Bokeh Comparison

[jeff7id]

Regarding d.o.f. calculator, I understand that as long as shooting in the same distance, same location/position, same lightning, and same DSLR body.

For example, if shooting at same focal length and same exposure :
50 mm and f/5.6 and 1/60 sec and ISO 200 (manual exposure).

18-55 f/3.5-f/5.6
50 mm f/1.8
24-70 f/2.8
18-200 f/3.5-f/5.6
16-85 f/3.5-f/5.6

All 5 lenses give same amount of d.o.f. (depth of field)

But the Bokeh is completely different.

Looking for a method to measure the quality of Bokeh.
A method that is objective, not subjective :sweat:

 

[tirimasu]

if i remember correctly,
sensor size in the body do affect bokeh.

super wrong!!!!!

 

[pinholecam]

Regarding d.o.f. calculator, I understand that as long as shooting in the same distance, same location/position, same lightning, and same DSLR body.

For example, if shooting at same focal length and same exposure :
50 mm and f/5.6 and 1/60 sec and ISO 200 (manual exposure).

18-55 f/3.5-f/5.6
50 mm f/1.8
24-70 f/2.8
18-200 f/3.5-f/5.6
16-85 f/3.5-f/5.6

All 5 lenses give same amount of d.o.f. (depth of field)

But the Bokeh is completely different.

Looking for a method to measure the quality of Bokeh.
A method that is objective, not subjective :sweat:

THIS! is one of those mysteries of the universe.
Only revealed to a selected few (ie. those with the $$$ to buy and try).

Pleasing; Creamy; Smooth; etc all are very subjective. Not uncommon for it to be wash in snobbish hogwash.
I my case I can only make out the really bad 'confusing' looking ones.

 

[bigpond]

Regarding d.o.f. calculator, I understand that as long as shooting in the same distance, same location/position, same lightning, and same DSLR body.

For example, if shooting at same focal length and same exposure :
50 mm and f/5.6 and 1/60 sec and ISO 200 (manual exposure).

18-55 f/3.5-f/5.6
50 mm f/1.8
24-70 f/2.8
18-200 f/3.5-f/5.6
16-85 f/3.5-f/5.6

All 5 lenses give same amount of d.o.f. (depth of field)

But the Bokeh is completely different.

Looking for a method to measure the quality of Bokeh.
A method that is objective, not subjective :sweat:

In theory, yes. But -- much to my surprise -- in practise, the lens design matters in rendering out of focus areas (not talking about bokeh, but just how blur the background appears). Again, subjective here, but I've compared two zooms, 17-55 f2.8 and 16-85 on a D200. Both lenses set to 55mm f5, camera to subject distance about 10 feet. Interestingly the 17-55 is able to deliver a blurrer background, such that the subject is more isolated from the background. The 16-85 on the other hand, behaves just like a kit lens, with a rather extended depth of field. So, not only is the quality of bokeh less pleasing, but the 16-85 is also not able to acheive the same background blur as the 17-55 (everything else the same). I believe that's one of the reasons why landscape people love this lens (easy to get everything sharp) but the 17-55 is more people/portrait oriented.

 

[aspenx]

No idea what the TS wants anymore.

And as redwine has mentioned, if you need more DOF, just stop down.

Bokeh != OOF
In other words, superior bokeh does NOT mean more OOF.

Please, just go out and shoot. You can get good bokeh with the 55-200mm kit lens if you try hard enough, find the right light and right ratio of distances. Of course it will not be as good as the specialty lenses which you obviously have to pay more for!

 

[Rashkae]

Actually I believe the TS knows exactly what he wants... He's asking (correctly) which of those lenses will give the "better" bokeh.

 

[aspenx]

Actually I believe the TS knows exactly what he wants... He's asking (correctly) which of those lenses will give the "better" bokeh.

Okay. I'm still a bit confused so I shall maybe read the posts again.

Hope someone (Nikkor or Canon or Leica or Zeiss) create a special lens that has bokeh quality at f/1.4, but the d.o.f. is thick.

Because that’s what we want to achieve for in the portrait photography. Nobody want the picture has superior BOKEH (soft creamy blur background color) but the picture focus at nose or ears (depend on your luck where the auto focus locks on) :sweat:

I think I'm starting to understand what TS means. My bad.

