Doctors in this world


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griffin

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Nov 15, 2006
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#42
Oh guy, how can you compare human and animal. We and animal are at different level (even we still have many animal instinct in us).

We have the ability to change the environment, the can cure our sick, and also of other. I sure animal also will do the same if they have the ability. Of course, in nature the survivor of the fittest is the law and Darwin theory of evolution is also very true. But for human we are playing a different field. We have knowledge, we have ability to change things. Therefore, the theory of survivor of the fittest is not quite apply to human.

Take of example, do you think Albert Einstein is the fittest, he can't talk until 3 year old. I we going to have the apply the survivor of the fittest here, he will be eaten long ago. Lucky we didn't, and with his theory of relativity and physics, we can turn mass to energy (sound better than we can make nuclear bomb). Another example is that the world richer guy is a geek and nerd, yet he is more successful than anyone else.

In short, we are not living in the natural any more so we are not bound by the rule of natural. (if you kill and eat someone, you will kill jail and hang). So, just get your camera and go out to shot more photo.
 

Stereobox

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Dec 21, 2003
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#43
In short, we are not living in the natural any more so we are not bound by the rule of natural. (if you kill and eat someone, you will kill jail and hang). So, just get your camera and go out to shot more photo.
:bsmilie: best line of the night lol!

there seems to be a common misconception that "fittest" survive = those who are strongest, most resistant to virus attacks etc. but fittest in the Darwinian sense just means that those who are better 'equipped' and display unique traits that aid survival tend to live on and spread their genes around. in this case, human intelligence is considered one of the 'fittest' traits around nowadays. and that means the ability to create doctors who manipulate genes and thus the creation of this thread in the first place =P

but as always, we are all part of this web of life. none is top predator...nature always wins =)
 

#45
Doctors in this world are making people more sick. They are playing and going against nature. Manipulation of genes, treating the sick so that bad genes are passed down to their offsprings.

If we observe animal kingdom, the sick and venerable will be eliminated and eaten thus only the offsprings have the strongest genes. :think:
Sounds like Hitler...or our certain dignitary who mentioned something abt graduates marrying graduates to get better genes for offsprings?
I too once dream of utopia but when all the weaker people die off, someone will have to fill the spot for the next weakest link. This will go on till the end of civilization.
 

Zplus

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Mar 16, 2002
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#46
Sometimes its the patient's fault. When antibiotics is used, the entire course of medication must be completed before all the infection is killed. Stopping 1/2 way would allow them to develop stronger resistance. These find their way around your body and spreads to others. In time, that infection would be resistant to the antibiotic. Survival of the fittest, natural selection -- for the infection.
;p

Talking about superbugs.... do take note of the deadly MRSA:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MRSA
http://www.link.med.ed.ac.uk/ridu/Mrsa.htm

Do wash your hands often. Esp after visiting hospitals, clinics, etc. Practice good hygiene.

Also, the latest star of the superbugs... coming out of Iraq....
http://www.acinetobacter.org/
 

Stereobox

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Dec 21, 2003
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#47
Sounds like Hitler...or our certain dignitary who mentioned something abt graduates marrying graduates to get better genes for offsprings?
I too once dream of utopia but when all the weaker people die off, someone will have to fill the spot for the next weakest link. This will go on till the end of civilization.
in your "utopia", human ancestors would be wiped off a long time ago, let alone evolve to become what we are today :bsmilie:

which 'dignitary' said that? that's a very warped view of genetics. for a species to propagate succesfully, there must be as diverse as possible a genetic pool. narrowing it down to a selected few, 'elite' individuals is asking for extinction. like what orang utans in borneo and sumatra are facing now.
 

satay16

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Jan 14, 2006
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#48
which 'dignitary' said that?
you must be kidding.:eek:

give you a clue. He is the most powerful being in the world, if the world was 700km^2big.
cannot type his/her name her. might get sued you know?;)
 

