Which SLR/ lens combo??? Help please...


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Jun 9, 2009
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#1
Hi, I've been labouring over this for a week now...reaching the endgame

I'm buying my first DSLR. I'm working and living in Thailand so it's not that cheap for me to buy photo gear

I went round a bunch of shops today...here's the best options as I perceive them:
(prices converted to british pounds at the end of the message : )

1) Nikon 40x (it's the only D40 I've found in Thailand)
18000 baht (body only) ... (add about 30,000 for VR 18-200)
(no bag or memory card etc...but the owner will give me discount when I have the cash in her face...I'll get it for about 46,000)

Total price 47,000............( or could get a kit lens for much less)

2) D60 w/kit lens 19,000 (Bag, 4GB card etc...)

Total price 19,000...

2(a) D60 kit plus 18-200VR (it's 30,000 maybe a bit less)

Total price: 49,000 ................but 2 lenses.

3) D90 with kit lens 18-105 (bag etc..)
Total price: 45,000

4) D90 with no kit lens but VR18-200 (bag etc..)
Total price: 54,000

5) Canon 500D - has ok vid 720p 30fps - body only -
with Tamron 17-50 f.2.8 lens
and Canon 55-250 Zoom lens
`
The guy in the recommended very reputable and cluttered pro-style shop understood my reservations (those I'd read about online) about the stock 500D lens and personally recommended these two as being well sharp and having optimim coverage for my needs...(includes 4GB card ...bag etc...)

Total price: 49,400baht

He also said the service for Nikon Thailand is really bad if things go wrong with your camera...he's experienced it a lot he said...he said from his customers' perspective Canon is a better deal..and is cheaper.

He did concede that Nikon product wise is Number 1 but Canon also Number 1 (!) but fix things with no questions asked...

...19,000 baht is 344 British pounds
...45,000 baht is 813 British pounds
...49,000 Baht is 886 British pounds
...54,000 baht is 976 British pounds

Basically I can afford any of the packages but obviously want to get VALUE... image quality and portability are primary concerns...

is Ken Rockwell to be believed and I should plump for the basic one...D60 kit (I can't find a D40) or should I bite the bullet and go for D90?
Or perhaps I go for the Canon 450 like on the Melbourne guy thread?
Although tempted by the latest technology, I am generally a minimalist for the sake of portability.

Is having 3 autofocus points a problem?

...I thought the point of having a DSLR was be more creatively involved yourself (for me it is why I am upgrading from PnS) ..and of course better images.

Any thoughts on the options above would be greatly appreciated.

cheers

Bloodsonnet
 

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Shen siung

Senior Member
May 21, 2008
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#2
Hi, I've been labouring over this for a week now...reaching the endgame

I'm buying my first DSLR. I'm working and living in Thailand so it's not that cheap for me to buy photo gear

I went round a bunch of shops today...here's the best options as I perceive them:
(prices converted to british pounds at the end of the message : )

1) Nikon 40x (it's the only D40 I've found in Thailand)
18000 baht (body only) ... (add about 30,000 for VR 18-200)
(no bag or memory card etc...but the owner will give me discount when I have the cash in her face...I'll get it for about 46,000)

Total price 47,000............( or could get a kit lens for much less)

2) D60 w/kit lens 19,000 (Bag, 4GB card etc...)

Total price 19,000...

2(a) D60 kit plus 18-200VR (it's 30,000 maybe a bit less)

Total price: 49,000 ................but 2 lenses.

3) D90 with kit lens 18-105 (bag etc..)
Total price: 45,000

4) D90 with no kit lens but VR18-200 (bag etc..)
Total price: 54,000

5) Canon 500D - has ok vid 720p 30fps - body only -
with Tamron 17-50 f.2.8 lens
and Canon 55-250 Zoom lens
`
The guy in the recommended very reputable and cluttered pro-style shop understood my reservations (those I'd read about online) about the stock 500D lens and personally recommended these two as being well sharp and having optimim coverage for my needs...(includes 4GB card ...bag etc...)

Total price: 49,400baht

He also said the service for Nikon Thailand is really bad if things go wrong with your camera...he's experienced it a lot he said...he said from his customers' perspective Canon is a better deal..and is cheaper.

He did concede that Nikon product wise is Number 1 but Canon also Number 1 (!) but fix things with no questions asked...

