Canon 500D (T1i) vs Nikon D90

[Edwin Francis]

you do know that the 500D is also a motorless body right?

Yes, well that's a good thing, since EF & EF-S lenses have built-in AF motors

MelbourneGuy, I'm glad you're going to get hands-on experience with the D90.
IMHO, the main differences between the 2 systems are more in their handling philosophies -- how the controls are arranged, which controls are easier to access, that kind of thing. It may sound strange when Ken Rockwell compared lens cap design, but it's this kind of niggling little details that can sometimes drive you crazy. Perhaps not lens cap design per se, but you know what I mean.
I prefer (and use) Canons, but there are some things about the system that I hate e.g. the exposure lock system. I also prefer the way Nikon places the main power switch concentric with the shutter release. On the whole though I prefer the way the Canon handles. I guess you'll have to decide which features and which 'shortcomings' you can live with and which you cannot. Neither system is perfect.
One other possibility you may want to consider before committing to a system -- buy a used set and try it out for a while. Perhaps a one-generation old model (Canon 450D/Nikon D80) with a standard zoom (18-55). If you find you don't like the way it handles, you can sell it off w/o losing as much as with a new body and lens.

 

[MelbourneGuy]

you do know that the 500D is also a motorless body right?

I didn't know that! But do any Canons have autofocus motors in the body? I thought all their lenses (or most) had motors in the lens. Isn't that why you would want an autofocus motor in a Nikon body...because not all Nikon lenses have an autofocus motor? Or have I got my facts wrong?

 

[MelbourneGuy]

Yes, well that's a good thing, since EF & EF-S lenses have built-in AF motors

MelbourneGuy, I'm glad you're going to get hands-on experience with the D90.
IMHO, the main differences between the 2 systems are more in their handling philosophies -- how the controls are arranged, which controls are easier to access, that kind of thing. It may sound strange when Ken Rockwell compared lens cap design, but it's this kind of niggling little details that can sometimes drive you crazy. Perhaps not lens cap design per se, but you know what I mean.
I prefer (and use) Canons, but there are some things about the system that I hate e.g. the exposure lock system. I also prefer the way Nikon places the main power switch concentric with the shutter release. On the whole though I prefer the way the Canon handles. I guess you'll have to decide which features and which 'shortcomings' you can live with and which you cannot. Neither system is perfect.
One other possibility you may want to consider before committing to a system -- buy a used set and try it out for a while. Perhaps a one-generation old model (Canon 450D/Nikon D80) with a standard zoom (18-55). If you find you don't like the way it handles, you can sell it off w/o losing as much as with a new body and lens.

Ah thanks Edwin. Could that be why the Nikon D90 is heavier when comparing with a lens attached...it has 2 motors (body and lens) instead of 1?

 

[lightning]

Dose Nikon have 35F1.4, 14F2.8, 85F1.2, 50F1.2, 24F1.4? I tried searching for some equivalant in Nikon but could not really find it. May be I am not so well verse with Nikon. But these are solid primes from Canon which are commonly used.

 

[Edwin Francis]

Ah thanks Edwin. Could that be why the Nikon D90 is heavier when comparing with a lens attached...it has 2 motors (body and lens) instead of 1?

That's probably only a part of it. After all, the Canon XXD range have no AF motor, but are still heavier than the D90. There are many other factors that contribute to the weight -- construction materials, pentaprism/pentamirror, additional features (e.g.the D90 has 2 control dials, like the Canon XXD series), etc.
I believe the D90 is higher up the ladder than the 500D -- somehow (pernaps intentionally), Nikon and Canon don't seem to compete head-to-head at the mid levels, price wise and weight wise.

 

[insanekvn]

IMO nikon produces better quality build len on their lower series while canon produce superior grade on their high end L-series lens. quote an example,

lower grade nikon vs lower grade canon
18-55kits on nikon definately looks more pro and solid than the canon toy and plastic looking len.

higher grade canon vs higher grade nikon
70-200f2.8 IS with solid white body and metal feel is confirm looks better than the nikon 70-200f2.8VR.

do you guys agree with me?

while one thing is for sure, nikon lens is always alot more higher than the canon on its pricing....

nikon 70-200 f2.8 vr also have white colour lol

 

[nigel84]

Dose Nikon have 35F1.4, 14F2.8, 85F1.2, 50F1.2, 24F1.4? I tried searching for some equivalant in Nikon but could not really find it. May be I am not so well verse with Nikon. But these are solid primes from Canon which are commonly used.

AGREED with applause. :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

I was wondering why did no one bring this up. I have to say Canon offers a very wide variety of lens to consumers. Which is very helpful to both the wallet and the photographer himself. I'd rather be spoilt for choice, then to have no choice at all. So TS, this might be another point you want to consider.

