Marketplace: Product Not As Advertised


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Apr 20, 2006
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#1
I would like to find out if anyone has the experience of having arranged to purchase something from the marketplace... but only to find out that the product in question is nowhere near the condition as advertised.

I arranged to buy a lens from this forum last night. But when the owner delivered the lens, which was advertised as condition 10/10, the lens had quite a few very obvious scratch marks around the lens hood area. When questioned, he replied that the scratches are inevitable if the hood is used. Well... yes... we expect wear and tear from usage, but don't we expect the ads to reflect the correct condition of the goods in question? Coupled with some dust in the lens (which again is inevitable with usage), I would rate the lens at an 8 at best... and I wouldn't be so pissed off if he tried to pass it off as a 9. But 10?

I had to reject the lens after waiting for a long time for him to deliver. I suspect he made me wait until the night to deliver so that the scratches won't be so obvious at night. But they were that obvious... even in dim lighting. What a waste of time. For me and for him... all for nothing. :(
 

azul123

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Dec 4, 2004
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#2
I noticed some adverts that stated had some fungus and rated 9. Buyers just have to be more vigilant with your purchases, got some sellers with far out ratings out there.

../azul123
 

Apr 20, 2006
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#3
I noticed some adverts that stated had some fungus and rated 9. Buyers just have to be more vigilant with your purchases, got some sellers with far out ratings out there.

../azul123
I can understand that not everyone can be able to detect minor cases of fungus. Personally, I won't be able to tell small dust specks from small fungus growth (I think)... because I have not seen fungus on any of my lenses since I keep them in the dry cabinet.

And I don't think it's so bad if the person describes it accurately but puts the wrong rating. If he says fungus but rated 9, and fungus bothers you (which it will) then you won't buy.

But why tell people the lens is 10/10 when it has scratches on it? Are these people stupid? :dunno:

If he said, 10/10, but there are some obvious scratches around the hood mount area and some small dust specs in the lens from normal usage... then I would have offered a different price because I know it's not 10/10.

Of course, if the scratches are obvious, people are going to see it... and then reject the lens... if they did not have prior knowledge... and waste everyone's time.
 

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bigbird17

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Aug 25, 2008
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#4
a guy offered me his lens which he say good condition with rubber grip already out of place which i suspect was due to prolong heat with lenses left in car and a obvious fungus speck! he claim as you go on your photographic path you'll not be bothered by these little details. he even offered me soem CPL to sell off or get it service. i said no. what a waste of my time. i travelled to the west to meet him. :( btw he rated it 9
 

azul123

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#5
I can understand that not everyone can be able to detect minor cases of fungus. Personally, I won't be able to tell small dust specks from small fungus growth (I think)... because I have not seen fungus on any of my lenses since I keep them in the dry cabinet.

And I don't think it's so bad if the person describes it accurately but puts the wrong rating. If he says fungus but rated 9, and fungus bothers you (which it will) then you won't buy.

But why tell people the lens is 10/10 when it has scratches on it? Are these people stupid? :dunno:

If he said, 10/10, but there are some obvious scratches around the hood mount area and some small dust specs in the lens from normal usage... then I would have offered a different price because I know it's not 10/10.

Of course, if the scratches are obvious, people are going to see it... and then reject the lens... if they did not have prior knowledge... and waste everyone's time.
Seller indicated that there is fungus and going by the rating guidelines how can lens be rated 9.

../azul123
 

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Apr 20, 2006
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#6
I think you misunderstood me... the seller indicated that there is fungus and he rated it 9.

../azul123
I understood you. But I think it's not so bad because you know the 9 is off from his honest description of the fungus. So, you won't even arrange to meet him. Here, I have someone who said that the lens was 10... well maintained, etc... then it was all scratched up when he turned up. :(
 

azul123

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Dec 4, 2004
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#7
One other thing that bothers me is.. why can't people post photos of the item they are selling? many still don't but there are some who does and they are a minority.

../azul123
 

azul123

Senior Member
Dec 4, 2004
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#8
I understood you. But I think it's not so bad because you know the 9 is off from his honest description of the fungus. So, you won't even arrange to meet him. Here, I have someone who said that the lens was 10... well maintained, etc... then it was all scratched up when he turned up. :(
Still, it is not right to indicate something that is not.

../azul123
 

azul123

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Dec 4, 2004
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#9
I searched the sale and found the thread, now looking back at what the seller stated, maybe it was an error by TS, it's possible that seller might jave wanted to indicate "No fungus" instead of Fungus. If that was the case then I retract my words said earlier, here's what was posted.

Manual focus prime lens. Fugus but there is a bit of hase, which I think its due to the oil. Exterior is 9/10. With front back caps.
Anyway, it's always best to have photos of actual sale.. that would eliminate alot of queries about the sale and saves alot of time for both sellers and buyers.

../azul123
 

Apr 20, 2006
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#10
I searched the sale and found the thread, now looking back at what the seller stated, maybe it was an error by TS, it's possible that seller might jave wanted to indicate "No fungus" instead of Fungus. If that was the case then I retract my words said earlier, here's what was posted.



Anyway, it's always best to have photos of actual sale.. that would eliminate alot of queries about the sale and saves alot of time for both sellers and buyers.

../azul123
That's true.

But photographing haze and fungus is not so easy. Also, if the item is indeed 9 or 10, there would be nothing of interest to show except for a few scuff marks, which are again very difficult to photograph because they are minor.

