[Vote] Compare images from 2 cameras


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wackykid

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Jan 25, 2012
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#1
hi all...

haven't been active in this forum for a while... and i still consider a newbie in cameras even though i think i have some camera knowledge...

right now i'm in the middle of a decision making between 2 cameras (i shan't reveal wat cameras they are yet) ... and i'm planning to keep only one set and sell the other... these 2 cameras has its own pros and cons that i'm very well aware of to know the trade offs if i choose either set... budget-wise these are within wat i'm willing to spend...

so i took both cameras went for to shoot a few scenarios which i think both cameras are comparable and capable in... i have my own opinion of which one is better after the comparison... but i also wanna hear what others think...

so here is a survey created to gather the opinions... please help me vote... thanks.. :D

feel free to post any comments or ask questions in this thread too... :)

edit... missed out the survey link here:
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/7CCZDSY


regards,
wacky
 

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Octarine

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Jan 3, 2008
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Pasir Ris
#2
Why wasting so much energy on something that contributes only 20-30% to the image and is subject to very personal preferences? If you have your opinion then do what you please, it's your money after all. Likely, the vote won't change your mind anyway. And showing some snapshots is also pointless: images can be edited in many ways which makes it finally impossible to say which camera has been used. Differences in in-camera processing are pointless for RAW users.
 

wackykid

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#3
Why wasting so much energy on something that contributes only 20-30% to the image and is subject to very personal preferences? If you have your opinion then do what you please, it's your money after all. Likely, the vote won't change your mind anyway. And showing some snapshots is also pointless: images can be edited in many ways which makes it finally impossible to say which camera has been used. Differences in in-camera processing are pointless for RAW users.
well the thing is my mind is in a dilemma on which camera to keep... i only have my own opinion on which image is better... what the vote can do is help me decide on the camera to keep... if the vote agrees with my thinking then it'll just enforce myself that it's a good decision on the camera to keep... but if the vote vastly differ from my own opinion then i may consider keeping the other camera... afterall photos taken are meant to be shared with others to view...

also... i didn't edit the photo in any way... i didn't even do any cropping... and i'm not keen to have to edit photos after taking them... plus these are taken using JPG and not RAW... and i took each of the photo the way i'll use the camera normally...

hope that these answer the comments... :)


regards,
wacky
 

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Octarine

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#4
well the thing is my mind is in a dilemma on which camera to keep... i only have my own opinion on which image is better... what the vote can do is help me decide on the camera to keep... if the vote agrees with my thinking then it'll just enforce myself that it's a good decision on the camera to keep... but if the vote vastly differ from my own opinion then i may consider keeping the other camera... afterall photos taken are meant to be shared with others to view...
Not the vote is important - but the reasons why people vote for a certain camera. So instead of a voting you should rather do exactly what we ask many many times people in similar situations: define your intended usage (vulgo: photographic genre), define your expectations (e.g. not too heavy, one lens fits all, super fast AF, can see better than a cat in a moonless night etc.), tell us which lenses you have / in tend to buy, anything else that crosses your mind when thinking about the cameras. Be specific, not general.
Secondly: what has online sharing to do with your selection of camera? Do you really think the hardware will make such a huge and noticeable difference? (In a nutshell, mostly it does not.) Or do you intend to share / upload your images straight from the camera?

also... i didn't edit the photo in any way... i didn't even do any cropping... and i'm not keen to have to edit photos after taking them... plus these are taken using JPG and not RAW... and i took each of the photo the way i'll use the camera normally...
It's not about your pictures online. My comment about RAW is targeting the fact that image manipulations based on RAW files will render any attempt to guess the camera futile. RAW users will not care about image processing chips in the camera, only the sensor performance matters.
But at least now we have one point of your workflow: JPG only with minimal editing. So this would mean: a camera should give you detailed options to adjust the in-camera processing, right?
 

daredevil123

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lil red dot
#5
I don't see any pictures posted. And it is better to send the RAW files. Comparing JPG is kind of pointless in this day and age.
 

wackykid

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Jan 25, 2012
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#7
Not the vote is important - but the reasons why people vote for a certain camera. So instead of a voting you should rather do exactly what we ask many many times people in similar situations: define your intended usage (vulgo: photographic genre), define your expectations (e.g. not too heavy, one lens fits all, super fast AF, can see better than a cat in a moonless night etc.), tell us which lenses you have / in tend to buy, anything else that crosses your mind when thinking about the cameras. Be specific, not general.
Secondly: what has online sharing to do with your selection of camera? Do you really think the hardware will make such a huge and noticeable difference? (In a nutshell, mostly it does not.) Or do you intend to share / upload your images straight from the camera?