...19,000 baht is 344 British pounds
...45,000 baht is 813 British pounds
...49,000 Baht is 886 British pounds
...54,000 baht is 976 British pounds

Basically I can afford any of the packages but obviously want to get VALUE... image quality and portability are primary concerns...

is Ken Rockwell to be believed and I should plump for the basic one...D60 kit (I can't find a D40) or should I bite the bullet and go for D90?
Or perhaps I go for the Canon 450 like on the Melbourne guy thread?
Although tempted by the latest technology, I am generally a minimalist for the sake of portability.

Is having 3 autofocus points a problem?

...I thought the point of having a DSLR was be more creatively involved yourself (for me it is why I am upgrading from PnS) ..and of course better images.

Any thoughts on the options above would be greatly appreciated.

cheers

Bloodsonnet
Ok. A few Question for you
1. How long have you been using PnS? You sure you like photography?
2. Do you usually shoot video using your PnS
3. Do you like to take photo with subject at far away? Like animal in zoo, or street candid (like you go to street just take picture of those pass by
4. Which PnS you use currently
 

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Yoricko

Senior Member
May 25, 2008
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#3
What do you want to capture with your dSLR? Sports? Nature? People? Insects?

Anyways, from Kenrockbells website, he'd probably reccommend a D40 or D5000. Save the extra money on flashes/lenses/holiday.
The 18-105mm kit can cover a lot of stuff, so the 18-200mm isn't really necessary, unless you're handicapped or really need the 200mm.
 

Jun 9, 2009
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#4
1. How long have you been using PnS? You sure you like photography?

10 years...I like it a lot : )

2. Do you usually shoot video using your PnS

yeah but mostly to record guitar riffs on the fly...D90 vid looks pretty flawed for fully doing proper filming...I'm interested in it though. I was thinking of prioritising lenses right now and upgrading the body when HD vid has been properly perfected maybe (D91?)

3. Do you like to take photo with subject at far away? Like animal in zoo, or street candid (like you go to street just take picture of those pass by

I like getting candid street shots....and capturing action from the outside...unnoticed...yeah.

4. Which PnS you use currently

I have a Fuji Finepix Z1 ...it's small...5 megapix...good for nights out.
 

Jun 9, 2009
10
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#5
I'm interested in capturing action...B&W portraiture...I like the mega close crisp portraits where you see every wrinkle and hair...I like street scenes...candid shots of people. landscapes...architecture....concerts.

I want to explore
 

kervin13

New Member
Jan 20, 2009
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ulu pandan
#6
Hi there.. IMHO if i'm in ur position, i will get d90 n 18-105 because:
1. able to AF with non built-in AF motor lens
2. able to record short video
3. 18-105 is quite a good lens for starter
anyway, i'm also new in photography and these is basically my own opinion.. cheers..
 

Jun 9, 2009
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#7
hmmm...starting to think that way myself.
 

chalib

Senior Member
Oct 4, 2007
2,072
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#8
From the offer that you get from the shop, 500D would be the best value as you get 2 lenses (both are good lenses and you get one fast lens)

And Canon after-sales-service is also much better than N in thailand

The last thing you need to consider is the camera handling itself, have you tried it in the shop?
 

Jun 9, 2009
10
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#9
I have tried them both...I prefer the feel of the Nikon I think but it is slightly heavier.
I could probably use both happily..though the D60 is nice and small and light...

How much better is the IQ on the D90 over the D60?
For the difference I could buy a pretty decent electric guitar...(even though I have 3 already : )

Guitarist and photographers I think share a common disease: G.A.S. (Gear Acquisition Syndrome)
 

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agentxq49

New Member
Jun 1, 2009
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Sembawang
#10
Hi! I'm new to DSLR too, and only recently bought one, the d5000. I've used the D90 and D60 before pior to buying d5000. Ofcourse, i love the D90, with the 18-200mm lens with it. If you're on a budget like me, you should go for d5000 or d60 and buy a collection of lens, then upgrade when a successor of d90 comes out. But if you can buy the d90, do so! Theres one on the forums that is going at 1.2k sgd for body only.

I would suggest getting the option 2a + accessories like your dry cab, filters, lens, flashes etc, or just going for option 4 and build up from there over time.
 

jaRv1s

New Member
Jun 5, 2009
611
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0
Singapore
#11
What do you want to capture with your dSLR? Sports? Nature? People? Insects?

