Meet us for kopi one of these days at the 100 acres woods kopitiam , I got the answer to all your problem ...

 

[nightwolf75]

All correct. I did this on purpose for the fear that I will over-expose the picture. My D70 was set to ISO250, +1 EV, -2 Slow Sync flash, aperture F6 or higher and shutter speed 1/100 or faster.

Output picture is rather dim, as would D70 intentional leverage to medium gray. Post processing, I have to level up the exposure, brighten the contrast, increase the gamma, push up the saturation and add in a slight blue. Afterwhich, I have to sharpen the pictures a little bit as it look OOF due to handshake. And finally resize the large picture to a small size so that posting up in ClubSnap will be easy. During resizing, I have to sharpen it constantly as after every resizing, it becomes soft (Shouldn't have used Slow Sync flash).

The above are general settings used on most shots.

refrained from commenting until i saw this, TMC's response and ur response to TMC. well, since u asked... i'll try to be civil.

based on ur settings, u have some way to go in understanding how ur camera and equipment operates. oh, and i'm not talking abt photographic skills yet. dat will come later. from ur EXIF, i guess u set ur d70 on 'Auto ISO' mode, which could explain why i see ISO250. IIRC, most nikon users will highly recommend to switch off the auto-ISO feature and preset the ISO urself. again, this is only wat others recommend. personally, i prefer to set it myself. so, learn to read ur manual properly and understand wat each setting does. very few shooters i know recommend use any in-camera processing (eg sharpening) unless (a) they are hard-press for time to PS the shots for assignment purposes, or (b) they know full well wat their camera can or cannot do, and have customised the settings to suit their purposes. bottom line - read and understand ur equipment (flash, camera etc...) and get a firm grip on wat each setting does.

ur D70 is one of the best cameras on the mkt currently. i'm not ashamed to admit this and i got no agenda for saying this since i'm an unabashed canon user. if u know there's this thing called spot metering on ur camera, u'll know why over-exposure is not dat big a problem shooting in broad daylight. again, read the manual.

from ur settings, i believe u are trying to do wat is called 'fill-in' flashing to brighten up the shadowy areas. however, i think u dun have a firm grasp of wat fill-in flashing is or does. slow-sync flashing, IIRC, is meant for nite-time photography, and/or capturing/freezing motion trails (could be wrong abt this becos i'm not a nite/motion shooter). shooting portraits at F6? hmmm... not say cannot, but rare. do read up on the photographic triangle relationship bet ISO, f-stop and shutter speed and u'll understand why some people been trying to explain to u. guess TMC is 'frustrated' becos people has been trying their very best to put it across to u some basic photographic skills. however, u (to put it kindly) dun really seem to get it and been repeating the same few mistakes over and over again.

there's no magic formula to taking pictures (heck.. there's a world of difference between taking pictures, making pictures and making photographs). to take good pictures, any book/guru/teacher/etc... will tell u dat it starts from understanding ur equipment, then proceeding to understanding the basics of photography. as my fren (he's a guy i would call a photographer) student would say, it takes a lifetime to learn the skills of photography. u made the mistake of asking very mundane noobie questions which could be found in ur manual or googled on the net or CS when u first joined CS. this snowballed from then onwards and cumulated to the state today, so much so dat u have becomed the CS Idol in a bad way. rather then being defensive abt negatory comments, why not understand why some CSers poke fun at u? the more u try to defend urself without learning to see (photographically and/or otherwise), the worse it becomes.

 

[poohbear]

refrained from commenting until i saw this, TMC's response and ur response to TMC. well, since u asked... i'll try to be civil.

based on ur settings, u have some way to go in understanding how ur camera and equipment operates. oh, and i'm not talking abt photographic skills yet. dat will come later. from ur EXIF, i guess u set ur d70 on 'Auto ISO' mode, which could explain why i see ISO250. IIRC, most nikon users will highly recommend to switch off the auto-ISO feature and preset the ISO urself. again, this is only wat others recommend. personally, i prefer to set it myself. so, learn to read ur manual properly and understand wat each setting does. very few shooters i know recommend use any in-camera processing (eg sharpening) unless (a) they are hard-press for time to PS the shots for assignment purposes, or (b) they know full well wat their camera can or cannot do, and have customised the settings to suit their purposes. bottom line - read and understand ur equipment (flash, camera etc...) and get a firm grip on wat each setting does.

ur D70 is one of the best cameras on the mkt currently. i'm not ashamed to admit this and i got no agenda for saying this since i'm an unabashed canon user. if u know there's this thing called spot metering on ur camera, u'll know why over-exposure is not dat big a problem shooting in broad daylight. again, read the manual.