It's not about your pictures online. My comment about RAW is targeting the fact that image manipulations based on RAW files will render any attempt to guess the camera futile. RAW users will not care about image processing chips in the camera, only the sensor performance matters.
But at least now we have one point of your workflow: JPG only with minimal editing. So this would mean: a camera should give you detailed options to adjust the in-camera processing, right?
my intended usage is quite general... mostly for travel and food... not into portrait photography...

my expectations would be reasonably easy for a novice to take good looking photos in most scenarios given the intended usage that i just mentioned (travel + food photography)...

travel photography i'd think that flexible zoom is important... food photography the low light performance is important... i'll just let out a hint on the cameras used... one is a bridge camera with flexible zoom with built-in EVF and better controls... that camera is better for travel... the other camera is an entry interchangeable lens camera so it's better for food photography (especially if i need good low light performance) using primes...

but i'm not asking for camera suggestions... it's just a decision between camera A or camera B... knowing too much of the specs probably will end up causing the vote to be skewed...

sharing need not be limited to online... it's about showing other people my moments... it can be from print outs... on TV at home... certainly online is also another means...

hardware might not make that much difference as u said... but i don't know that unless i do a poll... the poll may either skew the results towards one camera or the other... or the results may be mixed... if the results of the poll is mixed then i can conclude that camera A and camera B isn't that big of difference in terms of hardware in the given scenario... (there are ppl asking me why i buy camera B cos camera B is DEFINITELY not as good as camera A due to smaller sensor size etc... zzz...) and of cos i've compared photos like those in low-light performance where camera A is without a question better than camera B -- so i don't need a poll for that scenario...

as for in-camera processing... while it's gd to have options... but again it's not about advice on what camera to buy so the argument is really moot... :)

sigh... i'm starting to feel inclined to think i posted in the wrong forum even though this is the "novice" section... i thought for the population of non-technical ppl if i pose the same question to them asking them to rate which one better... i'd get a slightly more straight forward answer... cos ultimately watever technical qns that u are welcome to ask me... in the end all i need is a non-objective and personal answer from individual -- that is simply to vote the photo you prefer...


regards,
wacky
 

wackykid

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Jan 25, 2012
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#8
I don't see any pictures posted. And it is better to send the RAW files. Comparing JPG is kind of pointless in this day and age.
Hi, I don't see any pictures nor any surveys.
ah lol..! sorry i forgot to attached the survey after writing that much!! no wonder the survey isn't getting any responses..! thanks for pointing this out..! have updated first post with the survey link...


regards,
wacky
 

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daredevil123

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Oct 25, 2005
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lil red dot
#9
ah lol..! sorry i forgot to attached the survey after writing that much!! no wonder the survey isn't getting any responses..! thanks for pointing this out..! have updated first post with the survey link...


regards,
wacky
Your survey does not make sense. Different subject size, looks like different DoF, also looks like different focal length.
Most of the pictures are underexposed.

Now sure what you want to get out of this. But I do not find either of the choices are better or worse.
 

wackykid

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Jan 25, 2012
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#11
FYI.


any form of survey in ClubSNAP are not allowed.
sorry i did not know that... can point out where did it say that no surveys are allowed?? i tried looking thru the FAQs and find nothing of that sort mentioned...


regards,
wacky
 

Octarine

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#12
Inconsistent handling of exposure and other factors does not warrant any judgement. The factor behind the viewfinder overshadows the minute details that could come from the different cameras.
Again, in case you missed that point: One can not compare two cameras by just looking at two images taken by them, especially if the images are not taken in identical and controlled conditions.
Everything else is as good as reading tea leaves, clouds or watching the birds fly.
 

