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Wolfgang

Senior Member
Apr 29, 2002
5,688
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Riddle Realms
wolfgang.clubsnap.org
#1
This thread refers.

This refers to everyone across the board and not just the Canon Sub-Fourm

Honestly, stop it.

A handful of you here seem to have forgotten that the only reason why such groups are even sprouting out in the first place is due to the existance of Clubsnap.

No doubt each and everyone else here might have met up on other forums but thus far, Clubsnap has provided a reliable platform for every member to communicate, share, discuss and learn from each other. I dare say that there are a small handful of members here beginning to take Clubsnap for granted and treat it as their personal playground.

It must be pointed out that there are users here who are blatantly go against the grain and the spirit of this forum by choosing to post pointless, sarcastic and un-necessary remarks. For reasons known only to themselves, they seem to enjoy antagonising fellow members or users of a different brand/model.

And when asked nicely to refrain from doing so, these members would ask why is someone else doing it and they are not allowed to do so. I view this as being absurd and childish. This mentality of "I'm doing it because someone else has done it" isn't going to help this forum grow. All of you have seen how other forums are degenerating and members are being drawn into petty flamewars. I'm proud to say that Clubsnap has yet to become like that but over time, it might. Alot of good things are happening for alot of people here and i don't think the majority wants this place to degenerate.

So, one way or another, a line has to be drawn somewhere. We simply cannot allow a slow denegeration to take place and have this forum fester until it starts to rot.

If an example has to be made out of the most obvious culprit, so be it. If it takes some form of action to have some people understand the seriousness of the Moderators & Administrators, then it shall be done. Do not start whining when action is finally taken and you start claiming that you were unfairly treated.

As it is, the jobs of the Admins & Mods are already thankless enough, without having people calling you names like "tight ass" and such. In fact, try having your PM inbox flooded everyday because you have members writing to you and asking for help or assistance and queries and you have a bunch of inconsiderate members whining like we owe them something. Let me put it very clearly to you once and for all.

We do not owe you or anyone here a living. In no uncertain terms, either you get with the program or you don't. If you don't like the rules, then leave. Nobody is forcing you to stay. Either stay on and learn and share, or if you think nothing in here benefits you, then go. If you think this is being high handed, TOO BAD. If you want petty flame wars and childish arguments, i'm sure there are forums out there that caters to your preferences.

I can honestly tell you that we do this only because we have gained alot in terms of knowledge and friends and we want to give something back so that new members or everyone else for that matter can benefit. So it's with this simple belief that keeps us going but please do not mistake kindness and tolerance for apathy.

I hope everyone understands why we take such a firm stance against such behavior and we seek your understanding in this matter.

This has got to stop.

Thank you.
 

Zeckson Chow

Senior Member
Mar 1, 2005
6,265
8
38
Currently in Singapore
#3
I appreciate moderators looking into this trend which is happening here in Clubsnap. I am a newbie here and I am learning whenever I can. However, there are unpleasant experiences that I went through in Clubsnap that extremely disappoints me.

I had the impression that this is a forum whereby I can learn and share anything about photography and to make friends. Perhaps my approach was wrong but I was not corrected in a proper way. Instead, I was put on the ground and got humiliated, so much so that even my choice of fonts and colour had also come into discussion. Some of us are very knowledgeable but lacks some essence inside them.

There are also a bunch of nice people around too I must say. They have been encouraging me and advising me on pointers that I had never know on photography and I wish to take this opportunity to thank these nice people for their nice wholesome effort. It is this effort from them that I choose to stay in Clubsnap and continue to learn.

Thanks, Wolfgang, for the voicing out on this matter and stressed on the proper attitude of Clubsnap members. I am truly gratified. I hope to see Clubsnap progress continuosly forward may it bring more members into this club.

Thanks!
 

xl1

Senior Member
May 5, 2004
2,685
0
0
Under the Son
www.ubans.com
#4
yep agree 150% !! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
just use whatever brand of your camera and gives a best picture u can made its enough.
 

student

Senior Member
Jul 26, 2004
3,078
0
0
#5
Zeckson Chow said:
Instead, I was put on the ground and got humiliated, so much so that even my choice of fonts and colour had also come into discussion. Some of us are very knowledgeable but lacks some essence inside them.
I am in essence, in full agreement with Wolfgang's comments/sentiments

I am in agreement that a certain person calling moderators "tight ass" is totally uncalled for and should not be condone.

