Questions to D30 users again:)

[JasonTan]

Originally posted by ckiang


Can you recompose and shoot a scene with dark background using flash, on a D30 + Speedlite without overexposing the subject (without preflash, without using the other AF points)? I think this is a very common problem as I am told flash exposure is calculated from the active focussing point (which is now pointing in the dark).

Regards
CK

Need using the FEL function. The * button. A preflash is un avoidable in this case. But the end result is right on

Jason

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by Tweek


In P mode can set aperture? Next time show me leh...I don't know how to. Or maybe EOS300 too lousy liao, so cannot.

When I use the flash in P mode, the shutter speed will be set to 1/90s, and depending on the lighting conditions, usually the EOS300 will decide to use F4.0, which is too shallow. Sometimes my subjects are at different distances and not all will be in focus.

i think even in program mode, there's such a thing as program shift, where u can shift the exposure towards a certain setting while maintaing the same EV value the camera calcuated for u.

not too sure if this is available for the EOS 300. it should be there.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by ckiang

IMHO, slow-sync should not be a default setting. The Av setting on the D30 allows the shutter do go below flash sync speed without the user explicitly setting slow sync, which is not a very good implementation. Most other cameras will automatically set the flash sync shutter speed when a flash is detected and powered.

This is very bad if you are shooting in low light, want to use Av, and you get shutter speeds like 1/8s. With a Canon system, the only way to shoot with flash at a desired aperture without the shutter speed dropping below hand holdable speeds seems to be the M mode.

Well, at least there's the custom function to limit the shutter speed.

yes i don't see wat the fuss is about. the CFn to limit the shutter speed is already there. And it's also mentioned in the manual.

But honestly, why would I want to limit the shutter speed and produce obviously-flashed, washed out pictures with the main subjects lit like criminals, with a dark background behind?

i don't see why it is not a good implementation. This is very clearly stated in the camera manual, as well as in the manuals of the EX Speedlights. With Av mode, a tripod and a flash, you can take beautifully lit pictures with background properly exposed and main subject nicely lit with flash.

I can understand if u put on the flash unit and accidentally left the shooting mode in Av (i did that before a few times) but after a while, it should be quite intuitive, and i never had that happen to me now.

Using manual mode forces you to think, and take better pictures. That's why only power users use Canon, and others use poorer auotmated, safer implementations

 

[ckiang]

Hi,

Originally posted by Red Dawn


I can understand if u put on the flash unit and accidentally left the shooting mode in Av (i did that before a few times) but after a while, it should be quite intuitive, and i never had that happen to me now.

Using manual mode forces you to think, and take better pictures. That's why only power users use Canon, and others use poorer auotmated, safer implementations

Right. I use Manual mode when I use flash too, more control.

Regards
CK

 

[JasonTan]

Originally posted by Red Dawn


yes i don't see wat the fuss is about. the CFn to limit the shutter speed is already there. And it's also mentioned in the manual.

But honestly, why would I want to limit the shutter speed and produce obviously-flashed, washed out pictures with the main subjects lit like criminals, with a dark background behind?

i don't see why it is not a good implementation. This is very clearly stated in the camera manual, as well as in the manuals of the EX Speedlights. With Av mode, a tripod and a flash, you can take beautifully lit pictures with background properly exposed and main subject nicely lit with flash.

I can understand if u put on the flash unit and accidentally left the shooting mode in Av (i did that before a few times) but after a while, it should be quite intuitive, and i never had that happen to me now.

Using manual mode forces you to think, and take better pictures. That's why only power users use Canon, and others use poorer auotmated, safer implementations

Well said. Red dawn

 

[ckiang]

Originally posted by JasonTan



Well said. Red dawn

He JUST can't resist this.

Regards
CK

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by ckiang


He JUST can't resist this.

i will however give Nikon credit for coming up with a system that doesn't need preflashing to get flash exposures right. For general use, it's probably more convenient to have flash exposures averaged across the entire scene. (u can do the same thing with ETTL, but u have to be in manual mode)

however, i can forsee some situations too where u might want to explicitly preflash ie using your flash meter like a spot meter and take a flash exposure reading off a mid tone, or off a bright or dark tone and perform flash exposure compensation accordingly. That gives more manual control in difficult lighting situations. Once u get used to this method, it gives great confidence in using it cos u know exactly wat u will get, and u're trusting your own experience and judgement, rather than a processor chip in the flash.