Stereobox

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Dec 21, 2003
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#49
you must be kidding.:eek:

give you a clue. He is the most powerful being in the world, if the world was 700km^2big.
cannot type his/her name her. might get sued you know?;)
pm me then =P

you scared you kena 'naturally selected' ah? hahaha
 

satay16

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Jan 14, 2006
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#50
pm me then =P

you scared you kena 'naturally selected' ah? hahaha
aiyah. i dun like PM. dun you think SM is better? Smart Mating provides clever babies. this "dignitary" said this some time ago, so the Smart Mating i'm refering to is the older version, not the newer one. hee hee, oh boy, i cannot be any lamer.

or, you can just go to this link http://forums.clubsnap.org/showthread.php?t=265488&page=4 and see number 3. hee hee, spread some pubilcity too.
 

Adrius

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Mar 2, 2007
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#51
Doctors in this world are making people more sick. They are playing and going against nature. Manipulation of genes, treating the sick so that bad genes are passed down to their offsprings.

If we observe animal kingdom, the sick and venerable will be eliminated and eaten thus only the offsprings have the strongest genes. :think:
it isnt just doctors. we are a sick race peroid. and that dosent exclude eather you or me.
 

kracker5

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Oct 9, 2003
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#52
That are several conceptual mistakes here.
Many illnesses, including many cancers, are somatic changes, where changes in the genes or signalling pathways that are not inherited & occur during development with or without exposure to environmental influences. Eg. smoking + lung or bladder cancer.
So "curing" these illnesses does not mean that bad genes are passed on to the next generation.

Many techniques in gene manipulation or gene therapy involves detecting changes in or attempting to block certain pathways that allows certain genes to produce bad proteins or normal proteins in abnormal amounts which then causes cancer or certain organs to behave badly or go out of control.
 

Aneurysm

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Oct 22, 2003
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#53
Antibiotics overuse or misuse?? Fully agree problem is that most people are not too informed about the use of antibiotics, I know of people who judge how good a doc is whether or not he/she gives antibiotics (those who give are better). Nowadays there are patients who will insist on antibiotics being given even for viral flu (of which antibiotics is of no use) and I suspect that there are a large number of people who stop their antibiotics as soon as their symptoms improve cos "better not to take too much medicines".

In a way, from how medical science (or for that matter society) is advancing, we are living longer, being able to control (in less cases cure) chronic diseases as well as having less children. Indeed the natural selection (survival of the fittest) pressure seems to be less and less. The "weaker" ones may survive as long as the "stronger" ones and may even have more offspring than that of the traditionally stronger ones.

In years past, people had more children and because of the "weaker" ones did not survive to reproduce and as such the "weaker" genes will not be passed down. Now? Less children with better medications managed to result in the perpetuation of the traditionally weaker genes. True that this gene concept applies mostly to genetic diseases but most chronic diseases have in themselves a genetic component (though not totally), e.g Hypertension, diabetes, Ischaemic Heart disease, a portion of cancers. Of course environmental factors do play a definite role e.g. diet, smoking, radiation exposure, etc

So thereotically, the chronic diseases that we see will become more prevalent because the afflicted is able to live longer and reproduce and thus pass down these genes although I do not think there is any evidence of this in any large scale study.

So does all these mean that we feed the weak to the strong? Morally in my opinion no. This is what sets us apart from other animals, can we justify withholding treatment to patients just because it means passing down "bad" genes? can any of the "Strong" claim to be perfect in everyway (genetically speaking). and who is to say that the weaker genes is not of any "use" in the unforeseenable future?

Please don't flame me, just wanted to put in my own point of view....:)
 

Stereobox

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Dec 21, 2003
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#54
That are several conceptual mistakes here.
Many illnesses, including many cancers, are somatic changes, where changes in the genes or signalling pathways that are not inherited & occur during development with or without exposure to environmental influences. Eg. smoking + lung or bladder cancer.
So "curing" these illnesses does not mean that bad genes are passed on to the next generation.