Anyways, from Kenrockbells website, he'd probably reccommend a D40 or D5000. Save the extra money on flashes/lenses/holiday.
The 18-105mm kit can cover a lot of stuff, so the 18-200mm isn't really necessary, unless you're handicapped or really need the 200mm.
kindly forget about this K notwell... every new camera comes out he would say D40 better cheaper... lucky Nikon never take his words... else every Nikon users got only one body to choose... that's D40, not even D40x...
 

Shen siung

Senior Member
May 21, 2008
2,597
0
36
#12
1. How long have you been using PnS? You sure you like photography?

10 years...I like it a lot : )

2. Do you usually shoot video using your PnS

yeah but mostly to record guitar riffs on the fly...D90 vid looks pretty flawed for fully doing proper filming...I'm interested in it though. I was thinking of prioritising lenses right now and upgrading the body when HD vid has been properly perfected maybe (D91?)

3. Do you like to take photo with subject at far away? Like animal in zoo, or street candid (like you go to street just take picture of those pass by

I like getting candid street shots....and capturing action from the outside...unnoticed...yeah.

4. Which PnS you use currently

I have a Fuji Finepix Z1 ...it's small...5 megapix...good for nights out.
OK, seems you quite sure to go into DSLR
And if video is not your priority, then I would suggest yo get Canon
Get a 450D, start play around.
And if you prioritize lenses, then get a Tamron 17-50 f2.8, good image quality. Then, add another of the following (only one is enough)

1. EFS 55-250 - with IS, but not constant aperture (around SGD400, depends store)
2. Sigma 50-150 f2.8 more expensive, should be about 2 times the price of the above (around SGD1000)
3. Tokina 50-135 f2.8

Just my own opinion.
 

Dec 28, 2008
358
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0
Singapore
#13
i think whether video is priority or not, that shud not be the factor to decide if TS shud go for Canon or not. it should instead which feels better and more comfortable in his hands.
 

ZerocoolAstra

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2008
9,522
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0
rainy Singapore
#14
Hi TS:

The prices quoted you in Thailand are a little on the high side, but still not frighteningly terrible.
For example, a D90 kit (w 18-105) is going for under S$1700 (40000 THB) here.

Firstly, you need to decide on a brand, then a particular camera body.
Ergonomics is #1, in my opinion. You'll be doing lots and lots of adjusting this and that in between shots, so if you frustrated by the menu or button layout, it can spoil your appreciation of your gear. You really have to try using the cameras to decide. Don't rule out the other brands (sony, pentax, panasonic, olympus, etc) as well.

Ken Rockwell, though widely-condemned in some circles, has a certain point about trumpeting the Nikon D40. WAYYY to many "photographers" bring out their expensive gear, then talk about specifications to justify their expenditure (eg. megapixels, auto-focus points, etc). In fact, they don't know how to fully utilize their own equipment. eg. they may not even know how to meter a scene for the correct exposure, etc.
But of course you shouldn't just read his comments as the gospel... :)
 

Jun 9, 2009
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#15
Thanks for the comments : )

I have this slight feeling of distrust for Canon ...with their quest for more and more megapixels/ flashy specs etc... seems shallow.
Nikon seems classier to me...

I like the "less is more" philosophy....do I really need any more than 3 AF points? Is that actually in real terms a limiting thing or just a convenience issue?

From comparisons of IQ between d60 and d90 ...d60 seems saturated whereas d90 looks naturalistic...can't I just compensate for this easily enough? (as Ken Rockwell states he does with d40)

I think I'm edging towards D90...couple of questions:

is the image quality really so much better on D90 than D40/D60?

how important is it to have so many AF points?...can't I focus lock (like my PnS) then compose the shot whilst maintaining the focus on the original object in the centre as I move the camera off centre?

is D90 vid function ok or just a waste of time?

I found out from my Japanese Student that Canon means "buddha" in Japanese... cool.

Is IQ on the EOS 450 better than 500D (less cluttered sensor?)
 

Yoricko

Senior Member
May 25, 2008
1,118
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36
Singapore
#16
Thanks for the comments : )

I have this slight feeling of distrust for Canon ...with their quest for more and more megapixels/ flashy specs etc... seems shallow.
Nikon seems classier to me...

I like the "less is more" philosophy....do I really need any more than 3 AF points? Is that actually in real terms a limiting thing or just a convenience issue?

