450d or d90?

[gymak90]

Does anyone knows which camera has a better Noise level at ISO at 1600 under low light. Have tried comparing couple of shorts of both these cameras in http://www.imaging-resource.com but still not sure which is better.

Compare sharpness, colour faithfulness and how obvious noise is.
If you still don't find any difference, haha then like what Daedalus Trent said, it should prove something to you. Think about it

errr, your deep impression is a wrong impression. Nikon cameras can use ANY lenses it has produced in the past ____ (fill in the blank) years. their old AI lenses can be used on a D3,2,1,700,300,200,100,90,80,70,50,60,40 or any of their film SLRs. new lenses can ALSO be used on older cameras. its just the issue of AF and AF-S lenses, which i will leave someone else to explain because i'm working :bsmilie:

Well, looks like I can take up this job.
1) Most importantly, get this straight, you can fit whichever nikkor lens on to any nikkor camera. (Actually got a handful exceptions, but those are not the common lenses people will use. Highly unlikely you'll come into them)

2) What is DX format? DX means the sensor in the cam is slightly smaller than the size of a film frame (36mm X 24mm). There are full frame cams, represented by FX format, e.g. D3, D700. Their sensor is full size 36mm X 24mm. In the case of DX sensor, it is roughly 23.7mm X 15.7mm which is about 2/3 the size of full frame. With the exception of D3, D700 and film SLRs, the rest dslrs are in DX format.

3) Is DX format only adopted by Nikon? No. Although DX is a name used only by Nikon, we usually call these smaller digital sensors as cropped sensors. Most cameras out there, from canon, pentax, sony you name it.. they produce mainly cameras with cropped sensors. If you want a full frame dslr, they are the expensive ones e.g. canon 5D, 5D MkII, 1Ds MkIII, Sony A900 etc. With the exception of Olympus, it uses Four-Thirds system (4/3). Their sensor is in a totally different height:width ratio of 4:3. The rest (Nikon, canon, sony...) uses 3:2 ratio.

4) Is DX format a problem? Not really. Or else why so many ppl still using cams with cropped sensor? The difference it makes, is the viewing angle becomes smaller at every focal length. For nikon DX sensors, say you shot at 20mm, the viewing angle will be similar to (20X1.5)mm in a FX camera. You should the longer the focal length, the smaller the viewing angle.

5) What is AF, AF-S? AF-S is a type of lens that has an in-built motor to do the focusing. Usually because of the in-built motor, focusing can be faster than AF lenses. D40/D40x/D60 do not have a mechanical focusing drive in the body. D90 has. If you put an AF lens onto D40/D40x/D60, it is perfectly fine, but AutoFocus will not be supported, because there is no motor to drive the focusing. You must ManualFocus even with an AF lens. That is why AF-S lenses are prefered for D40/D40x/D60, because it will then have AF function. D90 has the mechanical drive in the body, so if you mount AF lens on to it, you can AF.

Phew..

 

[akagi07]

Well, looks like I can take up this job.
1) Most importantly, get this straight, you can fit whichever nikkor lens on to any nikkor camera. (Actually got a handful exceptions, but those are not the common lenses people will use. Highly unlikely you'll come into them)

2) What is DX format? DX means the sensor in the cam is slightly smaller than the size of a film frame (36mm X 24mm). There are full frame cams, represented by FX format, e.g. D3, D700. Their sensor is full size 36mm X 24mm. In the case of DX sensor, it is roughly 23.7mm X 15.7mm which is about 2/3 the size of full frame. With the exception of D3, D700 and film SLRs, the rest dslrs are in DX format.

3) Is DX format only adopted by Nikon? No. Although DX is a name used only by Nikon, we usually call these smaller digital sensors as cropped sensors. Most cameras out there, from canon, pentax, sony you name it.. they produce mainly cameras with cropped sensors. If you want a full frame dslr, they are the expensive ones e.g. canon 5D, 5D MkII, 1Ds MkIII, Sony A900 etc. With the exception of Olympus, it uses Four-Thirds system (4/3). Their sensor is in a totally different height:width ratio of 4:3. The rest (Nikon, canon, sony...) uses 3:2 ratio.

4) Is DX format a problem? Not really. Or else why so many ppl still using cams with cropped sensor? The difference it makes, is the viewing angle becomes smaller at every focal length. For nikon DX sensors, say you shot at 20mm, the viewing angle will be similar to (20X1.5)mm in a FX camera. You should the longer the focal length, the smaller the viewing angle.

