my first thoughts on the k20d

[night86mare]

please share your opinions when you first got your paws on the k20d. just comments and anything that struck you when using it is fine. best to make it as neutral as possible, and not encourage to upgrade for the sake of upgrading. i think while we all want pentax to earn more money, we are after all, supposed to be the group that cares more about "photographs".. and undoubtedly i am going to say that this brand is really designed for taking photos, and that's about it.

i hope i am not spamming the pentax section here, if i am, fengwei, please feel free to merge or remove as you see fit - because i think a lot of people here would want to know what the k20d has to offer. my own experience is upgrading from the k100d.

pros:
1) viewfinder really brighter.
2) is noticeably heavier, because i am switching between this with sigma 10-20 and k100d with kit. you can imagine the difference. but to be very honest, i am not tired of the weight. it feels more comfortable and reassuring.
3) 14 megapixels with i would say, even better image quality than equivalent iso than k100d. 1600 iso is amazingly usable
4) shake reduction is really better
5) the dust removal system seems competent, i have been switching lenses a lot today and it should have picked up some dust but it has not, based on the excellent feature of the dust alert picture taking function, which i love.. for someone so concerned with dust
6) battery life seems competent so far
7) this is a HUGE PLUS for me, the dynamic range is DEFINITELY much better than the k100d, what can i say. i am seeing details that i won't usually see based on the lighting etc.

cons:
1) blardy huge file size
2) slight lag between shots but frankly unless you need lightning fast refresh rates you won't notice it
3) i am not sure if the k10d was this way, but while the build quality of the knobs for the battery and sd card door look ok, i think one has to be very careful when opening, such a small piece of plastic might break easily!
4) i wish there wasn't that silly bar meter thingy. i do prefer the k100d's numbers when metering instead of that, but then again i'm a numbers person
5) when zooming in, the k100d could select what size to zoom into immediately after turning the thumbwheel. this one, i can't seem to find the function, maybe i should rtfm. if it isn't present i hope pentax corrects this with firmware updates.. i zoom in mainly to check for blur, that's about it
6) the number of buttons everywhere are slightly overwhelming for me

that's about it!

 

[Gengh]

5) when zooming in, the k100d could select what size to zoom into immediately after turning the thumbwheel. this one, i can't seem to find the function, maybe i should rtfm. if it isn't present i hope pentax corrects this with firmware updates.. i zoom in mainly to check for blur, that's about it

This comment sounded like a terrible mistake on Pentax's part, so I checked dpreview...

It's there, under the playback menu > playback display > quick zoom. Kena relocated because the custom menu is so overcrowded already I guess.

 

[flowerpot]

it takes a while getting used to it, but trust me, after a few more weeks, u will like everything about it... since u still have ur K100D(IR) u will realize the K20D ergonomics is so much ahead of K100D...

my only complaint is same as you the hugh file size, especially when u shoot raw, im seriously thinking of how to mange my data, now still ok, but come end of the year, i might have to get my 3rd external hard disk :sweat:

 

[night86mare]

This comment sounded like a terrible mistake on Pentax's part, so I checked dpreview...

It's there, under the playback menu > playback display > quick zoom. Kena relocated because the custom menu is so overcrowded already I guess.

ahhh, thanks. i am too lazy to read the manual..

 

[night86mare]

it takes a while getting used to it, but trust me, after a few more weeks, u will like everything about it... since u still have ur K100D(IR) u will realize the K20D ergonomics is so much ahead of K100D...

my only complaint is same as you the hugh file size, especially when u shoot raw, im seriously thinking of how to mange my data, now still ok, but come end of the year, i might have to get my 3rd external hard disk :sweat:

hrm, i think both feel the same way to me actually, just the weight.. but then i think all of them have merit in that area.. i have tried a particular brand before (let's not name to avoid fights).. no space for my fifth finger, if that gives you any clue.

hrm. i actually dump all my raw files unless i really think the photo has merit for relooking again. even then, though, the jpg files are HUGE. like H-U-G-E. 10 mb on average

 

[sbc]

Just got the K20D. I haven't really use it yet. Coming from the K10D, it was an easy switch. Everything is familiar and yet there are many pleasent surprises. The extra parameters for adjustment is really nice. Now it seem like you can really customised it to your exact taste.

The 1st thing I did was to do a BF/FF check with the DFA100. It was spot on so no adjustment needed. For the 18-55II, I think it may have a little BF, or it may just be the auto focus not able to focus on what I want because of the greater DOF of 55mm plus f5.6. Anyway the target is still in focus so no adjustment there too.

Most DSLRs have about 7 to 8 stops of DR. Dpreview reported the K20D as being capable of 9 stops. That was what really pushed me to buy one. I will be using it for studio shoot soon so I will find out for myself. It would be great if I can seperate the model's hair from the dark background.

I still think it is a little overpriced compared to the K10D though, which in my eyes is the best value for money DSLR ever. But that era is over; it seems Pentax stuff is getting more expensive by the generation.

 

[skypacker]

6) the number of buttons everywhere are slightly overwhelming for me

You'll get used to it. It's one of my favorite features of the K20D. Most of the critical settings can be changed without diving into menus.:thumbsup:

 

[night86mare]

I still think it is a little overpriced compared to the K10D though, which in my eyes is the best value for money DSLR ever. But that era is over; it seems Pentax stuff is getting more expensive by the generation.

it certainly costs more than k10d when k10d was first released, but i think we have to put it into perspective here

the research to be done in developing new technology just doesn't poof into existence. so i guess they will have to pass it onto the consumers. also, compared to k10d, which would have been at best considered a mid-range dslr at the time of release, this one leads in certain classes, like resolution and megapixels along with many bells and whistles that other top end cameras do not have.

of course, k20d isn't the absolute camera to get, but i think it's a very pragmatic camera, and if you compare it to similar classed cameras, i think the price is very much justified.. of course i would have preferred it to be $1300, but i do not think it very fair to the company.

just my 2 cents.

 

[P3ntx]

Hi Nightmere,

Could u kindly elaborate this item 5 on K100D, so amazing ,, never know this features....;p;p


5) when zooming in, the k100d could select what size to zoom into immediately after turning the thumbwheel. this one, i can't seem to find the function, maybe i should rtfm. if it isn't present i hope pentax corrects this with firmware updates.. i zoom in mainly to check for blur, that's about it

 

[night86mare]

Hi Nightmere,

Could u kindly elaborate this item 5 on K100D, so amazing ,, never know this features....;p;p


5) when zooming in, the k100d could select what size to zoom into immediately after turning the thumbwheel. this one, i can't seem to find the function, maybe i should rtfm. if it isn't present i hope pentax corrects this with firmware updates.. i zoom in mainly to check for blur, that's about it

hrm, you have to access the custom setting menu.. it's the last one on the right when you press menu

then you can select to immediately zoom into 4x, 8x, 12x, etc when you turn the thumbwheel

it's much faster than going into 1.2x to 1.4, 1.6, etc.. that's so slow and irritating if you want to do it fast..

 

[dnaxe]

of course, k20d isn't the absolute camera to get, but i think it's a very pragmatic camera, and if you compare it to similar classed cameras, i think the price is very much justified.. of course i would have preferred it to be $1300, but i do not think it very fair to the company.

I think it's not -overpriced- but I'm not sure it's really justified. low fps shooting and slower focus are pretty damning things (slower focus more than low fps).

Of course, it also helps that they actually have a normal zoom option which actually preserves a little wideangle. Otherwise I would probably have jumped (isn't it ironic that glass selection made me stay at pentax? *laugh*)

 

[art2d2]

I hate the K20D because its forcing me to buy DA* and Limited lens ;p. Overall I'm very happy with the K20D in terms of image quality and the amount of customisation that you can do.

Pros (as compared to the K10D) :

1) Lower noise level
2) Slightly faster AF in low light (but not that much)
3) I can use back my old battery grip !
4) Softer shutter mirror slap
5) Improved AWB
6) New 21fps feature (I'm really having fun with this)
7) Lens adjustment, so no need to go bother Kevin anymore haha.
8) Better integration with SDM lens
9) Amazing details from the 14.6 sensor (needs to buy higher resolution monitor hehe)

Cons :

1) Like everyone here said, freaking big file size. 70% of the time I'm shooting at 10mp on non-critical photography to save space.
2) Still... 3fps
3) Really need to RTFM on some of the features in the menu
4) No dedicated WB button on the cam, still need to press the Fn button first
5) Same goes to changing from 1fps to 3fps, no dedicated button, still need to press the Fn button first

 

[creampuff]

I went through the K100D, the K10D and the K100D Super so the K20D is a quantum leap forward, even over the K10D. The K10D is still a good camera but it has some niggling issues, like so-so noise levels at high ISO and BF issues with a number of lenses. I did briefly consider the K200D but except for the small form factor, the K20D is a lot better camera by far.

I like the K20D because it addresses or improves upon the preceding cameras. WB control is very good and jpeg quality is so good straight from the camera that I have barely needed to shoot RAW very much to gain the additional dynamic range headroom and detail. The CMOS color rendition takes a while to get used to coming from CCD experience but it is definitely more accurate, especially with intense reds and purple/magenta hues. Still undecided between Bright or Natural settings.

Shot indoors in a mixed lighting situation yesterday and the adjustable WB fine-tuning is a lot better than the K10D. In fact the camera is so good out of the box that I find there is little need to tweak very much. Anyway it remains a very customizable camera that can cater to individual needs.

Yes file sizes have gone up but this is all the more reason to be even more selective on those so-so or cannot make it photos to be deleted pronto. I'm sure other cameras with higher megapixel count are having the same challenge.

The fps issues is a grouse for some. It would have been nice if they could have squeezed in 1-2 more fps or uprate the fps with the battery grip added. Minor issue for me, but I really like the shutter sound. Sooo quiet. Control layout is like the K10D and is very good to me.

The AF is certainly an improvement over the K10D and leaps ahead over the K100D series. More importantly the AF is spot on and I've not needed to dial in any focus adjustments so far. The in-body Shake Reduction is also better. Both of these are big improvements imo.

