Unpleasant Buying Experience


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weg

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Jul 10, 2002
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#1
okay I want to relate a rather unhappy experience in buy/sell.

Last week I bought a lens 2nd hand. According to emails beforehand, the condition of the lens is good, with only slight scratches. Lens is abt 1yr plus. So on the day of purchase I checked the lens externally and fired some test shots, and thinking everything was fine, proceeded to buy the lens.

On that same nite I shot abt 8 frames with the lens, this time with smaller apertures and things were still ok. However on the 3rd day, I tried the lens again and discovered that the lens aperture was stuck, resulting in it being unusable.
I immediately contacted the seller and told him the lens is faulty. Asked if I could get a refund. He refused saying it's unfair to him. Although I would have expected most pple to feel paiseh that they have sold u something which spoils in a matter of days, I understand too that to him there's this possibility tt i have mishandled it thereby causing the damage (which of course i did not). Therefore I did not press for a refund. In fact we were supp to meet to let him see if indeed the lens is faulty, but due to our schedules we could not meet up.

So yesterday I took the lens to the service centre to have a look and they confirmed that the aperture is indeed spoilt, and it would cost hundred plus to repair it. So I thought I had no choice but to let them repair otherwise I cant even use the lens at all. I then contacted the seller again n told him it would be fair that we split the repair cost 50-50. However again he refused, saying that when buy 2nd hand things there are risks involved and there's a thing called 2nd hand buyer;s luck! He then ended saying there's nothing he can do about it.

So here I am, stuck with a repair bill of hundred over for something which spoilt in 3days when in earlier email correspondence, the condition of the lens is supp to be good. I replied to him saying that even for 2nd hand goods there is still a certain level of condition tt it has to be in. Spoilin in 3 days with less than 20 frames taken by me is ridiculous. The seller has chosen not to reply.
 

9

919956g

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#2
bobian one.....if he is out to con u....uthere is no way that he would give u back a cent.

But if he is really innocent, he would have tot that u wanna con him. or making requests thats unfair to him.

so in both scenerioa, u still cant get the money.

Thats the thing bout buying second hand, we subject ourselves to higher risk, and during the verbal contract between u and him, its unlikely that he had made any promise of refund, therefore it is hard to justify.
 

ydanz

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Feb 7, 2003
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#3
Hi Weg,

Sorry to hear about your bad experience. Most of the trades I've done in the forum are okay.

However, in your case, I feel that your proposal to split the repair cost at 50/50 is fair. Gosh in a matter of 3 days ... how could that happen??? If you have indeed stated your case fairly, maybe you could expose who the seller was so as to help future buyers who purchase anything from him.

To the seller: you know who you are, are you able to provide a reasonable explantion to what happened?

A year ago, I sold my Nikon Coolpix 5000 which was only 6 months old but without warranty as I bought my unit in USA while on a trip. Though the buyer, did not request for a cheaper price as it is stated "no warranty", I felt it was only fair that I gave the buyer a whole week to test out the digicam with all the functions.

Future buyers beware, ask for a week of warranty.
Honest Sellers: Provide a week's warranty (don't cover negligence though)
 

Caspere

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Jul 27, 2003
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#4
I have bought a lot of thingies over the ebay, yahoo, oversea shops. I have had an experience of buying a camera that works perfectly when I test in infront of the seller. But, 3 days later, the shutter jammed. I repaired it at my own expense. The cost was the same as I paid for the camera itself.

Bad luck. A lemon. It happened ONCE over 50 deals.

Let the Buyers beware. Unless you are sure, or others dealing with the same indivdual have similar experience. We should not smear another's name.