5) What is AF, AF-S? AF-S is a type of lens that has an in-built motor to do the focusing. Usually because of the in-built motor, focusing can be faster than AF lenses. D40/D40x/D60 do not have a mechanical focusing drive in the body. D90 has. If you put an AF lens onto D40/D40x/D60, it is perfectly fine, but AutoFocus will not be supported, because there is no motor to drive the focusing. You must ManualFocus even with an AF lens. That is why AF-S lenses are prefered for D40/D40x/D60, because it will then have AF function. D90 has the mechanical drive in the body, so if you mount AF lens on to it, you can AF.

Phew..

perfect.. great and most useful info. 1 post kills all my doubts.
Ok so its all about Nikon's terminologies.

Many thanks again.

 

[akagi07]

btw, true if in the market, say common prime lens, zoom lens, from nikon and canon, though not totally the same quality, but say to the closest comparable among the N and C, nikon lens come in a slight small marginally higher price? I search ard in CS N and C lens price posted, seems so...

as for my next questions, i gotta check out website for D90 full review and the users' opinions..

 

[h2chng]

Just my one cent worth of comment, do consider the accessories system available too. The flash system, software etc.

But generally, you can never go wrong with these two major brand.

Cheers

 

[calebk]

errr, your deep impression is a wrong impression. Nikon cameras can use ANY lenses it has produced in the past ____ (fill in the blank) years. their old AI lenses can be used on a D3,2,1,700,300,200,100,90,80,70,50,60,40 or any of their film SLRs. new lenses can ALSO be used on older cameras. its just the issue of AF and AF-S lenses, which i will leave someone else to explain because i'm working :bsmilie:

Hmm...to be fair...I do believe mounting Ai and Ai-S lenses on the D90, D80, D70s, D70, D50, D60, D40x and D40 means no AE with electronic aperture control in P, A and S modes. You can still use Ai and Ai-S lenses in A mode, but you have to stop the aperture down yourself prior to taking your shot.

 

[canik7]

if you're not sure....don't you think it proves something? :bsmilie:

good point but do others have the same findings?

 

[calebk]

good point but do others have the same findings?

These days, you are hard pressed to tell the difference between images taken by a Canon and Nikon camera. Canon and Nikon both have great noise control and great optics. What can you learn from this?

 

[gymak90]

perfect.. great and most useful info. 1 post kills all my doubts.
Ok so its all about Nikon's terminologies.

Many thanks again.

No problem.

btw, true if in the market, say common prime lens, zoom lens, from nikon and canon, though not totally the same quality, but say to the closest comparable among the N and C, nikon lens come in a slight small marginally higher price? I search ard in CS N and C lens price posted, seems so...

as for my next questions, i gotta check out website for D90 full review and the users' opinions..

Well, let's take an e.g. of 50mm f/1.8. On paper the Nikkor seems to be more expensive by as much as $50? Then consider the build quality, image quality and the fact that the nikkor has an aperture ring that the canon version doesn't. Maybe aperture ring is not so important to a D90 user.
Plus it's an AF-D lens which relates distance-to-subject information to the camera. This is important for focusing and flash output. Not sure if the canon one does the same thing.

 

[gymak90]

These days, you are hard pressed to tell the difference between images taken by a Canon and Nikon camera. Canon and Nikon both have great noise control and great optics. What can you learn from this?

Hmm.. nikon is catching up? It's quite sad to be a nikon user in the past when canon cams consistently outperforms in terms of noise handling...

 

[calebk]

Hmm.. nikon is catching up? It's quite sad to be a nikon user in the past when canon cams consistently outperforms in terms of noise handling...

Yea in the past. Guess now Nikon users get to feel the joy of great noise control too.

 

[canik7]

These days, you are hard pressed to tell the difference between images taken by a Canon and Nikon camera. Canon and Nikon both have great noise control and great optics. What can you learn from this?

wait for dpreview

 

[calebk]

wait for dpreview

Wrong.

Waiting for DPReview only tells you that both Canon and Nikon cameras do actually perform quite close to each other in terms of picture quality, which is what you'd conclude anyway.

It teaches you that brand does not matter as much in terms of picture quality. How it handles in your hand, how comfortable and intuitive you are with using it; that's what brands count for.

 

[Benosaurous]

dark side or join the jedi, the fact you must know, are you able to handle the temptation from the dark side? When 70% of sgers are using a nikon on the streets, you must not be tempted or peer pressure, thats the life of a canon user.

OT aside.

Pretty unfair to compare 450D or 40D with D90 in terms of specs. A budget cam and a 2 year old cam with this new baby. Definitely the D90 win in terms of iso, performance and extra usage of video capturing.

If you are serious about photography and budget is an issue, be sure to check out the pricing of the whole system. One thing to point out, i wanted to move to dark side because of the temptation of better performance and low cost bodies, but did alot of calculation and decided to stay back in the jedi.

Nikkor lenses, not something within my budget. Thats y u walk on the streets and see most dark side not using their own house lenses.

 

[Lucian]

To the OP:

A few of the people here have given sound advice, namely:
- Take what others say into consideration, but ultimately, make YOUR own choice because it is YOU who will be stuck with whatever you buy. If you want to make a rational choice, do what some have suggested: go down to a shop and try out both! Only when you do that will you possibly find out which cam fits your hands/needs better (which other people may not be bothered by). Of course, it would greatly help if you do some homework before going down so you have a better understanding of what to look out for.

- Also bear in mind that this is not a question of just 450D vs D90. More importantly, when one purchases a dSLR, he is also buying into a SYSTEM - ie. you may end up buying lens, flashes and other accessories from the same brand as well. Therefore, you shouldn't only look at the camera body. Also look into the lens line-up and check which brand has the lens you desire or can afford. This is an understated point because it may not seem impt initially, but the last thing you want is to regret your choice and end up switching camps (it's do-able, but it will be at a loss.)

Speaking from experience here.

 

[egnaro]

maybe panasonic L1 provide the best and most expensive kit lens if TS is concern about kits lens. Leica 14-50 F2.8-3.5 OIS

 

[canik7]

Wrong.

Waiting for DPReview only tells you that both Canon and Nikon cameras do actually perform quite close to each other in terms of picture quality, which is what you'd conclude anyway.

It teaches you that brand does not matter as much in terms of picture quality. How it handles in your hand, how comfortable and intuitive you are with using it; that's what brands count for.

i think you missed the point that i am looking for answer of whether other people have the same findings as i.. I think different people perceive differently but statistic will tell you whether you are right or wrong. BTW, have you done the comparison and find that it is basically the same?

 

[gymak90]

Yea in the past. Guess now Nikon users get to feel the joy of great noise control too.

Haha finally... It seems that this great noise control comes with the adoption of cmos sensors by nikon. Is this only achievable by cmos and not ccd?

Nikkor lenses, not something within my budget. Thats y u walk on the streets and see most dark side not using their own house lenses.

Kit lens loh :bsmilie:
But for lenses like 70-200 f2.8, I have played around with the sigma, canon and nikon versions. You really get what you pay. But at a much higher price...

 

[frederick0814]

Just wanna say hi! I recently bought canon 450d. I'm still a beginner for dslr camera, does anyone here having a template camera settings for sceneries, e.g. sunset, running water, portrait + blur background, etc.

Thanks!!!!

/newbie

 

[kdirectorate]

I have done a fair share of research on dp n lens review site...

swaying between nikon body and canon lens... :dunno:

i like the robust built of nikon body... but at the same time price for canon lens seems to be more attractive... based on photozone review it seems for the same range of lens, canon perfroms slightly better than nikon... have tried nikon d60 n canon 400d.. really like the body of nikon but the non-is kit lens of canon abit disappointing.. haiz...

nd some enlightenment...

 

[calebk]

i think you missed the point that i am looking for answer of whether other people have the same findings as i.. I think different people perceive differently but statistic will tell you whether you are right or wrong. BTW, have you done the comparison and find that it is basically the same?

The following is a true story:

There was once a photo sharing session between a few photographers, one of whom was a very 'loyal' Nikon fanboy (for the lack of a better word; no offence is intended to all Nikon users).

There was another photographer in this group of photographers who used both systems. During the session, he showed the group a photo and said he was testing out his new Canon body and asked for feedback. When it was the Nikon dude's turn, the Nikon fanboy, almost immediately, swore that he saw a hint of softness in the image.

After going one round and getting comments, he then went on to reveal the EXIF data; it was actually shot with the same Nikon camera he'd been using all along.

No, the dude who revealed it is not me, but this story is a true one.