from ur settings, i believe u are trying to do wat is called 'fill-in' flashing to brighten up the shadowy areas. however, i think u dun have a firm grasp of wat fill-in flashing is or does. slow-sync flashing, IIRC, is meant for nite-time photography, and/or capturing/freezing motion trails (could be wrong abt this becos i'm not a nite/motion shooter). shooting portraits at F6? hmmm... not say cannot, but rare. do read up on the photographic triangle relationship bet ISO, f-stop and shutter speed and u'll understand why some people been trying to explain to u. guess TMC is 'frustrated' becos people has been trying their very best to put it across to u some basic photographic skills. however, u (to put it kindly) dun really seem to get it and been repeating the same few mistakes over and over again.

there's no magic formula to taking pictures (heck.. there's a world of difference between taking pictures, making pictures and making photographs). to take good pictures, any book/guru/teacher/etc... will tell u dat it starts from understanding ur equipment, then proceeding to understanding the basics of photography. as my fren (he's a guy i would call a photographer) student would say, it takes a lifetime to learn the skills of photography. u made the mistake of asking very mundane noobie questions which could be found in ur manual or googled on the net or CS when u first joined CS. this snowballed from then onwards and cumulated to the state today, so much so dat u have becomed the CS Idol in a bad way. rather then being defensive abt negatory comments, why not understand why some CSers poke fun at u? the more u try to defend urself without learning to see (photographically and/or otherwise), the worse it becomes.

Well said , tried to say all these but my england not that powderful ... Zec , I think NW75's pov is very objective , try to digest some.

 

[nemesis32]

Oh yes, I did set my camera to "Sharper" in the menu...

Normally if you are doing sharpening in PS, no need to set sharper in the camera... you using D70 also right?

 

[nemesis32]

All correct. I did this on purpose for the fear that I will over-expose the picture. My D70 was set to ISO250, +1 EV, -2 Slow Sync flash, aperture F6 or higher and shutter speed 1/100 or faster.

Output picture is rather dim, as would D70 intentional leverage to medium gray. Post processing, I have to level up the exposure, brighten the contrast, increase the gamma, push up the saturation and add in a slight blue. Afterwhich, I have to sharpen the pictures a little bit as it look OOF due to handshake. And finally resize the large picture to a small size so that posting up in ClubSnap will be easy. During resizing, I have to sharpen it constantly as after every resizing, it becomes soft (Shouldn't have used Slow Sync flash).

The above are general settings used on most shots.

Why do you need to use slow sync flash? Normally, slow sync flash is only use if you want the ambience light and the flash to be not too contrasty...

For normal model shoot, flash only serves as a fill in, a low output direct flash will do.

 

[nemesis32]

ZC... look at NW'c comments, i think he had said what TMC tried to say... in a more proper and direct way.

As for TMC comments, i dun think it's offensive. I assume he's thinking that you have no idea what you are doing with the flash, which i do agree to a certain extent.

Trying to do fill in is a good idea, but you need to know how to execute as well. Digest what NW has say and try it at the next shoot ok? Cheers.

btw, i was suppose to be in the morning shoot (i strongly advise taking the morning slot as better side lighting) and wish i can have another chance to shoot Roxanne again...

 

[bigmouse]

I wish I know how to do this. I don't know how to achieve this.

Original one could be due to jpeg compression too high. Too much post processing causes detai lossl. But some time ladies like because can hide "defects"

 

[jnet6]

refrained from commenting until i saw this, TMC's response and ur response to TMC. well, since u asked... i'll try to be civil.
becomes.

...................................................

Well said Nw.

i maybe OT.
Since last time i commented.. u should try to understand yr equipment first.
eg. read manual. go attend workshops etc. try and shoot with diff settin and see the effects u will get from yr cam.

Then u can start to ask how to get to this type of shoot.
Try to think simple...
or the next thing, Learn Photoshop. a very powerful tool. i think DarkForce have show u the power of editing with yr pics!!!!

 

[yanyewkay]

slow-sync is another form of 'fill-in' flash.. but normally not used in day time except for capturing/freezing motion trails in day like what NW75 said. There's no right or wrong mode to use. If you can use it to your advantage then you'll be breaking new grounds by breaking the rules.

but at 1/100, slow syncing is like in still like a 1st curtain flash. actually I'm also puzzle how a outdoor day shoot can get 1/100 shutter speed. You using ND filters?

