New to HD - regarding compressor

[vonvonz]

Hi all, I'm trying to get into videography and I would like to get some advise regarding exporting videos to maintain the quality.

I'm using Adobe Premiere Pro for my editing and my original footage are of 1280x720 HD and planning to do a lot of time lapse in my videos. When I export my video as quicktime with mpeg 4 compressor but I get a lot of interlacing when I speed up the video and the video looks patchy.

Here are some questions:
1. is there ways I can reduce or avoid interlacing?
2. what fps should I use?
3. When I export my video after editing, what file type and compressor would you recommend me to use to maintain the HD quality as much as possible?

Thank you for your time. : ) Hope to learn more about videography here. :thumbsup:

p/s: repost cos i think i posted at the wrong place previously. :sweat:

 

[azman]

.
Hi Vonvonz,

When you export the video, is there an option where you can select to De-Interlace the export footage ?
It may solve the interlacing issue.
.
.

 

[vonvonz]

.
Hi Vonvonz,

When you export the video, is there an option where you can select to De-Interlace the export footage ?
It may solve the interlacing issue.
.
.

Thank you Azman, i realized I set the wrong fps in the first place hence the interlacing effect but at the same time i found the de-interlace option too, i will try that option next time if i face interlacing again. : )

 

[tengo]

2. You should always use the same FPS. If you shoot 25 fps, then compress in 25 fps.

3. It depends on codec. If exporting to WMV for 1280 x 720, use about 6Mbps. The simple reason is because Microsoft HD showcase uses this bit rate and Microsoft invented WMV. For 1920 x 1080, use about 8.5Mbps. Exporting to H.264 is about the same bitrate or you can put slightly lower. If exporting to inferior/older codecs, then you have to really up the bit rate.

Mpeg4 is a container. It is not the codec. You have to specify which codec to use... and the choice is typically H.264.

For better quality, always compress in 2 passes.

 

[d-popotamus]

1. is there ways I can reduce or avoid interlacing?
2. what fps should I use?
3. When I export my video after editing, what file type and compressor would you recommend me to use to maintain the HD quality as much as possible?

As mentioned, there's the thing called "upper first", "lower first" or "Progressive. Take note that interlacing reduces file size (at least, its supposed to, and designed to)

Industry standard frame rate is 24p (24 frames per sec, progressive). This gives it a more 'film' look. If you're putting it on TV, then 23.976 fps for NTSC and 25fps for PAL. Then again, these are SD standards, but note that if you're really putting it on TV (ie broadcasted), the frame rates & resolution matter.
So i assume that you're using it for normal computer playback and given that you're shooting in HD-720 lines, I would say it doesnt quite matter because whatever media player that you use for playback, it should detect your frame rate. A general guide (as mentioned) would be to use the same as your original source framerate. Just for reference, If you're exporting for Blu Ray or HD DVD, then industry standard is one of the following:
720p @ 23.976 fps
720p @ 24 fps
720p @ 50 fps
720p @ 59.94 fps

1080p @ 23.976 fps
1080p @ 24 fps
1080i @ 50 fps
1080i @ 59.94 fps

H.264 is a popular codec. It delivers good quality but not lossless. I guess when it comes to which codec to use, you have to decide based on your playback medium. If you're going to export elsewhere, you have to decide carefully. If you're playing it back locally, you can just, pretty much, use any codec that you like (that gives you decent quality with reasonable file size)

Hope this helps!

 

[vonvonz]

Hi Tengo and D-popotamus, thanks for the infomation. : D

 

[jhansolo]

Industry standard frame rate is 24p (24 frames per sec, progressive). This gives it a more 'film' look. If you're putting it on TV, then 23.976 fps for NTSC and 25fps for PAL. Then again, these are SD standards, but note that if you're really putting it on TV (ie broadcasted), the frame rates & resolution matter.

I'm wondering how 24p gives you a 'film' look.

and NTSC is 59.94i or 29.97 not 23.976.

 

[briansio]

I'm wondering how 24p gives you a 'film' look.

and NTSC is 59.94i or 29.97 not 23.976.

NTSC is 59.94i 29.97i 23.976p
PAL is 50i and 25p

because most hollywood movie is shot on 24p, (23.976fps) the spiky feeling image reel will give anybody that has ever watch hollywood movie a sense of film look for Oceania or Asian movie production is 25p, most TV series is shot on 30p/60p. that's my understanding, however i believe there's a deeper theory related to invention of 35mm and 8mm film, and their way of rolling.

above is the correct info, please check on google,

NTSC is used by north america,
PAL is used by most asian/europe/oceania country

the reason of different display format(NTSC/PAL) is related to way a television is constructed to display and it's refresh rate.

