DA70 or FA77


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wakaka90

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Oct 4, 2007
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#1
as topic.
one more question, wher to find FA lens? I m fr JB btw.
 

fengwei

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#2
Here are the comparison:

DA70 Specifications:
# Lens Mount: PENTAX K AF
# Lens Construction: 6 elements in 5 groups
# Angle of View: 23 degrees with *ist/K DSLRs
# Diaphragm: Fully automatic
# Minimum Aperture: f/22
# Number of Aperture Blades: 9
# Metering System: TTL open-aperture metering
# Minimum Focus Distance: 2.3 ft.
# Filter Diameter: 49mm
# Maximum Diameter: 2.5 inches (63mm)
# Maximum Length: 1.0 inches (26mm)
# Weight (w/o Hood): 4.6 oz. (130g)

FA77 Specifications:
# Mount: Bayonet
# Lens Construction: 6 groups 7 elements
# Angle of View: 31.5 degrees
# Diaphragm: Fully Automatic
# Min Aperture: 22
# Min Focus Distance: 2.3 ft.
# Max Magnification: 0.14X
# Filter Diameter: 49mm
# Size Max Diameter Length: 2.5 x 1.9"
# Weight: 9.5 oz.
# Filter Size: 49mm

Price:
DA70: 700 plus
FA77: 1000 plus

DA70 is only a F2.4 lens while FA77 is faster at F1.8. DA70 has abit faster AF speed, but not that obvious if both mounted on K10D (my own experience). Sharpness wise they are about the same at F2.4, but seems FA77 is abit brighter at F2.4, which means the DA70 isn't really a F2.4 but a F2.8 lens probably. Not a big deal though. Color and rendering are quite similar, but FA77 does produce abit smoother bokeh. DA70 has less CA at wider aperture.

DA70 is cute small, a pancake lens. But the FA77 isn't a big lens even compared with pancake lenses. DA70 seems working fine or FF film cameras (I tested it on MZS, no dark corner), but we can't be sure about this 'cause Pentax only says it's for APS-C dSLR camera only. So if money isn't a concern, go and get the FA77. It's faster (F1.8 vs F2.4 or maybe F2.8), FF compatible, better bokeh, and overall a better lens imo. But the DA70 isn't a bad lens, actually it's an excellent lens, most time you can't tell these two lenses apart sharpness wise and color rendering wise. Both lens are worth having :)

I don't know if the FA77 is in stock here in major photo equipment stores, but someone (creampuff) did get it in a local store several weeks back, so you might get lucky if you search around.

Good luck!
 

#3

creampuff

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Jul 11, 2006
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#4
Since the DA70 is smaller, better and cheaper. 2.4 max aperture is enough in 99% of cases and anyway, FA77 is not good at full aperture. Unless you use film camera, I don't see the point about the FA77.

http://www.photozone.de/8Reviews/lenses/pentax_77_18/index.htm
http://www.photozone.de/8Reviews/lenses/pentax_70_24/index.htm
Ha, ha, wow I like it when you say the FA77 is not good at full aperture and that f/2.4 enough in 99% of cases... interesting :think:

Some months back I had the chance to try out my Japanese client's DA70 and the one thing that caught my eye (and I am sure for a lot of people) is how small and compact it is. Looks aside, the few images that I took with the lens were all sharp and snappy, so no issue with sharpness and contrast. The Quick Shift feature is nice.

There were a few things I noticed with the DA70. While maximum aperture is usable, light falloff at the corners can be visible, especially when shooting something like a blank wall. The screw in hood does make it look bigger. Secondly as fengwei has mentioned, I have a niggling feeling the lens isn't really a f/2.4 but I can't confirm this.

I've read the Photozone reviews and was sort of leaning towards the DA70. That was until I saw and tried out the FA77. I was sold on the spot. IMO it has the edge bokeh wise and the difference in f-stop is significant both when looking in the viewfinder and in the images produced. Of course it is a more expensive lens but the build quality is better. Subjectively I prefer the 77 over the 70. It is a very sharp lens, even at maximum aperture and I have no issues with the focusing speed.
 

fengwei

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#5
Since the DA70 is smaller, better and cheaper. 2.4 max aperture is enough in 99% of cases and anyway, FA77 is not good at full aperture. Unless you use film camera, I don't see the point about the FA77.

http://www.photozone.de/8Reviews/lenses/pentax_77_18/index.htm
http://www.photozone.de/8Reviews/lenses/pentax_70_24/index.htm
DA70 is smaller and cheaper, yes. But better? I can't agree on this one. I've had two DA70, four FA77, and I can confirm that the FA77 is a better lens. Both are probably equally sharp at F2.4, but there is something special about the photos produced by the FA77, probably the WOW effect if you ask me. It is one of the best lens ever produced by Pentax, better even than the FA*85/1.4 in some way.

And FA77 isn't good at full aperture? Seldom heard of this, especially from owners of the lens. It is actually very good at full aperture, better than most other lenses wide open.

Again, here is my suggestion: if you got enough money to spare, and if you are not after the cool factor of a pancake lens, the FA77 is a better choice -- and this is from user (me ;)) who has had 4 FA77 and 2 DA70, not from some one-time reviewer :D

And again, the DA70 isn't a bad lens by all means, actually a great lens. You won't be disappointed, unless you really need something faster than F2.4 (or F2.8 actually).

I myself shoot at F1.8 to F2.5 all the time with my FA77, and F1.4 to F2 with the FA*85/1.4 :cool:
 

fengwei

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#6
Ha, ha, wow I like it when you say the FA77 is not good at full aperture and that f/2.4 enough in 99% of cases... interesting :think:

Some months back I had the chance to try out my Japanese client's DA70 and the one thing that caught my eye (and I am sure for a lot of people) is how small and compact it is. Looks aside, the few images that I took with the lens were all sharp and snappy, so no issue with sharpness and contrast. The Quick Shift feature is nice.

There were a few things I noticed with the DA70. While maximum aperture is usable, light falloff at the corners can be visible, especially when shooting something like a blank wall. The screw in hood does make it look bigger. Secondly as fengwei has mentioned, I have a niggling feeling the lens isn't really a f/2.4 but I can't confirm this.

I've read the Photozone reviews and was sort of leaning towards the DA70. That was until I saw and tried out the FA77. I was sold on the spot. IMO it has the edge bokeh wise and the difference in f-stop is significant both when looking in the viewfinder and in the images produced. Of course it is a more expensive lens but the build quality is better. Subjectively I prefer the 77 over the 70. It is a very sharp lens, even at maximum aperture and I have no issues with the focusing speed.

I still remember the sudden call from you when you were buying the FA77, and I guess my answer on the phone somehow secured the purchase ;) Obviously you are not disappointed with the lens :D
 

creampuff

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Jul 11, 2006
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#7
I still remember the sudden call from you when you were buying the FA77, and I guess my answer on the phone somehow secured the purchase ;) Obviously you are not disappointed with the lens :D
Have to act fast in such circumstances. You were the best one to check with. :bsmilie:
If not for the fact that the DA* 50-135mm was not available for sale on the first day of the COMEX computer show, I probably wouldn't be a happy owner of the FA77.
 

berry

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Nov 7, 2006
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#8
DA70 is smaller and cheaper, yes. But better? I can't agree on this one.... Better even than the FA*85/1.4 in some way.
It is only when you uses th 85 @ f1.4, its too hard to get a sharp pic if you're not stable like a tripod. The FA77 is more easy to control due to the FL. I prefer the 77 too, 70 is too small and slow for my like.:bsmilie:
 

fengwei

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#9
It is only when you uses th 85 @ f1.4, its too hard to get a sharp pic if you're not stable like a tripod. The FA77 is more easy to control due to the FL. I prefer the 77 too, 70 is too small and slow for my like.:bsmilie:
Yes, the 85/1.4 is considerably bigger and heavier than the 77, but it balanced very well on a bigger camera like the K10D, especially with grip on :D

85, 77, 70, all are excellent lenses, and I love them all. But if I have to choose only one, I'd go with the 85 (which suits my needs - portraits - better) :)
 

#10
Ha, ha, wow I like it when you say the FA77 is not good at full aperture and that f/2.4 enough in 99% of cases... interesting :think:
That's just fact. 77mm is too long lens on Digital to be used indoor, when you need fast lens. I prefer a fast 28mm and I don't really care about a middle tele-lens as I always use them outside, when 1.8 aperture is useless in 99% of the cases.

Anyway, 77 is usable at full aperture if you want to make portrait as borders are really so so if you don't close at F4 at least. Ok, good idea, but to make portrait, I prefer definitely the very fast FA50mm F1.4 as it's really cheaper and really better.

If you love beautiful things and don't care about making photographs, go to the FA77, it's definitely more beautiful lens to hold in hand. But if you search a smart lens, small and light because you carry it all the day around the city, very good from full aperture the DA one is really the best buy if you compare both. That's same as Leica M8 vs Pentax K10d, the first one is an object, the second one is the smartest way to make photographs.

For people who talk about the "WOW" effect or however you want to call it. That's all in your head and you'll not be even able to see any effect in a blind test. You don't believe me ? make the test, you'll see. In a blind test, any fixed lens closed at F5.6/F8 on any DSLR will just give similar results or so close that nobody here can make a difference ... Even Leica M8 or Canon 5D versus Nikon D50.
 

wakaka90

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Oct 4, 2007
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#11
Hey thanks for all the replies up ther.
One prob is I can hardly find any shop to test out both lens at d same time.
Yea, I like Quick Shift. :bsmilie::bsmilie:

OOT: who is LBA here?
 

creampuff

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Jul 11, 2006
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#13
Well stougard, we'll just have to agree to disagree here.
 

fengwei

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#14
That's just fact. 77mm is too long lens on Digital to be used indoor, when you need fast lens. I prefer a fast 28mm and I don't really care about a middle tele-lens as I always use them outside, when 1.8 aperture is useless in 99% of the cases.