Anyways, just try out the 85mm f/1.4D at f/4 or something for yourself. It will still be sufficiently creamy yet very sharp features if you use it correctly. Same goes for the DC lens.

Don't take our word for it. Try them out. That should be more fun (and convincing) than just reading reviews etc.

 

[third3rdwheel]

Okay. I'm still a bit confused so I shall maybe read the posts again.



I think I'm starting to understand what TS means. My bad.

Anyways, just try out the 85mm f/1.4D at f/4 or something for yourself. It will still be sufficiently creamy yet very sharp features if you use it correctly. Same goes for the DC lens.

Don't take our word for it. Try them out. That should be more fun (and convincing) than just reading reviews etc.

Give Leica a try

 

[TheTrailblazer]

Here are 2 examples.

Sigma AF 50mm f/1.4 EX DG HSM

Canon EF 135mm f/2 L USM

 

[ZerocoolAstra]

Give Leica a try

I'm sorry bro, but I don't think this photo makes a good case for Leica. The flower is not that sharp, and neither is the bokeh smooth and pleasing.

 

[jeff7id]

Give Leica a try

...

Hi third3rdwheel,
Greetings for Leica users here !
Which lens did you use ? Is it Leica 35mm f/2 Summicron-M Aspherical ?

Here are 2 examples.
...
Sigma AF 50mm f/1.4 EX DG HSM

...
Canon EF 135mm f/2 L USM

Bro Trailblazer,
Thank you for posting so nice pictures. She is so cute. Is she your daughter ?

 

[third3rdwheel]

I'm sorry bro, but I don't think this photo makes a good case for Leica. The flower is not that sharp, and neither is the bokeh smooth and pleasing.

How about this? Will not be super sharp bec it is scanned from negative....

 

[third3rdwheel]

Hi third3rdwheel,
Greetings for Leica users here !
Which lens did you use ? Is it Leica 35mm f/2 Summicron-M Aspherical ?


Summilux 75 mm F1.4 pre-asph

 

[jeff7id]

I think the Leica Summicron 35mm F2 King of Bokeh is :thumbsup:

Am not really a SLR person, not too sure about SLR lenses.

Looks like the Leica Summicron 35mm F2 King of Bokeh is really the King, because Bro Kenrockwell made comparison with Nikon 35mm f/2 and said that Nikon lens like a dog.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/leica/35mm-f2-asph.htm

"The Nikon 35mm f/2 AF-D is a dog by comparison. If you're looking closely, it's real soft in the corners at most apertures." :cry:

 

[Rashkae]

Looks like the Leica Summicron 35mm F2 King of Bokeh is really the King,

135mm STF for the win.

 

[aspenx]

Give Leica a try

I don't have any body that can take the Leica thread mount.

With my Vivitar 135mm f/2.8 Komine-made close focusing lens:

Okay. It's not really fair because it's a macro shot.

Nikon 135mm f/2D DC at f/2 and rear defocusing at f/64 so it's not meant to be sharp:

No real good examples to show because I have been too busy to shoot.

 

[ZerocoolAstra]

How about this? Will not be super sharp bec it is scanned from negative....

ahhh, I like this bokeh :thumbsup:
Ok I didn't know you scanned from negative. That might explain the lack of sharpness. This example is sharp though.

 

[ZerocoolAstra]

As a hobbyist, it seems like an extraordinarily large amount of EXTRA money to pay to get a lens with "nicer" bokeh, over one with just average bokeh.
This bokeh thread is poisonous! I'm staying away!

 

[aspenx]

"The Nikon 35mm f/2 AF-D is a dog by comparison. If you're looking closely, it's real soft in the corners at most apertures." :cry:

It doesn't even have CRC. You might want to consider the 35mm f/1.4 AiS instead:

The bokeh is not everyone's cup of tea though. But it's at least a few times cheaper than the Leica.

 

[zcf]

You should try the Sony/Minolta 135mm STF. Bokeh king.

They should really try out the STF (Smooth Transition Focus) to understand how smooth the bokeh can be, without those pentagonal, heptagonal solid hard edge bolder on the bokeh.

Taken by STF..

:lovegrin: :lovegrin:

Review of STF lens.
http://www.dyxum.com/columns/articles/lenses/SAL-135F28/Sony-AF-135-STF-SAL-135F28_review.asp