Many techniques in gene manipulation or gene therapy involves detecting changes in or attempting to block certain pathways that allows certain genes to produce bad proteins or normal proteins in abnormal amounts which then causes cancer or certain organs to behave badly or go out of control.
exactly. over-simplified and often errorneous interpretation of Darwinism led to catastrophes like the Holocaust and heinous 'genetic' crimes against humanity during the Victorian period. imagine being persecuted as a criminal just because of the way you look!

evolution, natural selection, 'survival of the fittest' (darwin never approved of that description actually)...whatever you want to call it...is not only about the ability to outgun and outrun the mutha*****er next to you. it's also about gaining survival advantages and then successful sexual reproduction to pass it on. in this case, human intelligence (aka the intelligence to manipulate genes) is also a factor why humans are doing so well on earth today.

*edit*
might i quote, great power comes with great responsibility. humans having intelligence doesn't automatically mean we have equal wisedom as well.
 

jsbn

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2002
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#55
Doctors in this world are making people more sick. They are playing and going against nature. Manipulation of genes, treating the sick so that bad genes are passed down to their offsprings.

If we observe animal kingdom, the sick and venerable will be eliminated and eaten thus only the offsprings have the strongest genes. :think:
When ur offspring gets sick, tell me.

Never tried human flesh before *slurp*
 

Stereobox

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Dec 21, 2003
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#56
aiyah. i dun like PM. dun you think SM is better? Smart Mating provides clever babies. this "dignitary" said this some time ago, so the Smart Mating i'm refering to is the older version, not the newer one. hee hee, oh boy, i cannot be any lamer.

or, you can just go to this link http://forums.clubsnap.org/showthread.php?t=265488&page=4 and see number 3. hee hee, spread some pubilcity too.
oh no! are we going the way of the orang utans then?? *OT OT*
 

microcosm

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2006
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#57
1 more day to the end of the sch holidays and all these nonsense... can't happen sooner, i tell u....
Don't you love school holidays?

But the good thing is, the Singapore Zoo will have an endless supply of meat. Imagine this, the meat actually takes a bus down to get themselves fed to the lions! That will truly be "uniquely Singapore". LOL! :bsmilie:
 

Stereobox

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Dec 21, 2003
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#58
When ur offspring gets sick, tell me.

Never tried human flesh before *slurp*
well, according to TS's line-of-thought, to "observe" the animal kingdom (of which we are part of)...

you might have to chase him/her around the savannah before delivering the killer bite to the neck :bsmilie: results will be better if you hunt in coordinated packs. anybody wants to organise a group outing? :devil: *ot*
 

Dec 3, 2004
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Bishan
#59
The ruling factor in the animal kingdom is their natural ability, there are no rules that govern killing is wrong, however in the human world, the ruling factor is MONEY, I dont need to elaborate, knowledge is a form of money, a very powerful one especially if it is a key and unique one that impacts the rich and influential people. So what ethics and moral is there? .
Well, i always believe there are two sides to things in life. Knowledge is a powerful tool and also a double edged sword. Genetics has revealed alot about ourselves and has allowed mankind to do many things, even to 'playing god'. However, ethics and morality should be observed all the times, in all aspects. Ill practices and misuse of knowledge will be and should be dealed by the justice.
 

Stereobox

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Dec 21, 2003
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#60
The ruling factor in the animal kingdom is their natural ability, there are no rules that govern killing is wrong, however in the human world, the ruling factor is MONEY, I dont need to elaborate, knowledge is a form of money, a very powerful one especially if it is a key and unique one that impacts the rich and influential people. So what ethics and moral is there? .
there are many ways of looking and observing the world.

if this particular world view saddens or disappoints you and gives you less reason to live on this planet, i suggest you look for an alternative. else sure die la, everybody think like that :bsmilie:
 

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