Top 10 reasons why you'll choose d5000 over d90
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Maybe TS should get a Canon beginner dslr instead.. EF (since 1987)or EF-S lens also can use although old manual lens can't. LOL
I agree that D5000 is a great camera at its current price point. I would not hesitate to recommend this camera to anyone out there looking for a dslr. It is capable of very good pictures and quality is at par with D90. I congratulate you on your purchase and I feel for you if and when you encounter D5000 bashing. Thing is, bashing occurs irregardless what camera you get. Nikon owners get bashed by Canon folks. DX people get bashed by FX. D300 owners bash D90/80/70 owners. D60 owners bash D40 owners. It happens and it is going to continue to happen.
However, I do not agree with many of your points of contention. I will play the devil's advocate here and give you a run for your money :devil:.
Some old lenses actually have superior optics. The phrase "they don't make them like they used to" applies to some legendary lenses. One of these lens is the AFD 135mm f/2 DC. It allows you to vary the amount/quality of the bokeh. Other examples are your PC lenses. No AFS can do what these lenses do. And some lens options are just not available to AFS owners. For example, the AiS 50mm/1.2. Sure, D90 cannot meter AiS lenses as well. One has to go up to D300 and above to be able to meter with AiS lenses. But I am just showing you that newest doesn't mean the best.
Also, you are mixing older lenses with "manual focus" lenses. On the D90 AFD lenses will all auto-focus. AFD lenses will not autofocus on D5000. That in itself, opens so much possibilities for the D90. AFD lenses are also a lot cheaper. example AFD 30-700 cost SG$200+.
Also, lens choices depends on the composition and what the photographer wants to achieve. There is no one focal length that is better than another. It is all relative. And if I remember correctly, the 35mm/1.8G has CA that is a lot worse than the 50/1.8D. The CA is even in the bokeh, which is very hard to fix in PP. Don't get me wrong, I like the 35/1.8 too. But I find it not as useful as the 50/1.8. Why? Because I measure usefulness in relation to price as well. Everyone gauge with their own needs and their own scale.
Yes, same sensor same processor. This has been Nikon's practice. D40 and D50 share the same sensor which is a modified D70 sensor. D40x, D60, D3000n and D80 share the the same sensor from D200. D5000 and D90 share the same sensor which is a modified D300 sensor. Other manufacturers do the same thing. Why? Cost savings by reducing production lines, and maximizing use of a product (sensor) during its lifecycle. So differentiation comes from feature set, build and weather sealing. This has always been the case.
One thing, CMOS doesn't mean it is better than CCD. Traditionally CCD is always better than CMOS. CMOS is cheaper to manufacture (if you want to understand the processes in each, I can send you reading material). In actual fact, CMOS has tendency to exhibit more noise. CCD on the other hand sucks up a lot more power. Manufacturing processes and technology have come to a point where CMOS now has caught up with CCD. So remember, that the switch to CMOS is a cost-reduction consideration. Not a performance one.
Dedicated controls and fast access is actually very important to certain kinds of shooting. Just because it does not matter to you, doesn't mean it doesn't matter to other shooters. In manual mode ability to use both dials are heavenly. And 10% on M mode? That is true for you only. I use M mode 80% of the time. Why? I shoot landscape mostly. And for long exposures, M mode is where you get all the flexibility. You cannot do more than 30s on exposure in A mode. For our kind of shooting, we do drag it out a lot. The other part of using M mode is when I shoot with a flash and want to capture more ambient light. pushing ISO up is not the only way to do it. Having a slower shutter speed is another good way to do it. If you want to understand why, I can send you some good reading material.
A lot people talk about having a 18-200mm lens to avoid having to change lenses, so they can "capture the moment" when it comes. It is the same for the quick access buttons. I started out on a D40x. So I know how much these quick access buttons mean to me. Also that top LCD panel is a life saver. Especially when you shoot a lot in the dark like me, and there are other shooters doing long exposures around me, I would prefer not to have my main LCD be on as bright as the rising sun we were trying to capture.
It is cheaper, but not by as much as you suggest. