MRT. Pretty, yet dangerous


allenleonhart

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Sep 17, 2008
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#1


i got a soft spot for graffiti art. found it quite nice looking actually.

yet on a more serious note, this really rings a huge bell for the mrt ppl at least. while the vid was uploaded in i think 14-16 june, it was only reported on the 19th. i wont blame on commuters. i guess they probably thought that it was an ad or something in line with arts fes that kind of stuff.

yet what i'm bemused is how the depot ppl actually didnt realise it. i would had thought they kept track of stuff, like ads in trains etc. surprisingly it took a delay of almost 5 days before any report was made.

rings any bell? sounds like mas selamat all over again. ran away from our detention center. now we have ppl doing graffiti on our mrt at depot. the lax of security would probably mean that terrorists could, if they had done so earlier, planted a cute little bomb on our mrt without a single person realising it, using the method of travel that the swiss guy did.

also, the ridiculous amt of time that the graffiti artist could actually stay there, to spray design and complete his art is at least 30 mins if not more. 30 mins is ridiculously long anyways.

well. i remember reading on an incident regarding orchard mrt is a target for terrorism. with this happening, i'll say its highly plausible for such an act to happen.

perhaps i feel that one: there has to be more transparency. the only reason i can think why ppl can think graffiti was an ad was due to the graffiti postbox actions in the past. perhaps thats why ppl dun bother abt it this time. (face it. a trainspotter discovered it LOL). no idea how, but ways could be thought up of i guess.

2: security at depot. (THEY didnt had ELECTRIC FENCES?!). the lax of security actually says a lot. mrt is the core of our transport system, ferrying millions of people daily. u wont want a bomb in there do u? this incident clearly shows that security is lax. 30 mins or more + infil to our core transport system. not a good sign:think:

in light of the orchard terrorist target, i believe there is a need to up security of our key places. i certainly dun want a bomb here on the mrt i'm gonna ride later.
well. just my 2 cents. found it interesting.
 

diver-hloc

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#3
I work for a Public Transportation Company (lets not say which, just incase) so let me try to explain from the view point of a normal/lowly Blue-collar worker. ;)


yet what i'm bemused is how the depot ppl actually didnt realise it. i would had thought they kept track of stuff, like ads in trains etc. surprisingly it took a delay of almost 5 days before any report was made.

More like 3 days.... internate investigation 1st. Trains are run nearly 18hr a day.... leaving early in the morning, coming back late at night. A train is 180+ metres long.... The driver leave from each end of the train. So no one would walk the outside of the train to check for such things.... check inside YES, outside NO. Btw.... Bosses don't tell us staffs, what type of Ads are to be paste onto the train... so as far as anyone knows.... that could be some 'ART' ads that HQ comes up with.



rings any bell? sounds like mas selamat all over again. ran away from our detention center. now we have ppl doing graffiti on our mrt at depot. the lax of security would probably mean that terrorists could, if they had done so earlier, planted a cute little bomb on our mrt without a single person realising it, using the method of travel that the swiss guy did.

also, the ridiculous amt of time that the graffiti artist could actually stay there, to spray design and complete his art is at least 30 mins if not more. 30 mins is ridiculously long anyways.

At Night... the depot is really deserted.... there is really only 2 old uncle at watch with tons of CCTV camera all round. Why.... you ask, $$$$$ lah. The uncles are only suppose to call police if anything happens. Or do you think the uncles can ku fung fight their way out ?? The only other SMRT staffs are at the mainance pit working the nightshift. The Train are stable a good 400m from the maintance pit at Changi. Who so free to walk down there to take a look ??

Is it ridiculous.... it is. But are we all willing to endure another round of fare hike so that SMRT could afford real CISCO ??



2: security at depot. (THEY didnt had ELECTRIC FENCES?!) the lax of security actually says a lot. mrt is the core of our transport system, ferrying millions of people daily. u wont want a bomb in there do u? this incident clearly shows that security is lax. 30 mins or more + infil to our core transport system. not a good sign.

Nobody use electric fencing in S'pore.... NOT EVEN Army, Airfroce, Navy camp.... I don't even think S'pore Prison system uses them. So kind of funny for you to think SMRT should. :think: Don't forget, the depots at located in very public areas around S'pore, not some hidded corner inside the forest. And if some person/child decided to watch trains kena kill by the fences... then there would be another round of WHY IS THERE AN ELECTRIC FENCES from S'poreans.



