wat happened? more fare confusion???


#1
http://www.todayonline.com/Singapore/EDC100813-0000108/Circle-Line-fare-anomalies wrote:

Circle Line fare anomalies?

Rates set to benefit most commuters: Public Transport Council
by Leong Wee Keat and Neo Chai Chin
05:55 AM Aug 13, 2010


SINGAPORE - It is a fare conundrum that has caused some train commuters to wonder if they are being overcharged: Why are Circle Line fares not based on distance travelled?

For instance, the Circle Line fare from Bishan to Paya Lebar is $1.45, which is the cost of travelling via the longer North-South and East-West lines. Measured on Government website onemap.sg, the distance via the Circle Line is about 7.4km, which should cost $1.40.

Other commuters have noticed similar anomalies on the North East Line. The fare from Kembangan to Chinatown, for instance, is based on the 11.9km travelled from Kembangan to Outram Park on the East-West line, then onward to Chinatown. But commuter H J Tan, 38, said it should be based on the shorter 11-km Kembangan-City Hall-Dhoby Ghaut-Chinatown route.

Responding to MediaCorp's queries, the Public Transport Council (PTC) revealed yesterday that travelling time - and not just distance - is also used to charge train commuters under Singapore's distance-based fares system.

"The general fare-setting principle for MRT lines is to charge for the distance travelled based on the fastest route," a council spokesman said. "This takes into account the walking and waiting time required if a switch to another rail line is involved."

So, the North East Line anomaly is because the fare is based on the "fastest travel route via a transfer at Outram Park", which requires a single transfer compared to the shorter route, which requires two transfers.

The Circle Line situation is more complex: Basing fares on North-South-East-West rates results in some commuters paying more, but "the majority of affected customers paying lower fare", said PTC.

Bishan and Paya Lebar stations are interchange stations, and how fares are set between these two stations affect any travel along this stretch.

When travelling from Ang Mo Kio to Aljunied, for instance, the fastest route is via a transfer at City Hall. In this case, the North-South-East-West fares are also cheaper. But PTC did not give the estimated proportion of commuters who benefit from lower fares.

Commuter Mr Tan wondered, though, if the current system is "rather arbitrary since transfer times fluctuate".

PTC said it would continue to "harmonise fares" as new rail lines are opened.

A first step could be to have uniform fares across all rail lines, suggested Government Parliamentary Committee (Transport) chairman Lim Wee Kiak. Currently, North East Line and Circle Line fares are higher than for the North-South-East-West lines.

Dr Lim has filed a question for Parliament's session on Monday on whether any study has been done to see if two-thirds of commuters benefit from distance-based fares, which kicked in July 3. "It seems there are a lot more people complaining about their fares going up," he said.

But he believes a distance-based system is equitable. "The issue is how you execute it," he said.



Why PTC decided to calculate fares based on route via City Hall instead of Circle Line

by Leong Wee Keat and Neo Chai Chin
Adult fares via City Hall:



Bishan to Paya Lebar: $1.45 ($1.40 via CCL)

Ang Mo Kio to Paya Lebar: $1.53 ($1.50 via CCL)

Bishan to Aljunied: $1.37 ($1.46 via CCL)

Paya Lebar to Braddell: $1.37 ($1.46 via CCL)

Ang Mo Kio |Eunos | $1.54 | $1.53 | Lower |

|---------------+-------------+---------------+---------------+-------------|

|Ang Mo Kio |Aljunied | $1.54 | $1.45 | Lower |

|---------------+-------------+---------------+---------------+-------------|

* Table courtesy Public Transport Council
 

Jul 26, 2002
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#3
Oh wow...NOW they tell people that travelling time is also factored in....well done PTC...well done.
 

Leong23

Senior Member
Oct 18, 2007
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#5
Oh wow...NOW they tell people that travelling time is also factored in....well done PTC...well done.
Maybe next time they will tell us pay the price based on whichever is higher. :sweat:
 

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Limsgp

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Dec 16, 2005
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#6
Bishan to Paya Lebar is 6 stations via CCL, 13 stations via Cityhall.. How can it be faster via cityhall..??????
 

fotoudavid

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Mar 11, 2005
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#8
i must say they are smart....
 

night86mare

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#9
i think the issue here is, how do you measure which route is taken? since you only tap in once at entry, once at exit.

make consumers tap at interchange?
 

melvin

Senior Member
Jun 4, 2005
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#10
YEah what happen?