 

[enchantedream]

actually melbourneguy its more about preference when you are chosing a camera brand. For me I have a bad back too injured it when i did gymnastics when i was about 7. When i decided to switch from a PnS to a DSLR i shopped around and realise that i feel more comfortable with nikon then canon (wanted to buy canon at first). Now i got a D80 with 3 lenses and am really happy with the pictures taken with it. Its about how you take the picture and not about how good your camera is. Skill rather then the equipment (IMHO)

 

[ZerocoolAstra]

you just did stoop to his level man.

hmmmmm.... i did...!
~shucks~ I'm so ashamed of myself.
Guess I got overly emotional.
Won't happen again.

 

[ZerocoolAstra]

Dose Nikon have 35F1.4, 14F2.8, 85F1.2, 50F1.2, 24F1.4? I tried searching for some equivalant in Nikon but could not really find it. May be I am not so well verse with Nikon. But these are solid primes from Canon which are commonly used.

AGREED with applause. :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

I was wondering why did no one bring this up. I have to say Canon offers a very wide variety of lens to consumers. Which is very helpful to both the wallet and the photographer himself. I'd rather be spoilt for choice, then to have no choice at all. So TS, this might be another point you want to consider.

correct me if i'm wrong, but wasn't one of the criticisms of Canon, was them changing the lens mount about 15-20 years ago? That made all the older lenses obsolete, right?

 

[ZerocoolAstra]

I have scoliosis. It's a curvature of the spine. I look normal, and its fairly common to some degree (especially in females), but can't really carry heavy loads. I have regular chiropractic and physio treatment and do stretches and exercises every day to manage it.

I tried the 500D in store with a lens on it and it felt pretty good. I tried the D90 with a lens too and even though its only about 200g heavier it was really noticeable to me, and it would be even more so if I had to hold it for extended periods of time. I think I might actually lean more towards the Canon 500D because of the weight. The noise concern would only be at higher ISO levels, right? I would probably only shoot ISO 100-400 anyway. I know the D5000 is lighter than the D90, but I'm not really too interested in that one after reading some reviews (lack of in-body autofocus motor, screen not as nice, and Nikon's entry-level models tend to have overly graphical menus and a lot of 'menu-hunting' can be required).

All purely my opinion, no black and white of course. Do you think what I'm proposing makes sense? A kind ClubSNAPer has offered to bring me along on a photoshoot today with his D90 so I can try it out for a little while. That should help make up my mind. Thanks again for all your advice.

hmmm, I sort of agree with you to some extent. 200g does make enough of a weight difference to be significant.
My point is that this 200g difference can come from many areas. Carry an external flashgun w 4 batts: more than 200g. Carry a spare lens, even a 50mm f1.8, about 100+g difference.
So now the point to consider is: Is it worthwhile to delve into the DSLR realm, considering you have such concerns with weight?

 

[MelbourneGuy]

hmmm, I sort of agree with you to some extent. 200g does make enough of a weight difference to be significant.
My point is that this 200g difference can come from many areas. Carry an external flashgun w 4 batts: more than 200g. Carry a spare lens, even a 50mm f1.8, about 100+g difference.
So now the point to consider is: Is it worthwhile to delve into the DSLR realm, considering you have such concerns with weight?

Understood. And of course, with my condition, every decision has to consider weight. I'd only ever carry one lens at a time. If I was ambling around I'd carry a walkaround lens (if Canon, it'd be the EF-S 17-85 I think). If I knew beforehand I'd be shooting something different, I'd take the appropriate lens. I'm not looking at flashes yet. If I did it'd be for indoors anyway so probably just around the house unless I'm going somewhere, in which case I'd put it in a backpack of some sort and carry it across both shoulders or travel by car. Canon has a new basic flash (the 270EX which only takes 2 AA batteries) but I have no idea how good it is.

I think now is a bad time to buy a Canon in the introductory to enthusiast range. The 50D and the 500D have been widely criticised for their noise. I agree with the reviews that Canon have taken a marketing approach to these cameras ("more is better") at the sacrifice of quality. Interesting to note that canonrumors.com says that the 60D will still be 15MP but have a much better sensor and noise control using Digic V. I see this as an admission that they got it wrong with the 50D and 500D. So I guess if that is really an issue for me I either get the Nikon D90 or go back to the Canon 450D to save some cash and then upgrade when something better comes along.

 

[ZerocoolAstra]

ok I think you're letting this "noise" issue affect your decision-making process too much.