From comparisons of IQ between d60 and d90 ...d60 seems saturated whereas d90 looks naturalistic...can't I just compensate for this easily enough? (as Ken Rockwell states he does with d40)

I think I'm edging towards D90...couple of questions:

is the image quality really so much better on D90 than D40/D60?

how important is it to have so many AF points?...can't I focus lock (like my PnS) then compose the shot whilst maintaining the focus on the original object in the centre as I move the camera off centre?

is D90 vid function ok or just a waste of time?

I found out from my Japanese Student that Canon means "buddha" in Japanese... cool.

Is IQ on the EOS 450 better than 500D (less cluttered sensor?)
Image quality on digital cameras = 75% lens, 25% body.
D90 and the D5000 have newer and better image processors, thus producing slightly better colours, cleaner images and auto-focusing algorithms.

For me, I don't really see the use in having so many AF points, but thats me.

If you want to video often, the D90 Video capability is a waste of time.

450D > 500D? Strange.
 

ZerocoolAstra

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2008
9,522
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0
rainy Singapore
#17
Thanks for the comments : )

I have this slight feeling of distrust for Canon ...with their quest for more and more megapixels/ flashy specs etc... seems shallow.
Nikon seems classier to me...

I like the "less is more" philosophy....do I really need any more than 3 AF points? Is that actually in real terms a limiting thing or just a convenience issue?

From comparisons of IQ between d60 and d90 ...d60 seems saturated whereas d90 looks naturalistic...can't I just compensate for this easily enough? (as Ken Rockwell states he does with d40)

I think I'm edging towards D90...couple of questions:

is the image quality really so much better on D90 than D40/D60?

how important is it to have so many AF points?...can't I focus lock (like my PnS) then compose the shot whilst maintaining the focus on the original object in the centre as I move the camera off centre?

is D90 vid function ok or just a waste of time?

I found out from my Japanese Student that Canon means "buddha" in Japanese... cool.

Is IQ on the EOS 450 better than 500D (less cluttered sensor?)
hahaha don't say like that la... It's all marketing. Both Canon and Nikon (and the others too) make good cameras. Nothing to 'distrust' about them. They wouldn't survive in this industry for so long selling inferior products.

The increased number of AF points has a certain advantage. Say you're taking a self-portrait with remote. You want to compose your shot, lock the tripod, and fire with the remote or timer. You can't half-press then recompose, can you?
Also, more AF points is good for tracking moving objects.
I'm sure there are more advantages, but I'm not too familiar with them as well.

To me, the main advantages of the D90 over the D60:
- much improved LCD screen. Triple the resolution I think.
- The increased weight and size of the body feels much nicer in my hands.
- having an extra LCD screen on the top, to see all the settings at one glance.
- having 2 rotating dials (instead of 1) for setting aperture, shutter speed, flash mode, etc.
- ability to trigger an SB600/800/900 remotely using the built-in flash.
- built-in AF motor to use autofocus with Nikkor AF lenses (or 3rd party ones too).
- newer CMOS sensor + software handles noise at high ISOs much better.
 

Jan 31, 2009
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#18
- having 2 rotating dials (instead of 1) for setting aperture, shutter speed, flash mode, etc.
I was torn between the 450D and D90. The above was the deciding factor. You must feel comfortable holding the cam and making changes to the settings. I can easily change shutter and aperture setting while still looking thru the viewfinder for D90.
 

ZerocoolAstra

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2008
9,522
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#19
I was torn between the 450D and D90. The above was the deciding factor. You must feel comfortable holding the cam and making changes to the settings. I can easily change shutter and aperture setting while still looking thru the viewfinder for D90.
hahhaa in M mode, for changing aperture and shutter speed, it's not too difficult on the D60.
Just have to press one more button (i think it's the EV compensation button) whilst turning the dial.
The extra dial (and buttons on the D90 body) come in useful for changing flash EV and modes, quality, white balance, etc.

For example, I hold the WB button with left thumb, rotate the main dial with right thumb to 'preset', then adjust the (K)elvin value with the right index finger on the sub dial! Amazing! ;) Quick and easy!
 

Jan 31, 2009
634
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0
#20
The extra dial (and buttons on the D90 body) come in useful for changing flash EV and modes, quality, white balance, etc.
Ha ha, I not that advance yet, just started out dslr not too long ago. Still trying to learn :)

OT abit, BTW, are you a member of PPCSG ? Your nick looks familiar :)
 

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