NOw it is almost 1.5 months snice the day they started this charge by distance thing. they say look at the long term so for the past 1.5month or 1 month how much have u saved?

For me every trip compared to before changes have gone so i dun see any saving at the end of the month!

Question:

1) If they charge by distance why do i still sign which states: Price will be deducted when entry n exit at the same station, Can i know what is my distance travelled?

2) 2days ago i travel from my place to my friend's pl in sengkang:

Braddell ---> Bishan ---> Serangoon ---> Sengkang, fare is $0.83.

My return trip from:

Buangkok ---> Serangoon ---> Bishan ---> Braddell, fare is $1.46.


My friend's place is in between Sengkang n Buangkok so my return trip i chose Buangkok thinking that it is before Sengkang so it will be nearer but...


:confused::dunno::confused:
 

night86mare

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#11
to be fair, i did keep a look out for transfer fares, it has dropped for some journeys, or not increased by much.

when it was first introduced, impression was that it went up, because i was only making trips without any transfers.

for single trip fares, it should be an undisputed increase.
 

night86mare

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#12
2) 2days ago i travel from my place to my friend's pl in sengkang:

Braddell ---> Bishan ---> Serangoon ---> Sengkang, fare is $0.83.

My return trip from:

Buangkok ---> Serangoon ---> Bishan ---> Braddell, fare is $1.46.


My friend's place is in between Sengkang n Buangkok so my return trip i chose Buangkok thinking that it is before Sengkang so it will be nearer but...

just to clarify, entire trip was done inside the MRT system with no exits in between?

if that is so, that's interesting.
 

Will03

Senior Member
Jun 28, 2004
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#14
sadly to say .. the mrt system is getting from bad to worse..
think it was reported that some people were overcharged..
recently a friend of mine came back from overseas, and his daughter and himself bought the same card.. but when they exited the station, the value left in the card is a different amount.

when they informed the control station, they were told they can get a refund at bouna vista.. but my friend said.. he is a tourist.. how is he expected to go n get a refund of a few cents, since he is gonna leave singapore soon.. ? :dunno:

sigh.. its getting more and more ridiculous.. and probably eventually they will just say its a honest mistake.. faints..
 

Xiao_shin

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Sep 21, 2002
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#15
They are creating a very confusing system where you can't track your fare. Maybe next time they will tell you that the fare will fluctuate based on the human traffic. haa haa.

King of confusing accounting.
 

#16
after a while...the issues will just "disappear" into thin air when ppl are more or less sian liao... happen all the time... rule of the game is, pay whatever is fair to them... or fair to their profit margins... i dun think they are so stupid to introduce something that will bring less income...

BTW, how come during YOG they can add more train trips to shorten the waiting time ?

Can they add more during peak hr as well...
 

fotoudavid

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Mar 11, 2005
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#18
i believe the confusion is to confuse us.........:bsmilie:
 

mohgui

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Jan 31, 2005
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#19
they are coming out with ridiculous and confusing explanation on some crap system which they came out with.

what rubbish that fares are based on distance and travel times??? can't have two at once... it's either distance OR travel times!!!

if want to charge base on travel times... can... this is rather simple; let's say it takes a person on average 5 minutes to get from City Hall to Dhoby Ghaut, then charge $0.85 for that 5 minutes. and from City Hall to Somerset is 7 minutes, then charge $0.95 for that 7 minutes.

so, if a person checks in the City Hall gantry and hang around the station and finally exits Dhoby Ghaut in 7 minutes... then charge him $0.95. so, the longer you hang around the station regardless of where you are going... you should be charged based on how long you spent within the station gantries.
 

hongsien

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Mar 11, 2002
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#20
they are coming out with ridiculous and confusing explanation on some crap system which they came out with.

what rubbish that fares are based on distance and travel times??? can't have two at once... it's either distance OR travel times!!!

if want to charge base on travel times... can... this is rather simple; let's say it takes a person on average 5 minutes to get from City Hall to Dhoby Ghaut, then charge $0.85 for that 5 minutes. and from City Hall to Somerset is 7 minutes, then charge $0.95 for that 7 minutes.

so, if a person checks in the City Hall gantry and hang around the station and finally exits Dhoby Ghaut in 7 minutes... then charge him $0.95. so, the longer you hang around the station regardless of where you are going... you should be charged based on how long you spent within the station gantries.
No lah! The next time you get stuck in the train due to some fault, you have to pay even more for sitting/standing in the trains! :bsmilie::bsmilie:
 

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