Yet another "recommend me a prosumer" thread

[thechinesebonbon]

Hello First post here.

As the title suggests, I'm trying to get myself a prosumer, I have been using a canon ixus i(so long ago!) and occasionally borrow my sister's canon ixus 90.Why prosumer as opposed to entry level DSLR is because I don't think I'm ready to buy into any system yet, I just want to fiddle with things, learn more about photography first before I decide if I really want to commit. I also doubt at this point that I would know what I'm looking for as far as cams and lenses go to make any good decisions. So...

Budget: As low as possible (Haha) though I might be okay with anything up to about 800ish.

Image quality is my main concern. Don't really care much for HD videos and what's not.
I would need it to be able to take clear, sharp, fast candids in dim light conditions ie concerts and parties. I need something wide angle because I'll be taking a lot of architecture/structural(like mountains) stuff as well. In that vein, clear pics of faraway subjects also a must. Clear,sharp macro shots also needed. These are the stuff I know for sure i'll be taking though I might grow to want to take other things as well. I won't be blowing it to anything larger than A4(even A4 sized is rare) so crazy megapixels are for now, not needed.

I need to have control for things like ISO, shutter time, aperture, flash and white settings but I also need a good auto focus for the times where the cam is just going to serve as a PNS.Can the lovely people here suggest what I may need to look out for in terms of specs? Or better yet, a camera.

Poked around a bit and I've got a few questions.

1) What's the difference between a rangefinder type prosumer and a crazy zooming prosumer?

2) Will I ever need to use the electronic view finder? Considering that I can actually see what I'm going to take on the LCD.

3)Can I add on extra stuff ie filters, lenses(fish eye!), flash, anything like that, to have a larger control of what I'm doing.

4)On a prosumer cam that is only used to take pics, is there a real difference between a CCD sensor and a CMOS sensor?

A few models that I think might work out to be what I'm looking for. (Open to other cams as well)
Canon S5, Canon SX10, Canon SX1.
Besides the LCD size, are there any real difference between the SX10 and the SX1? I'm not taking videos so the HD video thing doesn't matter. Would a S5 be good enough? The thing I'm concerned about canon is the noise reduction, it tends to blur out pictures and make them less sharp. Also, from reviews, it seems like anything taken above ISO 200 has significant noise.

Another really fun looking camera is the Sony DSC-HX1 though I'm not sure if it's more gimmicks than anything. The paranomic feature seems like something that I would be using often enough and it looks like it's going to be fast and do reasonably well in parties/concerts conditions. But still, there isn't any test shots so I'm undecided.

If you read till this part, THANK YOU for taking the time.
For anyone that replied, THANK YOU as well. :lovegrin:

 

[coolin]

lumix lx3 is very popular. sharp , handy , wide angle and paired with a raynox attatchment i've seen great macros. i think its in your budget.
but the zoom range isn't great so you should try it out before considering it.

 

[scorpiocjs]

Im using the Canon Powershot SX10IS. It is a great camera with the super zoom and the image stabilizer has improved so much from my previous S2. Video little concern. If u talk abt lens addition, there are some 3rd parties lens, can search under McGill website. Overall, it is much lower in cost compared to dSLR.

 

[thechinesebonbon]

coolin: thanks for the recommendation! I tried searching for some of the test shots as well as consumer shots for the Lumix and yeah, I agree that they have pretty neat macro shots but because I'm taking objects that are rather far away(which i can't get near physically) the short zoom range wouldn't cut it for me.

scorpiocjs: how are the shots like when you take them at maximum zoom? is it still sharp and clear? from what I read, there's no thread on the sx10 and the third parties one so far can only support filters due to the zoom. I like pictures taken with fisheye so I'm hoping that the prosumer will allowed some form of fisheye pictures to be taken.

 

[patriotolo]

There are certainly filters, wide angle adapters and such stuff available for most prosumer cameras out there, but it all depends on the brand and model, some brands are well supported with accessories and some are not. You could do a little research online as well as at the shops when you actually go down to try it out.

for CCD and CMOS, as far as I understand, there is almost no difference between these two, except that they are completely different technology in terms of capturing light using semiconductors. In general CCDs are cheaper to manufacture but produce noise across the board when lighting conditions are bad, whereas CMOS is more expensive to manufacture, but noise problems would be isolated to individual pixels depending on the intensity of light each pixel captures. to an average user, there is absolutely no difference between these two, it is just like D80 and D90, both are very capable of producing high quality photos even though D80 uses CCD sensor and D90 uses CMOS sensor (of course we are not talking about the difference due to the number of pixels on the sensor itself).