Should we buyers be taken advantage of? Actually, looking at the lack of bids, or the rock bottom bids some people offer, we ARE ACTUALLY taking advantage of sellers, especially the "urgent" or "need money" ones :bsmilie:
 

e_liau

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Oct 29, 2002
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#6
Wse up. Whoever cry "victim" will cry the loudest. It's just your luck, pardon my language. If you want warranity for 2nd hand goods, go to a reputed 2nd hand shop. Of course, that will jerk up the price. Just take it as an expensive lesson and be wise next time to do a thorough inspection before buying 2nd hand goods.
 

aosis

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Oct 22, 2002
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#7
Thought CS sellers normally will give 1 week personal warranty for lens or cameras?
 

roygoh

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Jan 18, 2002
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#8
aosis said:
Thought CS sellers normally will give 1 week personal warranty for lens or cameras?
CS does not impose any buy/sell terms for sales that are derived from Buy/Sell ads placed on CS. CS provides a place for members to post their buy/sell ads and that's it.

Whether or not there is any personal warranty provided by the seller is totally up to the negotiation between the buyer and the seller.
 

Winston

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May 11, 2003
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#9
I have sold some of my stuff 2nd hand before here and elsewhere

Though I did not give any personal warranty to my buyers. as a mattar of courtesy I sometimes to call/sms/email them a few days or 1 week later just to find out if they are satisfied with the product I sold.
Like PC equipment(mainboard,CPU..etc)..etc

Unless the product is like a camera bag or things which don't spoil so easily.
 

franciskc

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Jan 17, 2002
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#10
hmmmm maybe we need to setup a system to monitor the integrity of each members??? :confused: juz like ebay.....


but however sad to hear such news from ya..... but i sell items before also neber give personal warranty, juz tell em feel free to call me if got problem ya. A 50-50 split for repair cost is :thumbsup:
 

sulhan

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#11
Hi All.....

How about a "Clubsnap Sales Agreement Form".....

With all these hoo haa on what not...

How about having a agreement form which CS buy and sell transactions can use to include some return policy like 2 weeks warranty etc.

I actually feel that what some 2nd Hand shop does is very professional like - Taking down the buyers/sellers Particulars and have it written black and white....
This will help the ensure that things sold is not stolen and in case if need to trace seller for damages within the warranty agreement......their particulars is available.....

This will help CS buy & Sell site to be of a high standard and quality guaranteed goods.....


rgds,
Sulhan
 

kingpin

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Sep 17, 2002
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#12
franciskc said:
A 50-50 split for repair cost is :thumbsup:
I disagree. The buyer checked at the point of sale that the lens was working well with all the aperture working. If a few days later he said it is not working then there is a possibility that the buyer could have dropped or mishandled the lens. Lens aperture do not normally fail within a few days. Normally there is no warranty for such deals unless the seller state so as part of his conditions of sale. The deal is final at the point of sale. It is not fair, in this case, to the seller to split the cost of repair.
Buyers buy at your own risk. If you want a warranty, buy new or from a second hand shop that will provide you with a warranty.
 

Jay

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May 29, 2003
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#13
Sad to learn about this unfortunate incident but it wouldn't be the last. There are simply too many people out there lacking integrity.

As buyer, we always try and examine the item properly but at times the malfuntion or damage is not visible and its just need further test to surface the fault. In this instance, the seller should acknowledge at least some liability.

However there are buyers who damaged the item subsequently and try to claim from the sellers as faulty items. Hence this often put seller on their guard and doubt as well.

Claim for "damages" on second-hand goods are all very subjective and IMO integrity is the solution.

Cheers
 

aosis

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Oct 22, 2002
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#14
Perhaps u can post who the seller is to have resolution or as precaution to potential buyers.

Please ignore the above statement if it infringe CS code of service.
 

aosis

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#15
roygoh said:
CS does not impose any buy/sell terms for sales that are derived from Buy/Sell ads placed on CS. CS provides a place for members to post their buy/sell ads and that's it.

Whether or not there is any personal warranty provided by the seller is totally up to the negotiation between the buyer and the seller.
Err .. sorry i mean the usual practice between seller/buyer. Please forgive me causing confusion.
 

sulhan

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#16
Hi all....

Just wanna share....

I bought a lens from a buyer in CS and honestly he described the condition of the lens and its slight history. He described the fungus to me and described it accurately.

With this accurate condition, and personal viewing of the lens, the price of the item was further negotiated. He invited me into his home too....and this make me feel that this guy is serious and honest in his deals.