My own point of view.... Yes, its a wake-up call for SMRT. They can't just pay lips service about security and don't want to pay for it.
 

Canonised

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Aug 27, 2003
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#4
frankly we live in such an air-tight bottle that one day we will all go crazy.

Will not discuss on the legal and criminal aspects of this case.

But it would be good if the buses and trains can spare some of them for these creative people to scribble on them legally ... no need to pay somemore. :think:
 

allenleonhart

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#5
I work for a Public Transportation Company (lets not say which, just incase) so let me try to explain from the view point of a normal/lowly Blue-collar worker. ;)





More like 3 days.... internate investigation 1st. Trains are run nearly 18hr a day.... leaving early in the morning, coming back late at night. A train is 180+ metres long.... The driver leave from each end of the train. So no one would walk the outside of the train to check for such things.... check inside YES, outside NO. Btw.... Bosses don't tell us staffs, what type of Ads are to be paste onto the train... so as far as anyone knows.... that could be some 'ART' ads that HQ comes up with.






At Night... the depot is really deserted.... there is really only 2 old uncle at watch with tons of CCTV camera all round. Why.... you ask, $$$$$ lah. The uncles are only suppose to call police if anything happens. Or do you think the uncles can ku fung fight their way out ?? The only other SMRT staffs are at the mainance pit working the nightshift. The Train are stable a good 400m from the maintance pit at Changi. Who so free to walk down there to take a look ??

Is it ridiculous.... it is. But are we all willing to endure another round of fare hike so that SMRT could afford real CISCO ??






Nobody use electric fencing in S'pore.... NOT EVEN Army, Airfroce, Navy camp.... I don't even think S'pore Prison system uses them. So kind of funny for you to think SMRT should. :think: Don't forget, the depots at located in very public areas around S'pore, not some hidded corner inside the forest. And if some person/child decided to watch trains kena kill by the fences... then there would be another round of WHY IS THERE AN ELECTRIC FENCES from S'poreans.



My own point of view.... Yes, its a wake-up call for SMRT. They can't just pay lips service about security and don't want to pay for it.
great to have an insight from the workers point of view. and yes i'm not blaming the workers. i do understand that u all are also under the "shld be the same as the postbox graffiti" syndrome that everyone else has. what i believe is that there may be a lack of communication between the bosses and the below ppl.

as for electric fences, i was just exaggerating and being sacarstic. what i meant was that there shld be even greater security protection for the mrts. its is the core of our transport system. replace the graffiti with lets say planting a bomb. u will realise that the need for very high lvl security is there. if each mrt can lets say fectch a few hundred ppl, well planted bombs on multiple trains could lead to thousands dead.

fare hikes for the commuters as for security? i doubt anyone of us will allow it. shldnt it be their own responsibility to protect their own trains? smrt shld seriously invest in cisco security of sorts. its kinda like an aftercare thing. how to say..... something like canon service. u buy my camera, i assure u nothing will happen and i give u warranty.

u ride my trains, i assure u that no bombs will appear by hiring security.

and i'll make it clear that its not the workers fault. i believe u guys arent paid to do security. rather just servicing and keeping the trains in check am i wrong?

so in short, i'll suggest: more clear communication between the up there ppl of smrt, + higher security.

hope u dun mind :bsmilie:
 

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#6
Nobody use electric fencing in S'pore.... NOT EVEN Army, Airfroce, Navy camp....
Clementi Camp housing 2 PDF just next to Ulu Pandan MRT Deport is protected with electrical fence and they are pretty obvious from the PIE towards Tuas. ;)

Most camps are also installed with Perimeter Fence Intrusion Detection System.
 

diver-hloc

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#7
Clementi Camp housing 2 PDF just next to Ulu Pandan MRT Deport is protected with electrical fence and they are pretty obvious from the PIE towards Tuas. ;)

Most camps are also installed with Perimeter Fence Intrusion Detection System.

But not Electric Fence.... the type that shock ppl. :think:
 

allenleonhart

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But not Electric Fence.... the type that shock ppl. :think:
shock ppl also can wad. a cattle electric fence isnt lethal. but bad enoguh for u to curse and swear for a few days.

why not use a non lethal fence? might be possible
 

diver-hloc

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#9
great to have an insight from the workers point of view. and yes i'm not blaming the workers. i do understand that u all are also under the "shld be the same as the postbox graffiti" syndrome that everyone else has. what i believe is that there may be a lack of communication between the bosses and the below ppl.

so in short, i'll suggest: more clear communication between the up there ppl of smrt, + higher security.

hope u dun mind


Lack of communication is common in all big companies. I hardly ever see my top boss more than twice a year... with him coming down to give nothing more than the usual talk that is suppose to boost workers morale.... which never works at all :bsmilie:

The truth about working life in S'pore... the boss seldom want to talk to lowly workers like me.

And I kind of like it that way :thumbsup:
 

jopel

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Dec 21, 2004
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#10
The truth about working life in S'pore... the boss seldom want to talk to lowly workers like me.
they rather speak with their golf ball in the days, and unmask the hills at nites.
 

diver-hloc

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#12
shock ppl also can wad. a cattle electric fence isnt lethal. but bad enoguh for u to curse and swear for a few days.

why not use a non lethal fence? might be possible

You mean if really terrorist is coming in.... they won't be wearing some form of insulation suit or gloves (like diving wetsuit) to counter this ?? :think:
 

allenleonhart

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#13
Lack of communication is common in all big companies. I hardly ever see my top boss more than twice a year... with him coming down to give nothing more than the usual talk that is suppose to boost workers morale.... which never works at all :bsmilie:

The truth about working life in S'pore... the boss seldom want to talk to lowly workers like me.

And I kind of like it that way :thumbsup:
but bare minimal shld at least tell u all wad things are going on the train lar! dangerous for u all leh. imagine some psycho left a bomb there. then u thought is a parcel for ur boss:sweat:
 

allenleonhart

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You mean if really terrorist is coming in.... they won't be wearing some form of insulation suit or gloves (like diving wetsuit) to counter this ?? :think:
well. thats just the bare minimal security. as orion stated, there are intrusion detection fences possible too.

if terrorists wanna come in is very hard stop. its like. 1v5, all take knifes, the 1 guy easy. anyone he chops is a baddie. the 5 on the other hand has to look after the rest and its harder.

i'll reckon a decent security from cisco can help a lot:think:
 

allenleonhart

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#16
Don't think so... or at least not on the depot side... if not, then those lizards that hang around the fence, which I take macro photos of, would all be roasted. :bsmilie:
not really. for electricity to pass, u needa apply a potential difference across it. thats why birds on live wires dun get zapped off. pd across their foot is 0.

so if ur climbing across a fence, foot on ground and against fence, fence and earth has a big pd, u will get zapped.

as for u jumping onto the fence itself? not too sure. but thats where the barbed wires on the top do their job
:angel:
 

Limsgp

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Dec 16, 2005
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#18
At Night... the depot is really deserted.... there is really only 2 old uncle at watch with tons of CCTV camera all round.
they should install something like the "Eagle Eye"..

u ride my trains, i assure u that no bombs will appear by hiring security.
There is no way the train company can ensure that. take for e.g. a train from changi Airport. Someone tow a huge luggage.. perfectly reasonable right? There is no reason for a guard or MRT staff to demand to open the luggage suspecting a bomb inside..

But not Electric Fence.... the type that shock ppl. :think:
Like the one at Jurassic park?.. :bsmilie:
 

aryanto

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Feb 16, 2005
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#19
Intrusion detection system is best. No point having electric fences but when it was overcomed, nobody know until too late.
Best is silent intrusion system at the frontline cos the trespasser will not be warned.
Loud intrusion system should be somewhere in the middle between target to secure and the perimeter. This is to give phycological shock to the intruder that they have been found, but it should not be too early so there is enough time for the security personel to take action so chances they are caught is higher.

cctv should be equipped with motion detector and heat detector, so it highlight those that detected heat signature that moves.

It is good that this is done by these rouge artist and not terrorist.
Surely following normal asian punishment style, he will be made an example.
I think police should have their own unit that goes around and try to break into restrictive/sensitive area, without any prior announcement. That will be good for security audit.
 

#20
It was many years ago when I overslept in an out of service train and ended up locked inside the train at Bishan depot, apparently no one woke me up or checked the train for passengers either. :bsmilie:
 

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