 

[jhansolo]

Dear briansio,
I have no clue to what you are try to correct, 24p is only the frame rate, to get 'film' look it is the way you light and shoot.
If you are talking about TV ... 23.976 is defintely not a acceptable format.
"Oceania or Asian movie production is 25p" ... that depends on the movie is shot on film or HDcam or Red, but most will shoot in 24p as I believe, I'm not in movie industry to give you a definitive answer.
The main reason for the different display format is mainly the electrical system 50Hz vs 60Hz, besides what you stated.

I do to correct you on NTSC is 59.94i 29.97i 23.976p - NTSC is in 59.94i and 29.97p
as for 23.976 please read
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/24p
This is great background reading material for HD NTSC and PAL
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-definition_television

 

[tiduck]

jhansolo, the posts above on 24p wrt the film look are pretty much spot on.

The 24p frame rate chosen by Hollywood a long time ago is pretty much responsible for what we consider today to be the "film look". 24p isn't a sufficiently high frame rate to achieve clean motion panning, and that little bit of judder is indeed one of the things that distinguishes theatrical releases from stuff shot for TV. That's why people were waiting so long for HD DSLRS that shot 1080p@24fps, because most people have come to associate that slight jerkiness with films.

This is in fact mentioned in the first para of the Wiki article you linked to on 24p.

 

[tkp77]

Sorry for hijacking this thread,

I am new to videography, and more to shooting for hobby. Recently just got my D7000, and was playing around with it for awhile. I realize the video (.MOV) play with some jerkyness on my PC using Quicktime, tried VLC and GOM, same thing happen... but when I preview the same video on the camera LCD, everything looks ok.

Is it because PC not powerful enough or I must look out for some setting??

Thanks alot for sharing...

Cheer.

 

[William2010]

Hi all,
24p does give u a 'film look due to the motion blurring. If u do notice, news casters like to shoot in either 50i or 60i to capture very crisp and sharp edge, so when u move, u will realise there is less ghosting and the image will look less dramatic.

With 24p for pal or 23.976p for ntsc, the ghosting is definitely more defined and longer.

Ppl used to shoot 24 frames per second on film, our eyes kinda get used to the ghosting and stuff but we dun realise it and define this look as 'film look'. The 24p or 24 progressive just indicates that the frames are 24 full frames played or recorded progressively like how film is played. 50i or 50 frames interlace is when 1 frames are split into 2 fields(upper and lower) to achieve a sharper image with less ghosting.

If you go on film set, you will notice movies shot on the Digital like the Red, Arri Alexa or Panavision Genesis still goes on a common frame rate of 24. Even many dramas nowadays are shot in 24p.

As for the jerky motion, chances are you shot in interlaced and quicktime took it as progressive. You will get jerky images that goes up and down. It can be solved when you deinterlace it in your editing software. But best to shoot on progressive.

If you do have a sound man on set, always remind the sound man your frame rate you are shooting. I have a friend who did some post in hk and realised that the camera frame rate and sound rate is different. Ended up they had to re-master the sound track.

As for codec, avi, mpeg and mov are just container extension. The real codec is when you export, you should be able to select whatever codec you need. Well, h.264 is by far the most popular codec nowadays.

Hopes this helps.. My editing days are long gone and I'm not exactly familiar with exporting nowadays. But well, you need a guy to do lighting, here I am

 

[iunspoken]

back to the original question on what's the best way to export it.

Best to export in the same resolution you shot in, aka, 1280x720. use H.264, the most popular and effective compression codec around. Your bit rate should be at least 7000kbps for a decent quality and size to send or upload via web. of course, set it to progressive scanning, and 25fps. no point having a 24fps or 30fps file unless you have specific intentions for them.

i'm presuming you are just lacking these vital statistics to input into the config menu, editing shouldn't be an issue ya?

 

[jhansolo]

The 24p frame rate chosen by Hollywood a long time ago is pretty much responsible for what we consider today to be the "film look". 24p isn't a sufficiently high frame rate to achieve clean motion panning, and that little bit of judder is indeed one of the things that distinguishes theatrical releases from stuff shot for TV. That's why people were waiting so long for HD DSLRS that shot 1080p@24fps, because most people have come to associate that slight jerkiness with films.

Thank you tiduck & William2010 for point that out.