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catchlights

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#13
sorry i did not know that... can point out where did it say that no surveys are allowed?? i tried looking thru the FAQs and find nothing of that sort mentioned...


regards,
wacky
are you able to find any survey thread in ClubSNAP?
this is unwritten house rule, not set by me or any mods anyway, mods are just enforce it.
 

wackykid

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Jan 25, 2012
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#14
are you able to find any survey thread in ClubSNAP?
this is unwritten house rule, not set by me or any mods anyway, mods are just enforce it.
that doesn't make any sense... i see that you can create a poll in the forum (at least the function is there) with a number of questions you can defined... yet "surveys are not allowed" ... :confused:

and if a "house rule" is unwritten... how to expect those that don't frequent the forum to know...? how many more other "unwritten house rules" are there? :rolleyes:

anyway i guess u can do wat u want... close this thread if u like... last post from me since this is getting OOT... i think i'll just stick to using the marketplace for BnS from now on...


regards,
wacky
 

Octarine

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#15
that doesn't make any sense... i see that you can create a poll in the forum (at least the function is there) with a number of questions you can defined... yet "surveys are not allowed" ... :confused:
Please use the Poll function of you want to get a feedback about multiple options. But then, without revealing anything about the camera and based on some snapshots the feedback won't differ much from what was given here.
What catchlights refers to is the linking of external surveys. There where already cases of people conducting surveys for non-photographic topics. The mods cannot scan all possible third party content (non of them is paid for this, it's their own personal time).
 

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thoongeng

Senior Member
Jan 26, 2010
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#16
My take is that if you want a 'quick survey' easier to just poll your friends in facebook ;)

Here most people will tell you what's more important is the one behind the camera, and not the camera. In the right hands and with knowledge of each system's limitations you can get amazing results even with camera of lesser quality.

One has better depth-of-field control and image quality, it also has a slightly more magentish tint compared to the greenish tint of the other (the latter is more of personal preference)... Why not sell the bridge camera and extra lenses, then buy a superzoom lens for the interchangeable lens camera, to get best of both worlds in 1 camera? Just my 2 cents
 

daredevil123

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Oct 25, 2005
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lil red dot
#17
Please use the Poll function of you want to get a feedback about multiple options. But then, without revealing anything about the camera and based on some snapshots the feedback won't differ much from what was given here.
What catchlights refers to is the linking of external surveys. There where already cases of people conducting surveys for non-photographic topics. The mods cannot scan all possible third party content (non of them is paid for this, it's their own personal time).
Thank you for clarifying for us.

Yes, links to external survey engines are not allowed. Since we do not know what they will point to.

TS, You can post the pictures here, label them, and ask who likes A or B. It is not that hard.

Anyway, your poll is quite useless. I do not find one picture better than another. thoongeng said it correct. 99% of the time the photographer matters more. Better and new gears only give you the capability to do more, or better in different/specific/extreme conditions. For general shooting like the pictures you shared so far, better camera do not matter.
 

wackykid

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Jan 25, 2012
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#18
originally i didn't want to reply anymore liao... but i guess i have to answer this...

Thank you for clarifying for us.

Yes, links to external survey engines are not allowed. Since we do not know what they will point to.

TS, You can post the pictures here, label them, and ask who likes A or B. It is not that hard.

Anyway, your poll is quite useless. I do not find one picture better than another. thoongeng said it correct. 99% of the time the photographer matters more. Better and new gears only give you the capability to do more, or better in different/specific/extreme conditions. For general shooting like the pictures you shared so far, better camera do not matter.
if the worry is about external links... then other things besides surveys would be equally a problem too... either way these should be mentioned clearly in the FAQs... the closest i've seen in the FAQs is:
8. Advertising & Linking to other sites - We do not allow commercial website linking or advertising and if you wish to advertise on the site, please contact us. This rules also covers webmasters/administrators/moderators/members of other websites seeking to promote themselves on this forum without benefit to this forum - Do not use the ClubSNAP forums to promote other forums or web sites in which you have a stake. We will remove messages that serve mostly or exclusively to drive forum members to external forums or web sites.
and clearly i don't own surveymonkey nor advertising for them... and i tot it's a well known survey site that don't have "funny things" in it... the FAQs ought to be updated as it serves as a "standard guide" for both moderators and forum contributors... else some moderators could simply make up their own rules...

also this is nothing personal... it's more directed to the owner(s) of this forum... i'm sure whoever that sets these rules... you are not the decision maker... you are just the messenger... and at least you bothered to reply...

