Ask what you can do for your country?

[allenleonhart]

I think you can think and still try to do something for your country. The quote isn't about blind loyalty, really.

The fuller quote from JFK (inaugaral speech) is actually: Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country.

My takeaway from the quote is that it is an imploration for people to think beyond themselves and dedicate their lives to a greater good. The concept is loosely linked to the article I posted here: http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/kopitiam/1223181-pursuit-happiness.html

I've said this many times and I'll say it again. If you really feel that Singapore is your home, and that you have some vested interest in it - do something today. It need not be big. It can be small. Think that the government isn't doing enough to reach to the less well-off? Make the effort, walk the talk, start an effort to help. Change doesn't always come about through some overnight revolution oft imagined that is the result of watching too many dramatic movies (e.g. Les Miserables). It can, and in many cases, starts small, through individual or small group efforts, before it grows and grows positively into something more beautiful and substantial.

Echoing the multitudes of criticism doesn't do much. Arguing on the Internet serves no one except perhaps yourself. You can do that to blow off steam, to express a POV. But do more. Otherwise it's just a load of hot air achieving nothing but a sense of having done something and effectively deceiving one's self.

Happy New Year to you, btw.

yep happy new year to you too

for me, it has to start with the first part, is Singapore really the place for you? A lot of people don't seem to have an answer to that yet, and a lot of them still searching.
If it is, how do you want it to be? Is it good for all of us? on goes the questions and considerations. then slowly you can move on to do stuff in small steps.

I believe our version of that Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country is "No one owes Singapore a living"

One consideration as to whether Singapore is for you or not would be, are the policies something you agree with (and do they make sense)? I'm still racking my brains over that. I still can't make head nor tail from the white paper what is the ideal population/growth.

However, this is the view that i subscribe to:
http://www2.smu.edu.sg/about_smu/images/documents/hokwanping/ST_20120117_1.pdf

I don't think the White Paper addresses these underlying issues yet.

I don't want to be in a nation where the policies might potentially hurt us as a country. The little stuff i try to do, can only affect so much, while theirs is more or less a game changer...

 

[silencer13]

"......ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country." was crafted by John F Kennedy for his inauguration.
It was a long and inspiring speech that contained many patriotic phrases.

It was a different time then, a time when he had to galvanize a nation in their fight against the enemy - communism, and the height of the Cold War when any misstep would have engulfed America in nuclear devastation.
When Kennedy used those words, they had meaning and they rang true for their nation.

For us?
I think that you lose the moral authority to use that phrase when you start demanding a multi-million dollar remuneration for your services to the country.
You lose even more moral authority when you propose replacing the people of your own country with foreigners, just to sustain the economic growth necessary to upkeep your high remuneration.

Perhaps the ministers who uttered these words should reflect on themselves first before they demand that we ask ourselves what we can do for our country?
Why don't THEY ask themselves what THEY can do for their country, not what their country can PAY THEM?

 

[allenleonhart]

Perhaps the ministers who uttered these words should reflect on themselves first before they demand that we ask ourselves what we can do for our country?
Why don't THEY ask themselves what THEY can do for their country, not what their country can PAY THEM?

ah. an interesting take.

 

[edutilos-]

Perhaps the ministers who uttered these words should reflect on themselves first before they demand that we ask ourselves what we can do for our country?
Why don't THEY ask themselves what THEY can do for their country, not what their country can PAY THEM?

I don't think any Minister has uttered these words in recent times, not that I know of.

Unless *gasp* Yappy is a Minister. In which case, congratulations, Yappy!

 

[allenleonhart]

I don't think any Minister has uttered these words in recent times, not that I know of.

Unless *gasp* Yappy is a Minister. In which case, congratulations, Yappy!

ok lah. never utter those words, but trying to defend the cuts from cutting more afaik...
grace fu was one...

 

[Octarine]

Well I never bought into the idea of country etc. Patriotism is something dangerous you see... Look at Nazi Germany and you will understand.

This had very very little to do with Patriotism ..

 

[Yappy]

Don't worry, at a TFR of 1.2 and dropping fast, we won't have a country in 1-2 generation. It's either that or hand over the place to a new group of people or surrender to Malaysia or Indonesia.

If we do nothing than it will be 1.2 in 2030...

So what can we do to prevent this from happening?

 

[ricohflex]

Much hackneyed phrase since JFK first uttered it on 20 January 1961.

 

[Zenten]

I will exercise my voting right with utmost care in 2016 ..... To displace the ruling coalition and ward off a foreign invasion ..... That's the least I can do ..... God help me ... ....

 

[Halfmoon]

I will exercise my voting right with utmost care in 2016 ..... To displace the ruling coalition and ward off a foreign invasion ..... That's the least I can do ..... God help me ... ....

