fixing errors

[stefyxz]

Is it possible to fix errors made when developing a film?

1- underdeveloped. I can try to print at higher grade. Or... is it possible to put the film back in the developer once it has been fixed?

2- underfixed. As I understand, a sing of underfixed film is its pinky colour. Can I re-fix the film? Do I have to put it in the lightproof tank or it doesn't matter at this point?

 

[canturn]

1 - out of the question

2 - You can do it, not too long after. I normally dump it back into the tank if I underfix....

 

[student]

Is it possible to fix errors made when developing a film?

1- underdeveloped. I can try to print at higher grade. Or... is it possible to put the film back in the developer once it has been fixed?

2- underfixed. As I understand, a sing of underfixed film is its pinky colour. Can I re-fix the film? Do I have to put it in the lightproof tank or it doesn't matter at this point?

1 I disagree with Canturn.

There is a lot of difference between underdevelop and underexpose. There is nothing much one can do to an underexposed negative. Further development to an underexposed negative can only increase the contrast but not improve shadow details.

In a well exposed negative, there is ample density in the shadows, but the high values are not developed to its correct density. Now depending how much underdeveloped it is, one can improve the highlight density by putting it in a selenium bath (example Kodak Selenium 1:1 for about 10-15 minutes with constant agitation). You can improve contrast by one stop. And then if you so require, use a higher contrast printing. With the latter, the flip side is more grain, but it might be nice!

2 Underfixing can be dealt with by putting the negatives into new fixer. No need for light proof tank. Can also try washing longer.

 

[canturn]

1 I disagree with Canturn.

There is a lot of difference between underdevelop and underexpose. There is nothing much one can do to an underexposed negative. Further development to an underexposed negative can only increase the contrast but not improve shadow details.

In a well exposed negative, there is ample density in the shadows, but the high values are not developed to its correct density. Now depending how much underdeveloped it is, one can improve the highlight density by putting it in a selenium bath (example Kodak Selenium 1:1 for about 10-15 minutes with constant agitation). You can improve contrast by one stop. And then if you so require, use a higher contrast printing. With the latter, the flip side is more grain, but it might be nice!

2 Underfixing can be dealt with by putting the negatives into new fixer. No need for light proof tank. Can also try washing longer.

Doc, stefyxz mentioned putting it back in film developer, u mean it will still develop your neg after fixing?

And yes, selenium can do the trick actually to increase density of negs. Have underdeveloped my 120 film b4, and selenium saves the day... as for increased grain, not that obvious for 120 film. It's a question about handling selenium...they're potent stuff... very potent stuff...my bottle's wrapped in 4 layers of plastic bags...

OT here, there's a way to decrease over processed negs too, some ferro-cynide thingy that you used (if I didn't remember wrongly). Obviously, this is banned in Singapore, in case your dark room becomes a gas chamber.

 

[student]

Doc, stefyxz mentioned putting it back in film developer, u mean it will still develop your neg after fixing?

And yes, selenium can do the trick actually to increase density of negs. Have underdeveloped my 120 film b4, and selenium saves the day... as for increased grain, not that obvious for 120 film. It's a question about handling selenium...they're potent stuff... very potent stuff...my bottle's wrapped in 4 layers of plastic bags...

OT here, there's a way to decrease over processed negs too, some ferro-cynide thingy that you used (if I didn't remember wrongly). Obviously, this is banned in Singapore, in case your dark room becomes a gas chamber.

My apologies Canturn. I was focussing on salvaging an underdeveloped negative, not on Stefano's idea of further development by putting thenegative back into the developer. Your answer was of course right, absolutely! I apologise once again.

Regarding selenium, you are right that there is hardly noticeable grain with the increased contrast. But selenium is not that toxic, only when you drink it! But I admit it stinks like hell! So better to do it outdoors!

Reducing contrast with potassium ferricyanide is very safe. It is completely different from cyanide! Potassium ferricyanide (the bleach) is the active ingredient in Farmer's reducer. The other component is fixer. Potassium ferricyanide is also the bleaching chemical in sepia toning. I use potassium ferricyanide without using any glove at all!