 

[teebs]

coolin: thanks for the recommendation! I tried searching for some of the test shots as well as consumer shots for the Lumix and yeah, I agree that they have pretty neat macro shots but because I'm taking objects that are rather far away(which i can't get near physically) the short zoom range wouldn't cut it for me.

scorpiocjs: how are the shots like when you take them at maximum zoom? is it still sharp and clear? from what I read, there's no thread on the sx10 and the third parties one so far can only support filters due to the zoom. I like pictures taken with fisheye so I'm hoping that the prosumer will allowed some form of fisheye pictures to be taken.

I very much doubt that the fisheye lens adaptor(e.g. Raynox) can be used on the SX series because of their construction where any lens accessories have to be attached to the lens itself.

 

[thechinesebonbon]

^is it a cannon thing or any megazoom cameras won't be having it as well?

adaptors/filters/new lenses aren't really included in most reviews. at least not the ones i've been reading(cnetasia and dpreview) so I'm not sure if they would have it.

also, if an adaptor works for say S5, does it means that it will definitely work for the sx10 or sx1?

 

[thechinesebonbon]

Another question, with the things that i'm looking for, would it be better to go with a S5 or SX10 or SX1? Kind of just narrowed it down to these. Not sure if I should wait for the Sony one to come out.

S5 because I think I might really like to play around with the fisheye thing. I've got a fisheye2 lomo and it was great fun playing around with that. but as usual, worried about image quality. so yeah, which one.:dunno:

 

[scorpiocjs]

The sad thing abt SX10IS or even the SX1IS is that they took away the part with the lens attachment., very silly abt Canon. There is no fisheye lens that I can find that can match the SX10IS. U can try this website for filters and the Raynox macro. http://www.lensmateonline.com/store/

As if to consider S5 or SX10IS. What I cay say it's a technological change.. the usual stuff lar.. megapixel, new features with i-contrast, of coz new stuff always sounds better to have.. S5 is abt 3yrs old liao? SX1S has no meaning unless u go for HD video. The long screen also looked ugly to me.

Hope it helps

 

[scorpiocjs]

Oh sorry. Din answer yr question on the max. zoom. Since it's a optical zoom, there is no compromise of the quality of the picture. In normal gd daylight settings, it is pretty gd. But from my experience, in low light setting, the focusing is really an issue.

 

[Reportage]

$800 is possible for a 2nd hand dslr and a general purpose lens.

 

[simpo]

I recommend the panasonic lumix GI...

 

[aryanto]

I recommend the panasonic lumix GI...

you mean G1?

 

[thechinesebonbon]

$800 is possible for a 2nd hand dslr and a general purpose lens.

i tried to dig around in the personal classifieds section but didn't see anything at all ):

 

[thechinesebonbon]

The sad thing abt SX10IS or even the SX1IS is that they took away the part with the lens attachment., very silly abt Canon. There is no fisheye lens that I can find that can match the SX10IS. U can try this website for filters and the Raynox macro. http://www.lensmateonline.com/store/

As if to consider S5 or SX10IS. What I cay say it's a technological change.. the usual stuff lar.. megapixel, new features with i-contrast, of coz new stuff always sounds better to have.. S5 is abt 3yrs old liao? SX1S has no meaning unless u go for HD video. The long screen also looked ugly to me.

Hope it helps

i agree. i don't need the video at all and the long screen looks ugly! but it's faster than the sx10. 4fps compared to 1.4fps. considering that i'm taking candids a lot, seems like i might need it. not sure though.

what about the sony h1? should i wait?

 

[thechinesebonbon]

I recommend the panasonic lumix GI...

thanks! ill go read up on it.

 

[teebs]

i tried to dig around in the personal classifieds section but didn't see anything at all ):

Maybe you didn't dig hard enough?

$800 would be enough to get you a second hand Canon 400D + Kit Lens.

But if you want to use the prosumer with the Fisheye adaptor, you have no choice but to get the Canon S5 or Canon G10. Otherwise, I think you can get Panasonic FZ28 as Raynox has the adaptors for this camera also.

You can check the Raynox Website for more information:

http://www.raynox.co.jp/english/digital/egdigital.html

 

[Galdor]

You can get a brand new Sony A200 with kit lens for $800+ if you do not need the live view function.

 

[ZerocoolAstra]

hehehe well you haven't been searching hard enough!
just searched through canon personal classifieds. Saw someone selling 400D + 18-200. It's within your budget too!

note: I'm NOT the seller!

The cheapest combo is something like entry-level DSLR + kit lens + a telephoto zoom like 55-200. That gives you the focal range 18-200, albeit using 2 lenses instead of 1.

Anyway regarding your recommendation for prosumer (since that's the category you mentioned), maybe you can look for Panasonic Lumix FZ** series or Canon's G* series?

 

[thechinesebonbon]

teebs, Geldor, ZerocoolAstra: O: someone here needs an education, obviously. thank you, thank you, thank you. more digging awaits

^anyway, I understand(from the why a prosumer thread) that the cannon G series works like a rangefinder of the DSLRs. What does that means and how does it differ from the megazoom variety of prosumers?