I have included photos in my auctions before. Here's one:

http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=468009

But this one was an 8, so, there are a few defects I want to highlight for the buyer to see. Just so that we won't be wasting each other's time.

I also sold this one as a 10:

http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=464771

I did not need to photograph this because... it's really a 10. Might as well take the picture from the Canon site if you know what I mean. If I say it's a 10, and you spot a small scratch, then it will be my bad. :D

Then I sold this as a 9:

http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=449086

There were some light scuff and user marks around the ring mount and contact, but that again is expected for a 9... so it was not a problem.

I think photos are not always useful because we all know that photos can be used to illustrate as well as to hide flaws. I think sellers should rate their products honestly, and highlight any signifcant flaws. It just make sense to do so because the alternative is to waste everyone's time. Nobody can be fooled by the obvious flaws and defects.
 

estel

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Jul 17, 2006
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#11
I think some people are so careless that they don't even understand that the marks they have made are big issues. It must be like when a guy tidies up a room to the best of his ability and thinks it's good, and then a girl comes and finds something that was missed out.

Both times I bought from rather young and inexperienced sellers, the condition was overated. Possibility of dishonesty can't be ruled out, but I think its partly lack of attention to detail. On the other hand, a friend of mine bought (two times!) things advertised at CS as 9 which could clearly quality as 10 or mint. He also met a seller who advertised a lens with code UR as UV and claimed to have mistaken it.
 

Apr 20, 2006
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#12
I think some people are so careless that they don't even understand that the marks they have made are big issues. It must be like when a guy tidies up a room to the best of his ability and thinks it's good, and then a girl comes and finds something that was missed out.

Both times I bought from rather young and inexperienced sellers, the condition was overated. Possibility of dishonesty can't be ruled out, but I think its partly lack of attention to detail. On the other hand, a friend of mine bought (two times!) things advertised at CS as 9 which could clearly quality as 10 or mint. He also met a seller who advertised a lens with code UR as UV and claimed to have mistaken it.

Yes, the seller I met in my case was very young. I wonder where did these young folks get their money to buy these really expensive gear that even I would think twice about before taking the plunge... and I think he was trying to be dishonest, because when I was examining the lens, he did not even dare to look at me. That's when I sensed that something was amiss. I am an auditor in my day job and I interview people all the time... so I'm pretty good at picking up these bad vibes.

And he told me that he shoots for his church. Perhaps he should spend more time on the religion rather than shooting church events.

But come on... did he think I would part with my money before taking a good look at the lens?
 

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StrifeYun

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Nov 15, 2006
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#13
market place has changed in the past 2 years ... seldom see items with a 10 but now, even used lens are rated 10 :x
 

zac08

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Feb 21, 2005
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#14
Just be careful and do a proper check....

there will always be ppl who'd try funny things... but I think I've been VERY lucky so far, all those I deal with have given me good deals. ;)
 

Dream Merchant

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Jan 11, 2007
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#15
DITTO what Zac said.

Use an LED torch, regardless of night or dayt to check interior and exterior.

I once almost got taken in by a FT doctor at NUH who advertised and insisted that his German lens was a cond 9 or 10, with SLIGHT dust when in fact it looked like a sandstorm went through it, and also clearly looked fogged, the effects of which showed up on test photos I took.
 

hongsien

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#16
DITTO what Zac said.

Use an LED torch, regardless of night or dayt to check interior and exterior.

I once almost got taken in by a FT doctor at NUH who advertised and insisted that his German lens was a cond 9 or 10, with SLIGHT dust when in fact it looked like a sandstorm went through it, and also clearly looked fogged, the effects of which showed up on test photos I took.
Does it matter if the seller is a foreign talent or a doctor? You can be fooled by anyone........please leave the persons gender/race/nationality out. There are bad people everywhere......how would you feel if I say that I was scammed by a Singaporean? Not all wrongs are done by foreigners here.......

This reminds me of US eBay buyers who think they should not buy from outside the US as they think you will have a much higher chance of getting scammed, I told them in the ebay discussion group that I was scammed 5x by US sellers! And once by an Australian seller, so bad apples are everywhere, also in your own group (if you think in 'you and me') :)

HS
 

contaxable

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Mar 5, 2006
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#17
this usually happens on the first night after wedding for the couple. it is not as advertised, indeed. this is life.
 

Rashkae

Senior Member
Nov 28, 2005
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#18
this usually happens on the first night after wedding for the couple. it is not as advertised, indeed. this is life.
So who's disappointed? The man or the woman? ;)
 

Dream Merchant

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Staff member
Jan 11, 2007
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#19
Does it matter if the seller is a foreign talent or a doctor? You can be fooled by anyone........please leave the persons gender/race/nationality out. There are bad people everywhere......how would you feel if I say that I was scammed by a Singaporean? Not all wrongs are done by foreigners here.......

This reminds me of US eBay buyers who think they should not buy from outside the US as they think you will have a much higher chance of getting scammed, I told them in the ebay discussion group that I was scammed 5x by US sellers! And once by an Australian seller, so bad apples are everywhere, also in your own group (if you think in 'you and me') :)

HS

I didn't want to mention his nick, so I provided specific hints.
 

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yeobt

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May 23, 2007
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#20
this usually happens on the first night after wedding for the couple. it is not as advertised, indeed. this is life.
after wedding? no, i tested mine b4 the wedding. and it was the best. keke :sticktong
 

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