 

[jnet6]

slow-sync is another form of 'fill-in' flash.. but normally not used in day time except for capturing/freezing motion trails in day like what NW75 said. There's no right or wrong mode to use. If you can use it to your advantage then you'll be breaking new grounds by breaking the rules.

but at 1/100, slow syncing is like in still like a 1st curtain flash. actually I'm also puzzle how a outdoor day shoot can get 1/100 shutter speed. You using ND filters?

bro... too much things for him to absorb.. let him learn his way first...
u start to give him filters................ (i dun know wat will happen)

 

[nemesis32]

slow-sync is another form of 'fill-in' flash.. but normally not used in day time except for capturing/freezing motion trails in day like what NW75 said. There's no right or wrong mode to use. If you can use it to your advantage then you'll be breaking new grounds by breaking the rules.

but at 1/100, slow syncing is like in still like a 1st curtain flash. actually I'm also puzzle how a outdoor day shoot can get 1/100 shutter speed. You using ND filters?

ZC,

I try and consolidate most of the comments for you and add in some of my thoughts.

1) Turn off Auto ISO as mentioned by NW. Most people set it to lowest, in your case, D70 will be ISO200. You can adjust your shutter speed or aperture but try to keep ISO constant.
2) Do use aperture priority to shoot. When you use Auto ISO, you ended up having ISO 250 and f6. It will prob resulted in too much DOF for portraiture. Usually people keep it at about F4-F5.6. If the speed too slow for you to hand held, fill in will help as well as adjusting the ISO (yup, now is the time to boost your ISO).
3) Avoid doing sharpening in D70. Since you using PS to sharpen, no need to sharpen in D70.
4) D70 have different shooting mode for portrait and lanscape.. i wonder if you use the correct one? You may want to check.
5) Shoot and see in your LCD for any obvious Under/Over expose using the histogram. Again, see you D70 manual for details.
6) Be aware of the model's hair, appearance etc
7) Try to shoot in morning. If you shoot near noon, nasty shadow will be casted under the eyes.... a reflector will help.

Most imptly, shoot more and have fun! Take in the positive comments and ignore the rest!

 

[Gymrat76]

I think we should all take a step back and consider this: What does it gain you to help ZC? OTOH, what does it gain you to post snide and belligerent comments at him? If you don't want to help, then don't, but continuing to post antagonistic comments (and yes, thats how I read TMC's posts) is undeserved and rather childish. OTOH, ZC tends to be long-winded -it could be annoying to some, but you can always opt to skip his posts right?

I'm not taking sides, just stating my POV. Come on, even if you don't like someone, you can at least be civil, right? :dunno:

 

[photo]

Hi Zec,

Nice shots, but compression wise a bit too heavy, the software you're using don't seem to give good final output.

I read the thread you asked about image size, did you shoot RAW? If you did, the settings that are applied are mostly un-doable in Nikon Capture 4. ie: Sharpening, Saturation etc. Do check it out, experiment with it.

Back to your images, frankly, they're a vast improvement over your last portrait session with "Ah Dor". I see that you're learning and moving on, very well taken attitude after all that bashing. :thumbsup:

However, do note that sharpness is not the most important aspect of an image, the more important aspect in photography, is the ability to bring the image's story to the viewers.

Pretty images serve one purpose, but the stronger images with story will strike the viewers harder and leave a deeper impression. There's no wrong no right in photography, as long as you like the images, you are all that matters.

No two photographers will think alike of an image, one might find it too sharp, one will insist more saturation, one more to the left framing etc etc. You are what you shoot, but don't worry too much on sharpness, experiment why not shoot at f/3.5 or 4.5 and why f/6 etc, take the painful way to learn, don't put a safety net before you shoot, you'll tend to hang on to it.

Lastly, I understand you have a bad experience here in CS with most of the people.

Don't be.

While people like TMC may be harsh, but think carefully before you strike back, think about why people comment like that. Is it unconstructive because it's harsh? Is it true? Accept the right comments and think why the person commented that. If the person is just a troller, then ignore of course.

You have made improvements over the months, getting whacked is healthy but do remember why you got whacked.

The images I have nothing to complain apart from compression, and over saturation, can push up the saturation a bit to make the skin slightly fairer.

The shots are definitely an improvement over the last series.

:thumbsup:

 

[jnet6]

I think we should all take a step back and consider this: What does it gain you to help ZC? OTOH, what does it gain you to post snide and belligerent comments at him? If you don't want to help, then don't, but continuing to post antagonistic comments (and yes, thats how I read TMC's posts) is undeserved and rather childish. OTOH, ZC tends to be long-winded -it could be annoying to some, but you can always opt to skip his posts right?

I'm not taking sides, just stating my POV. Come on, even if you don't like someone, you can at least be civil, right? :dunno:

well people... let's keep it simple ******

Or KISS.
everything is simple to learn with concepts.