 

[Shadus]

I think this is a very obvious scenario of not understanding the Canon system and yet can't resist commenting on it. :dunno:

anyway, can the starter of this thread post a pic?

 

[roygoh]

This discussion is specifically about Canon equipment. So I am moving it over to 'Canon' subforum.

Thanks!

Roy

 

[tomshen]

Well, thx all for yr info, now I'm getting closer to the point. The link posted by JasonTan is very good, dont miss it! I deleted the original pix so will take some again to show the 'problem', which is actually not such a problem if I had known the theory b4.

Good, I found photography is challenging enough for me to enjoy longer, otherwise may lose interest very soon.

 

[JasonTan]

Tom,

Glad to know you get to understand the theory behind EOS Speedlite. The D30 that you have is a great learning tool to marter the use on your speedlite. Take more pictures with it and se the result for yourself. Then read once more the link on the article that I posted and you will understand better.

Jason

 

[tomshen]

ya, thx a lot!

 

[mylau]

Originally posted by JasonTan
it's not that Canon has bad implementation on it's flash system. IMHO Canon EOS camera with it's speedlite ETTL flash system is a perfect combination. My D30 with 550EX give me spot on exposure everytime. The problem is many ppl did not fully understand how thier dedicated ETTL in canon speedlite works !!

Read your manual thoroughly once more and give it a try. If you need further in read this article :
http://teladesign.com/photo/eos-flash/index.html

Hope that helps.

Jason

I think some of us here need your expertise in this area. Could you please give us a brief account of how to shoot a subject with dark background and we need to recompose the shot? Usually, when using the D30, we use the centre focusing point. After recomposing, the centre focusing point will not be pointing at the subject anymore. Does this give you a perfect exposure?

 

[tomshen]

Correct me if i'm wrong. The manual implies if you don't press * to lock the exposure, then the value will change when you recompose your frame. Press the shutter button half-way is to lock the focus, not the exposure.

 

[erwinx]

wahh, canon flash so cheem one.

Nikon
(1) Turn on flash. Camera in any mode, aperture, shutter, manual
(2) Press shutter release

http://forums.clubsnap.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4037

p.s paiseh tripodasia really slow now.

 

[tomshen]

;( :angry:

 

[tomshen]

Read this from luminous-landscape: The grip also houses a second battery and automatically switches to the second battery when the first one is depleted. Thought no problem to mix up 1&3rd party batteries:bsmilie:

 

[ckiang]

Originally posted by erwinx
wahh, canon flash so cheem one.

Nikon
(1) Turn on flash. Camera in any mode, aperture, shutter, manual
(2) Press shutter release

http://forums.clubsnap.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4037

p.s paiseh tripodasia really slow now.

Give me a five man!

I get 99% perfect flash exposures. No preflashing, no exposure locking, etc needed. And that same flash can be used even in the venerable Nikkormat and get good exposures without resorting to Manual mode. How about that?

Wait, there's more. Nikon flashes can even be used on Canon, Pentax, Leica, Contax, Seagull, Mamiya, Rollei, etc cameras. Any camera with a standard hotshoe.

Regards
CK

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by mylau


I think some of us here need your expertise in this area. Could you please give us a brief account of how to shoot a subject with dark background and we need to recompose the shot? Usually, when using the D30, we use the centre focusing point. After recomposing, the centre focusing point will not be pointing at the subject anymore. Does this give you a perfect exposure?

simple. You preflash, focus, recompose, then shoot.

if the subject is wearing black / dark clothing, and u choose to preflash on his black clothing, after preflashing, you need to knock down the flash exposure compensation by about 1 to 1 1/3 stops. If subject is wearing white, increase flash exposure compensation by 1 to 1/3, 2 if subject wearing pure white.

Best is to preflash the face area, skin tone areas, or mid tone / near mid tone colors (dark blue, red, dark green etc). For these, no exposure compensation is needed at all.

After a while it will become second nature.

 

[mylau]

Originally posted by ckiang


Give me a five man!

I get 99% perfect flash exposures. No preflashing, no exposure locking, etc needed. And that same flash can be used even in the venerable Nikkormat and get good exposures without resorting to Manual mode. How about that?

Wait, there's more. Nikon flashes can even be used on Canon, Pentax, Leica, Contax, Seagull, Mamiya, Rollei, etc cameras. Any camera with a standard hotshoe.

Regards
CK

I agree with you, when I use nikon cameras, flash photography was the most enjoyable part. No worries at all.