Anyway, 77 is usable at full aperture if you want to make portrait as borders are really so so if you don't close at F4 at least. Ok, good idea, but to make portrait, I prefer definitely the very fast FA50mm F1.4 as it's really cheaper and really better.

If you love beautiful things and don't care about making photographs, go to the FA77, it's definitely more beautiful lens to hold in hand. But if you search a smart lens, small and light because you carry it all the day around the city, very good from full aperture the DA one is really the best buy if you compare both. That's same as Leica M8 vs Pentax K10d, the first one is an object, the second one is the smartest way to make photographs.

For people who talk about the "WOW" effect or however you want to call it. That's all in your head and you'll not be even able to see any effect in a blind test. You don't believe me ? make the test, you'll see. In a blind test, any fixed lens closed at F5.6/F8 on any DSLR will just give similar results or so close that nobody here can make a difference ... Even Leica M8 or Canon 5D versus Nikon D50.
I guess it's just personal preference. 77 is perfectly fine when used indoor with dSLR, to me at least it is:












I myself don't really care what the reviews say about these two lenses. I still feel the FA77 is a better lens overall, and it's my own experiences afterall.
 

#15
Your kids are nice and FA77 is very good for it, nobody said anything else.

Your kids will be as nice with any fixed lens from Pentax, either DA or FA, 50mm, 70mm or 77mm and same with any lens from Canon, Nikon or Olympus and even some bridge camera from Fuji will do as good (if not better).
 

fengwei

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#16
Your kids are nice and FA77 is very good for it, nobody said anything else.

Your kids will be as nice with any fixed lens from Pentax, either DA or FA, 50mm, 70mm or 77mm and same with any lens from Canon, Nikon or Olympus and even some bridge camera from Fuji will do as good (if not better).
Thanks :) The kids are nice indeed ...
 

Oct 24, 2007
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#17
Your kids are nice and FA77 is very good for it, nobody said anything else.

Your kids will be as nice with any fixed lens from Pentax, either DA or FA, 50mm, 70mm or 77mm and same with any lens from Canon, Nikon or Olympus and even some bridge camera from Fuji will do as good (if not better).

same ??
maybe, say, 2pm siloso beach sentosa, maybe ppl can't really tell the different.
but, in condition like underwater world, its really different. if u wanna to see it...thats why the price so high, no only its looks nice from outside.

if really all those standard lens can just do the same job,,,,hahahaa ,,, our sg can tomorrow easily kill all those German and Japaneses players and becomes a new dslr hub and another world No1 if we design and build a new rang of standard lens with better price then sale all over the world (jp pay >> sg pay till today) and also no need to build so many IR already.
 

wakaka90

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#18
how about FA 43mm 1.9? hows the pricing? IQ wise?
 

fengwei

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#19
how about FA 43mm 1.9? hows the pricing? IQ wise?
The FA43 is an excellent lens. It might not be sharp enough to some wide open (but it's good enough to me though), but it gets really sharp at F2.8, hard to find any lens sharper than this one actually. The color, bokeh, and 3D rendering make this lens very special. I think it's the most versatile Limited lens among all three FA LE lenses, great for general portraits, streets or landscapes.

It's selling for a bit less than 800 here locally, hard to find though.

Good luck :)
 

#20
I love Fa 77 ltd and Fa 43 ltd. My friend has Da 70 which is tiny and light to carry. AF is faster and less intimidating in street photography. However, Fa 77 ltd feels classic and it is a fantastic lens to own (way smaller than competition brands and it is typically sharp from corner to corner)

Fa 77 ltd may not be the sharpest lens ever produced but it has the consistent performce starting from wide open.

In photography, sharpness is not EVERYTHING! The overall colour rendition and the atmosphere of lighting can play an important role here. Especially when it comes to pentax lenses (that is why a lot of us are using pentax gear).

Using the same logic of stopping down the aperture to f8, everything looks the same. Well, I would basicly use canon G5 and stopping down to f8 to do the job. Obviously there are a lot of people in the community who could not appreciate the difference between images taken by a mobile phone camera and a SLR or even MF. Well, that is no body's fault.

Fa 77 ltd can provide a lot more than just being sharp. For many of us, we could use the advantage of f1.8 to achieve our aims with our images. For people who cannot appreciate the difference and have no need of fast primes, they can just enjoy a super zoom to stop down to f8. A big happy family!


Here are some of my shots with Fa 77

Fa 77 ltd









 

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