But I would like to make two points

1 Regarding Zeckson's comments.

People have different ways to communicate. Some are light hearted, some somber and some antagonisitic. There are very,very, few who post for the single-minded purpose to ridicule and insult. I think in such a forum, one should learn to take criticism in the correct manner. Specific examples: the color fonts. I wrote some comments on the fonts. Did it ever occur to Zeckson that reading those small fonts in green color can be very difficult for some people? I just have my cataract removed two weeks ago, before you changed your fonts. I had tried to read what you wrote to try to he;p. But reading those characters can be difficult. So I was most pleased when somepne pointed out that out. People write for a reason. Sometimes perhaps in alight hearted way that may not be to your liking. But to take that negatively to heart is uncalled for.

2 On the paragraph "we do not owe you........."

I think the words are a little strong and in my opinion too antagonistic.

Good behaviour is expected of moderators and administrators as well. Don't you agree? And moderators are also human and can engage in "petty flame wars and childish arguments". I have no wish to bring up specifics, but I was at the wrong end of the "high-handed" approach of the administrators, and was deregistered. It was after several CSers protested that I was "reinstated", and a personal apology made to me by the administrator.

By and large, the moderators have done a good job. And I appreciate and applaud their work. But an approach that says "if you don't like, then leave" smacks of arrogance that I find offensive. Perhaps, and likely, this is not your intention. But it reminds me of certain administration style that led me to leave the University some years ago.

To assume that one has malice intent just because one does not agree with the rules is in my opinion, inappropriate. There can be disagreements. And provided disagreements are not malignant, can be a source of change. And where is progress without change? And where is change without disagreement?
 

student

Senior Member
Jul 26, 2004
3,078
0
0
#6
Apology for the "tongue sticlking out" smiley. Dont know how that got there. I meant to say "help"
 

Jan 25, 2005
115
0
0
30
JURONG,singapore
#7
Moderator, u have done a great job!! This is a photographers' forum & no such things is to be allow to happen here :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
 

Dec 31, 2004
1,321
0
36
Yishun
#8
student said:
To assume that one has malice intent just because one does not agree with the rules is in my opinion, inappropriate.
Hanlon's razor: Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

:think:
 

student

Senior Member
Jul 26, 2004
3,078
0
0
#9
Expiredyoghurt said:
Hanlon's razor: Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

:think:
Don't know who Hanlon's razor is. But I can certainly agree with that!
 

Deadpoet

Senior Member
Oct 18, 2004
4,619
0
0
#10
ClubSnap is where it is today because of all the members, with different backgrounds, ideas and opinions. If we all don't like this place and leave, without the members, what is ClubSnap? Without differences, what good is ClubSnap?

What the moderator did was done, and probably was the right thing to do for this particular instance. But, I am not in favour of the action.

I am very troubled with some of the comments, this one in particular, "... It must be pointed out that there are users here who are blatantly go against the grain and the spirit of this forum by choosing to post pointless, sarcastic and un-necessary remarks..."

Granted to some, the offending remanrks may be pointless, sarcastic and un-necessary, but to whose standard should we judge such remarks. I am extremently uncomfortable when such decisions are made by a few. Besides, one person may find the remarks pointless, sarcastic and un-necessary, while other may look at the whole thing differently.

What exactly is the grain and spirit of this forum? Are we no longer allow to take a stand against the majority? Must we agree to the masses all the time? Or have to degenerated to a level where only politically correct comments are allowed?

Btw, we are all adults, we should be able to handle adversities, including the bashing that goes on electronically over the web. So what if the comments offends, we deal with it ourselves. So what if the comment is pointless, we ignore it. So what if the commetn is sarcastic, we can just laugh at it, and there is never an un-necessary comment! We don't need such high handed solutions, we do not need another big brother, nor another nanny!

The freedom to express, even expressing something that others may not want to hear, may find offensive, and go agains the grain and sprit of the society, is the most fundamental right of a free person. Such rights cannot be eroded a little, by giving up a little, you have essentially surrender your right to be a free person.

PS. The only time freedom of expression may be curtailed is, I will give an example, you may not cry "Fire" in a crowed theater when there was not a fire.
 

#11
Wolfgang said:
No doubt each and everyone else here might have met up on other forums but thus far, Clubsnap has provided a reliable platform for every member to communicate, share, discuss and learn from each other. I dare say that there are a small handful of members here beginning to take Clubsnap for granted and treat it as their personal playground.

It must be pointed out that there are users here who are blatantly go against the grain and the spirit of this forum by choosing to post pointless, sarcastic and un-necessary remarks. For reasons known only to themselves, they seem to enjoy antagonising fellow members or users of a different brand/model.