More an issue with the K20D is the state of the lenses in one's collection. The sensor is so sharp and lenses which could be deemed acceptably sharp at 6.1 or 10.2 megapixels now start to show their limitations. I'm seriously thinking of shooting only with the best prime lenses from now on. This is my opinion only but shooting with lesser glass is I think selling yourself short on the full potential of this camera's amazing sensor.

Still toying with the camera as it is a new learning curve with some interesting features. As Arthur has mentioned, the Burst mode opens up some new photo opportunities, as is the built-in intervalometer.

To be able to alter the color mode after the jpeg is taken is a nifty feature. Trying out shooting entirely in B&W right now using the B&W filter. With the option to swap to color later if I feel it looks better or feel like it is like shooting entirely with B&W film with colour film as a back-up. Cool!!! With this camera, you can literally dump all your 35mm film cameras of the past. :thumbsup:

In summary, it's all good with the K20D, especially the battery life. When considering total cost of ownership (lenses, accessories, etc.), Pentax is still represents very good value. :bsmilie:

 

[chikubang]

JUst curious that everyone kind of ignore K200d when K20d releases. Is K20d >>>>>>>>K200d?

 

[longko]

JUst curious that everyone kind of ignore K200d when K20d releases. Is K20d >>>>>>>>K200d?

K200D gave me the impression of a crippled K10D. For same price you can get a used K10D with better body and more features. Anyway that's what I feel abt K200D

 

[night86mare]

I think it's not -overpriced- but I'm not sure it's really justified. low fps shooting and slower focus are pretty damning things (slower focus more than low fps).

Of course, it also helps that they actually have a normal zoom option which actually preserves a little wideangle. Otherwise I would probably have jumped (isn't it ironic that glass selection made me stay at pentax? *laugh*)

well, it depends on what you're shooting.

frankly i don't see much point in high fps unless you shoot sports. even then af doesn't come into play. if you read up on how the more successful sports shooters get their marvellous shots it is actually done with a lot of careful planning, prefocusing and waiting for the right moment, rather than machine gunning through the shutter count and hoping for some luck. as for street, i haven't had any trouble attaining af so far. the trouble lies not with achieving focus at all, it's just that you achieve the wrong point of focus and street shots are very hit-miss so you often do not get a second chance. in that aspect, i think every brand has something to improve in that, and it's not really anyone's fault that the background is sometimes selected instead of foreground etc. i remember reading a test where yes, af was achieved quickly in another brand's offering.. but out of every 10 shots only 2 or 3 shots had the correct af they wanted.

but that's me, of course, i can live with low fps, and slower focus. to me, these points don't matter that much, so i do find that the price jump for just high fps and faster focus.. really too exponential to believe.

 

[night86mare]

JUst curious that everyone kind of ignore K200d when K20d releases. Is K20d >>>>>>>>K200d?

well, the thing is, look at this way:

1) if you have a k100d, where would you go? this is something i debated over a long time. even though i would be more familiar with k200d interface and controls, and my batteries would still be applicable, and yes, the k10d's platform is indeed something very solid.. there are just too many factors to go for the k20d because of the additional features and "space" offered.

2) if you have a k10d, why would you want to break away from familiarity and get something which is a remodel - i.e. shoving a k10d into a k200d-esque body?

i think the k200d will have the same appeal to newcomers to pentax that the k100d did. as for old-timers.. for the above postulated reasons.. perhaps k20d is much too poisonous to ignore.

 

[dnaxe]

well, it depends on what you're shooting.

frankly i don't see much point in high fps unless you shoot sports. even then af doesn't come into play.

kids.

if you read up on how the more successful sports shooters get their marvellous shots it is actually done with a lot of careful planning, prefocusing and waiting for the right moment, rather than machine gunning through the shutter count and hoping for some luck.

again - kids.

as for street, i haven't had any trouble attaining af so far. the trouble lies not with achieving focus at all, it's just that you achieve the wrong point of focus and street shots are very hit-miss so you often do not get a second chance. in that aspect, i think every brand has something to improve in that, and it's not really anyone's fault that the background is sometimes selected instead of foreground etc.

that's true. The k20d is, i think, fast enough for street in general. The k100d wasn't. Might also because I now have a 16-50.

but that's me, of course, i can live with low fps, and slower focus. to me, these points don't matter that much, so i do find that the price jump for just high fps and faster focus.. really too exponential to believe.

The Canon 40D is cheaper than the Pentax K20D. In Singapore, the 17-55 IS + 40D was very similarly priced to the K20D + 16-50 2.8.

 

[longko]

OK, I find the build of K10D better than K20D. Especially the "clips" to open and close the batt and sd card. The shutter release button also feels softer or loose compared to K20D. It really makes me think twice if I should let go of K10D

 

[Kusum Kangguru]

K200D gave me the impression of a crippled K10D. For same price you can get a used K10D with better body and more features. Anyway that's what I feel abt K200D

I am thinking of getting the k200d. But if the k10d is around the same price, is it better to get the k10d instead? Is is really a better camera in all aspects?