I got the lens services and cleaned and now a happy user of the lens.

We need these type of Honest seller in CS and not those that hide things and just sell for the sake of getting fast bucks to chase after the release of new gadgets!!!!!!!!!!.......

rgds,
me
 

togu

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Jul 11, 2002
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#17
franciskc said:
hmmmm maybe we need to setup a system to monitor the integrity of each members??? :confused: juz like ebay.....

...
The thing is, this is ClubSNAP, a photography community (look at the top left corner of this screen), not ebay. No doubt, there seems to be more activities in BUY/SELL forum, it is still, just a subset of this place. It is just an er.. miscellaneous service that CS provide, quoting Roygoh's words, "CS provides a place for members to post their buy/sell ads and that's it."


Back to the topic, sorry to hear about weg's incident. Such things does happen at times, just 1's luck. :( That's how the 2nd hand marketplace goes. Putting ourselves in the seller's shoe, what will be the first thing that comes into your mind, when the buyer comes to you few days later, telling you that the item he/she bought is faulty, asking for a refund, or bear half of the repair cost?

To most, a deal is close once the item was inspected, satisfied, payment made, shake hand waves good-bye, and unless the buyer gives some personal warranty promises, buyer shouldn't even think of going back to the seller. It's a fair deal after all.

Just my 0.02 cents
 

Wryer

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Dec 17, 2002
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#18
aosis said:
Perhaps u can post who the seller is to have resolution or as precaution to potential buyers.

Please ignore the above statement if it infringe CS code of service.
Just IMO.
second hand market is really a risky business. The seller and buyer truly know that the lens was in perfect condition when he sold to the buyer. But if the lens crank up after 3 days, i feel that asking the seller to make any form of compensation is unfair to the seller.

*i am assuming the lens to be functional at time of trade

Imagine this scenario, some sellers need urgent cash, and after selling the lens, they immediately run to the hospital to save someone's life. After a few days, sudddenly, the buyer called up and said that the lens is faulty and wants a refund. Thats pretty scary IMO.

Maybe a more realistic scenario, we CS-ers often sell lens to buy new lens. Can u imagine, we happily sold our lens, went straight to CP/AP/MS and purchase a new lens. However, sometime later, the buyer of the lens called and wants a refund. Where are we gonna find the money? and as you know lens are not cheap stuff.

And before we want to question the integrity of the seller, in what position are we to judge that lens is not functional at the time of trade?

IMO, as long as the lens is fully functional during the time of trade, any form of compensation is unfair to the seller. Again, im assuming the lens to be in tip-top functional condition at point of trade. :)

My suggestion: for expensive stuff like lens, please do go down to service centre or TCW to allow them to quick check on the lens before you purchase the lens. Whats some bucks compared to the hundreds we are paying for the lens?

But of course, if the seller is really dishonest, it should be condemned. ;(

My post is not directed at anyone, just my view on the 2nd hand market.

Cheers! ;)

Regards

EDIT: oops, made a fatal mistake, i typed as 'it should not be condemned' paiseh.
 

Kei

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Jan 17, 2002
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#19
Wryer said:
And before we want to question the integrity of the seller, in what position are we to judge that lens is not functional at the time of trade?
:thumbsup:
 

#20
Theres always a certain risk in buying used item.
and prolly u wanna put yrself into the seller's shoe?

Would u do the same?
i doubt!

its human nature in fact.

ive sold mani things in BUY / SELL .. but so far so gd! except i was late for a sale closeup.. i offer to go down by 10 bucks... :p

once u have checked tt yr stuffz are in use-able condition, i dun think the fault shd lie wif the seller. Or rather.. he is not obglie to pay for even share half half the repair cost.

But i think hes being kind enuff to pick up yr call when e gds are faulty. But as for e repair cost, it shd be bare alone.

I remembered when i bought a 2nd hand stuffz from HWZ.. it was faulty too... I told myself... "begger canx be chooser" if im rich.. i deft go for new stuffz...
 

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