as for the poll... looks like it's really a wrong place to post... you may find it useless.. but i find it quite useful so far... but ONLY after i reposted it in another (more popular) forum that i got several more responses and it is showing a certain trend... certainly there IS difference to the untrained eye (oh the irony) else the poll should get more or less a balanced result... moreover i can understand why the trend is liddat... apparently i've used too much bokeh on those closed up shots and these generally are not favored (hence the bridge camera wins)... and those shots that don't have bokeh effects the camera with superior lens/sensor (i.e. the interchangeable lens camera) is favoured... so i'd probably stick to the interchangeable lens camera and watch out on my overuse of large aperture next time...

and as for the conditions... the photographer is the same (i.e. me) ... meaning the techniques/preferences etc are the same... so the only difference is the camera... if other ppl can see a difference then it can only mean a certain piece of equipment is more suitable for me...


regards,
wacky
 

daredevil123

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Oct 25, 2005
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lil red dot
#19
originally i didn't want to reply anymore liao... but i guess i have to answer this...



if the worry is about external links... then other things besides surveys would be equally a problem too... either way these should be mentioned clearly in the FAQs... the closest i've seen in the FAQs is:


and clearly i don't own surveymonkey nor advertising for them... and i tot it's a well known survey site that don't have "funny things" in it... the FAQs ought to be updated as it serves as a "standard guide" for both moderators and forum contributors... else some moderators could simply make up their own rules...

also this is nothing personal... it's more directed to the owner(s) of this forum... i'm sure whoever that sets these rules... you are not the decision maker... you are just the messenger... and at least you bothered to reply...

as for the poll... looks like it's really a wrong place to post... you may find it useless.. but i find it quite useful so far... but ONLY after i reposted it in another (more popular) forum that i got several more responses and it is showing a certain trend... certainly there IS difference to the untrained eye (oh the irony) else the poll should get more or less a balanced result... moreover i can understand why the trend is liddat... apparently i've used too much bokeh on those closed up shots and these generally are not favored (hence the bridge camera wins)... and those shots that don't have bokeh effects the camera with superior lens/sensor (i.e. the interchangeable lens camera) is favoured... so i'd probably stick to the interchangeable lens camera and watch out on my overuse of large aperture next time...

and as for the conditions... the photographer is the same (i.e. me) ... meaning the techniques/preferences etc are the same... so the only difference is the camera... if other ppl can see a difference then it can only mean a certain piece of equipment is more suitable for me...


regards,
wacky
Well, like what you have mentioned, people responded to content of photos and how it was shot. More than the equipment itself. So you have successfully proven techniques is more important.
 

catchlights

Moderator
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Sep 27, 2004
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#20
originally i didn't want to reply anymore liao... but i guess i have to answer this...



if the worry is about external links... then other things besides surveys would be equally a problem too... either way these should be mentioned clearly in the FAQs... the closest i've seen in the FAQs is:


and clearly i don't own surveymonkey nor advertising for them... and i tot it's a well known survey site that don't have "funny things" in it... the FAQs ought to be updated as it serves as a "standard guide" for both moderators and forum contributors... else some moderators could simply make up their own rules...

also this is nothing personal... it's more directed to the owner(s) of this forum... i'm sure whoever that sets these rules... you are not the decision maker... you are just the messenger... and at least you bothered to reply...

as for the poll... looks like it's really a wrong place to post... you may find it useless.. but i find it quite useful so far... but ONLY after i reposted it in another (more popular) forum that i got several more responses and it is showing a certain trend... certainly there IS difference to the untrained eye (oh the irony) else the poll should get more or less a balanced result... moreover i can understand why the trend is liddat... apparently i've used too much bokeh on those closed up shots and these generally are not favored (hence the bridge camera wins)... and those shots that don't have bokeh effects the camera with superior lens/sensor (i.e. the interchangeable lens camera) is favoured... so i'd probably stick to the interchangeable lens camera and watch out on my overuse of large aperture next time...

and as for the conditions... the photographer is the same (i.e. me) ... meaning the techniques/preferences etc are the same... so the only difference is the camera... if other ppl can see a difference then it can only mean a certain piece of equipment is more suitable for me...


regards,
wacky
Never Never forget, we are all guests in this forum, including the all Mods, just follow the rules and everyone will be happy.
 

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