 

[student]

Doc, stefyxz mentioned putting it back in film developer, u mean it will still develop your neg after fixing?

And yes, selenium can do the trick actually to increase density of negs. Have underdeveloped my 120 film b4, and selenium saves the day... as for increased grain, not that obvious for 120 film. It's a question about handling selenium...they're potent stuff... very potent stuff...my bottle's wrapped in 4 layers of plastic bags...

OT here, there's a way to decrease over processed negs too, some ferro-cynide thingy that you used (if I didn't remember wrongly). Obviously, this is banned in Singapore, in case your dark room becomes a gas chamber.

My apologies Canturn. I was focussing on salvaging an underdeveloped negative, not on Stefano's idea of further development by putting thenegative back into the developer. Your answer was of course right, absolutely! I was wrong. It is important to clear the wrong idea I put forward. One CANNOT developed a fixed negative! The undeveloped silver had been removed!

Regarding selenium, you are right that there is hardly noticeable grain with the increased contrast. But selenium is not that toxic, only when you drink it! But I admit it stinks like hell! So better to do it outdoors!

Reducing contrast with potassium ferricyanide is very safe. It is completely different from cyanide! Potassium ferricyanide (the bleach) is the active ingredient in Farmer's reducer. The other component is fixer. Potassium ferricyanide is also the bleaching chemical in sepia toning. I use potassium ferricyanide without using any glove at all!

 

[canturn]

My apologies Canturn. I was focussing on salvaging an underdeveloped negative, not on Stefano's idea of further development by putting thenegative back into the developer. Your answer was of course right, absolutely! I was wrong. It is important to clear the wrong idea I put forward. One CANNOT developed a fixed negative! The undeveloped silver had been removed!

Regarding selenium, you are right that there is hardly noticeable grain with the increased contrast. But selenium is not that toxic, only when you drink it! But I admit it stinks like hell! So better to do it outdoors!

Reducing contrast with potassium ferricyanide is very safe. It is completely different from cyanide! Potassium ferricyanide (the bleach) is the active ingredient in Farmer's reducer. The other component is fixer. Potassium ferricyanide is also the bleaching chemical in sepia toning. I use potassium ferricyanide without using any glove at all!

I do my selenium stuffs along corridor with fan blowing out of house. Well, selenium is found in almost all anti-dandruff shampoo. Ammonia stinks like hell.... Beware of selenium dust tho, dried selenium on floor is no-no.

hehe, the ferri-cyanide suffix is a little intimidating, haven't got the chance to try that tho...

 

[stefyxz]

a further development in the developer was an idea, but I already imagined that it was not the way. Selenium seems to do in this case. I believe the negative was properly exposed, but it came out very thin. Most probably, it was my wrong dilution using HC110.

Talking about HC110... I went to read about HC110, and found that some people don't dilute the syrup 1:3 (as recommended), and further dilute the solution when they need to develop (e.g., dilution B is 1:7 using the solution). They keep the concentrate syrup and dilute it straight to the final concentration (e.g., dilution B becomes 1:31 using the syrup). In this way the syrup lasts much longer. I think this system is neat, although it may be more prone to mistakes, since with these high ratios the margin of error is larger.

 

[canturn]

I personally do not like HC110, coz it's neither here or there. I prefer a developer that has characteristics, like Rodinal or D76.

for really finese personal work, I would use stuffs like DD-X...expensive one-shot developer that cost like $2.50 to develop one roll of 120 film. But over-all tonality wise and grain-wise really makes it the Beluga of Ilford developer. Trust me, even wine cost cheaper than DD-X!

 

[stefyxz]

yes, I know DDX and i like it very much. I get consistent results with it, different from what I am currently getting from HC110 (but mostly due to my wrong dilution).

As DDX is expensive and not always available, I was looking for alternatives. As you say, better to have a developer with character, so that you can obtain the results that you want.

For my needs, most of the times I want a developer that gives very fine grain (like DDX), and other times a developer that has high acutance. Any advice?

 

[kex]

i'm using Tmax with Tmax developer and quite like it.