Let's pray that we can all last till 2016 and it is still 3 years away!!!!

 

[allenleonhart]

This had very very little to do with Patriotism ..

really?

if its not patriotism, do tell me what it is
if i don't feel patriotic (devotion to nation) or duty bound to the nation, why the heck would i want to give back to it? pack my bag and leave already...

so yes. its patriotism

 

[Shizuma]

No.. you should be a policy thinker and critics.. which both can be channeled through KPT in CS :bsmilie:

actually i am ex-member of a youth wing of a party which likes to wear white. But I left after no one wants to hear critical thought.

 

[Octarine]

if its not patriotism, do tell me what it is

The reason that NSDAP, the Nazis and Adolf Hitler came to power were manifold and go back to World War 1 or even further, but had very little to do with patriotism.
You can read the details in Wikipedia and many books, I don't want to create an additional essay here about what has been written so many times. You might have your idea about patriotism, but what happened then in 1933 was far more complex.
And those people who felt patriotic about Germany soon had to leave the country or face discrimination, oppression, death.

 

[Octarine]

actually i am ex-member of a youth wing of a party which likes to wear white. But I left after no one wants to hear critical thought.

The fish they served was already smelly..?

 

[ricohflex]

actually i am ex-member of a youth wing of a party which likes to wear white. But I left after no one wants to hear critical thought.

You missed being talent spotted for bright future. Leave your critical thoughts in kopitiam. And say "yes" in the youth wing meetings.

 

[Zenten]

I will exercise my voting right with utmost care in 2016 ..... To displace the ruling coalition and ward off a foreign invasion ..... That's the least I can do ..... God help me ... ....

alot will leave when their goals are fulfilled.. my pinoy colleague plans to work 5 years and go back be queen.. dun play play..

my china fren told me, pay them $800 and they will come to sg to work...cn you imagine a singaporean earnng $800? What fute does he sees? can he afford a hdb? a wife? family?

I speak from experience when I tell you that a lot of these FTs come without a hint of what the job entails when they embark on it. Some of these S-pass degree holders fare no better than our secondary fresh school leavers. All that talk about "only the brave dragon crossing the gorge" is utter nonsense and simply hearsay. This leaves me wondering what selection criteria are set for these so-called foreign talents.

To them, Singapore is nothing more than spring board after they have had their fill.
No wonder some say that Singapore is paved with gold........ make us look like Suckers!!!

 

[Octarine]

This leaves me wondering what selection criteria are set for these so-called foreign talents.

Look at the agencies that bring them here. I had the opportunity to look behind the scenes of maid agencies and it made my hair stand. I suspect it's not much different from S-Sass staff. Agencies are getting their money to get these people into Singapore, so they will do everything to make this happen: tweaking CV, faking details in bio, false promises to each and everyone. There was a case in construction industry where people brought in that were supposed to have wielding skills - none of them had and it got discovered only here in SG. Secondly, some of these foreign people pay even ridiculous amounts of money to get here, blinded by stories and promises they cannot verify.
But the other side of the coin is the local industry: if families with annual income of $30k are allowed to employ a maid I don't know what to say about this crap. Doesn't need A levels to do the Maths and see that it cannot work out. In US there are campaigns about "Made by Americans for Americans". How about "Hire your fellow country man" for Singapore? It will shake up the labour market, no doubts. It needs a change of mind to recognize that a country cannot simply outsource supposedly "low level" jobs. But looking at the White Paper trash: the government has revealed their state of mind with labeling nurses as low level jobs. I wish these buggers a night in hospital with both legs broken and an urgent need. Excrements do make a difference

 

[9V-Orion Images]

I wish these buggers a night in hospital with both legs broken and an urgent need. Excrements do make a difference

Don't worry, the top specialist doctors will personally clean them up round the clock 24/7. Arse doctors especially, will be rewarded handsomely.

 

[Halfmoon]

alot will leave when their goals are fulfilled.. my pinoy colleague plans to work 5 years and go back be queen.. dun play play..

my china fren told me, pay them $800 and they will come to sg to work... can you imagine a singaporean earning $800? What future does he sees? can he afford a hdb? a wife? family?

$800 a month.... you might just scrap through.... assuming you have a basic life with nil entertainment....

For some one who earn a few times more than $800... they will never know that feeling......

 

[albertri]

$800 a month.... you might just scrap through.... assuming you have a basic life with nil entertainment....

For some one who earn a few times more than $800... they will never know that feeling......

800 per month how to survive in SG if you dont have you're own paid flat? rental alone very high already. Also you dont need to earn a lot or more not to know 800 in SG cant go that far if you have family