And when asked nicely to refrain from doing so, these members would ask why is someone else doing it and they are not allowed to do so. I view this as being absurd and childish. This mentality of "I'm doing it because someone else has done it" isn't going to help this forum grow. All of you have seen how other forums are degenerating and members are being drawn into petty flamewars. I'm proud to say that Clubsnap has yet to become like that but over time, it might. Alot of good things are happening for alot of people here and i don't think the majority wants this place to degenerate.

So, one way or another, a line has to be drawn somewhere. We simply cannot allow a slow denegeration to take place and have this forum fester until it starts to rot.

If an example has to be made out of the most obvious culprit, so be it. If it takes some form of action to have some people understand the seriousness of the Moderators & Administrators, then it shall be done. Do not start whining when action is finally taken and you start claiming that you were unfairly treated.

We do not owe you or anyone here a living. In no uncertain terms, either you get with the program or you don't. If you don't like the rules, then leave. Nobody is forcing you to stay. Either stay on and learn and share, or if you think nothing in here benefits you, then go. If you think this is being high handed, TOO BAD. If you want petty flame wars and childish arguments, i'm sure there are forums out there that caters to your preferences.

I can honestly tell you that we do this only because we have gained alot in terms of knowledge and friends and we want to give something back so that new members or everyone else for that matter can benefit. So it's with this simple belief that keeps us going but please do not mistake kindness and tolerance for apathy.

I hope everyone understands why we take such a firm stance against such behavior and we seek your understanding in this matter.

This has got to stop.

Thank you.
I'm very thankful that I am reading this from Wolfgang. Really helpful piece of information that helps me, (as a newbie) understands that this forum is not another unruly community that condones immature individuals posting self-centered comments and irrelevent issues on other persons thread, usually resulting in the thread going OT.
 

Del_CtrlnoAlt

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2003
16,268
0
0
Outside the Dry Box.
Visit site
#12
Steplim said:
Hi

I am using Canon 300D. I have already own a Sigma 105 DG Macro Lens, a SLR Tamron 70-300mm Zoom lens and the kit lens.
I am planning to buy either a wide-angle or standard Lens. Below are 3 different types of lens that I am considering to buy:

1) Canon, EF 50mm f/1.4 USM
2) Sigma, F1.8 EX DG Aspherical RF
3) Tamron SP AF 14

Of course, I do not wish to spend too much for this addition.
Can someone help me to make the right decision for my selection.

Thanks
Steplim
hmm... did u know u posted in the wrong thread? :sweatsm:
 

Manager888

New Member
Jan 5, 2006
29
0
0
Seng Kang
#13
Thanks for taking a stand. Just joined this forum, good to see people standing up for what they believe is good and right. God Bless
 

K

KMSEA

Guest
#14
Well everybody must be getting excited with the soon to be release replacement for the 7D at PMA. In fact there will be a second DSLR released at the same time. No it won't be the 9D. The 7D replacement will incorporate the newly developed Sony 10.3 cmos sensor. Body wise identical as the existing 7D. Internally though a lot more advanced like faster write time, lightening AF speed. Price wise same as when the 7D was first launched.
 

Del_CtrlnoAlt

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2003
16,268
0
0
Outside the Dry Box.
Visit site
#15
KMSEA said:
Well everybody must be getting excited with the soon to be release replacement for the 7D at PMA. In fact there will be a second DSLR released at the same time. No it won't be the 9D. The 7D replacement will incorporate the newly developed Sony 10.3 cmos sensor. Body wise identical as the existing 7D. Internally though a lot more advanced like faster write time, lightening AF speed. Price wise same as when the 7D was first launched.
brudder... being as excited as u are... but u just posted in the wrong section & wrong thread.
 

B.K. Tham

New Member
Apr 27, 2006
3
0
0
#17
HI,
This happens to the first time I visited this forum. Therefore I do not have knowledge of what has happened in the past. However, having held "thankless" positions before I can empatize with the writer. I fully support his stand that there must be rules to follow in any organisation. I hope everyone will cooperate and enjoy this forum.
Thank You
 

May 6, 2006
2
0
0
#18
wow..hi all..im new here..but its nice seeing everyone of u appreciating clubSNAP =) excited to get to know all of u more and all your interesting talents n art work =) :D
 

May 16, 2006
569
0
0
Long Hill
#20
agreed! mods and admins in any forums are kind souls who had done a fantabulous job! so to ppl who... out of their own deviant motives, i suggest be a lil' sensitive and.... grow up will ya!
 

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