The difference in noise control would only come into play at high ISOs. My D80 suffers from this badly, compared with the D90.
But at low ISOs (eg. 200, 250, 320) I feel like the noise levels are indistinguishable.

If you're taking landscapes (be it day or night) or photos in bright sunlight, this issue does not come into play.

 

[MelbourneGuy]

ok I think you're letting this "noise" issue affect your decision-making process too much.

The difference in noise control would only come into play at high ISOs. My D80 suffers from this badly, compared with the D90.
But at low ISOs (eg. 200, 250, 320) I feel like the noise levels are indistinguishable.

If you're taking landscapes (be it day or night) or photos in bright sunlight, this issue does not come into play.

Oh. Sorry. I just assumed a noisy sensor = noisy images. So within say ISO 100-800 you wouldn't really think that's something to factor into my consideration process?

 

[Ouverture]

I am neither a Canon or Nikon user, but I have extensively considered D90 and 450D when I was shopping for a DSLR.

Firstly, you must wake yourself up to realise what is the purpose of moving into DSLR. For me, it's to take good quality pictures of my son as compared to PNS. I know I have wasted about 2 years taking pictures with my PNS which rendered at least 70% of the images useless.

In the end, I got myself a Sony A300 solely for it's best implementation of LiveView AF which is what I need to help me compose and snap pictures of my son easily and my wife can use it as easy as a PNS as well. And seriously, I will only need to shoot from ISO100-800 max which is more than enough with my Sigma30 and I do not or seldom print anything larger than 4R anyway.

Many say Sony has the worst noise control, only a few lenses to choose from and expensive compared to the rest.

But for me, the useful feature that I need wins it over the rest.

So it voice down to what you need, rather than comparing specs side by side as it will never work, new DSLRs come out every year and there's no end to newer specs.

One more thing i noticed is when u have a lousy PNS, you wished to have a better DSLR. And when you have DSLR, you would want to have a compact PNS for light travelling, so in the end, you end up with both...or more...

 

[mynameisgreg]

Well said Ouverture. actually you could consider the Canon G10 or the leica equivalent. theyre light and give excellent photos. The DSLRs, no matter how light, are still not light enough for you to be able to carry them around for a couple of hours without feeling the strain of their weight.

If youre concerned about the noise issue, go and take a look at sample photos. there's a thread in the canon discussion topic with them. I also hope youre already or seriously considering strenthening your back muscles too

 

[ggodetucsamoht]

Why the need to attack me on a personal level?
You are allowed to make such sweeping statements like "while one thing is for sure, nikon lens is always alot more higher than the canon on its pricing...." as though you are some kind of market expert. I can also ask who you think you are? This will become some kind of personal attack. I don't want to stoop to that level.

I tried a Canon DSLR before, and for reasons I will not go into, I decided to go Nikon when I got my first DSLR. But if my friend asks me if Canon makes good DSLRs, I won't say "all their DSLRs are lousy" because that statement is not true. Just that I had a bad experience with them.

I repeat my point, which is that in a Newbies forum, when people are seeking advice and other newbies are also reading, don't make groundless statements without proper evidence.
I focused on the word 'ALWAYS' because it changes the meaning of your statement.

what ever you say, got nothing to do with me. my simple thoughts is just let TS aware of price like between nikon and canon, dont understand why you want to go so deep in it. come on guy, pay attention to my concern here for TS.

then in this case you are not helping TS for a constructive comments. so simple thing and you make it so complicated....

 

[MelbourneGuy]

what ever you say, got nothing to do with me. my simple thoughts is just let TS aware of price like between nikon and canon, dont understand why you want to go so deep in it. come on guy, now everyone will know you are too direct hurting the canon equipment.

then in this case you are not helping TS for a constructive comments. so simple thing and you make it so complicated....

It's ok, I appreciate everybody's advice who is prepared to help out a newbie. A good group of well-meaning people here at ClubSNAP

 

[Neo]

I didn't know that! But do any Canons have autofocus motors in the body? I thought all their lenses (or most) had motors in the lens. Isn't that why you would want an autofocus motor in a Nikon body...because not all Nikon lenses have an autofocus motor? Or have I got my facts wrong?

You got your facts right. Don't get confused by brand zealots. Someone pointed out that Nikon D5000 doesn't have a motor in the body, which kinds of limits the amount of lenses it can use. Then someone else says that Canon also doesn't have a motor, which has totally different implication (and only serves to confuse). You are right all this time - Canon doesn't need a motor in the body because all the Canon lenses have built-in motors.

 

[ggodetucsamoht]

It's ok, I appreciate everybody's advice who is prepared to help out a newbie. A good group of well-meaning people here at ClubSNAP

no worry. which body are you going towards till now?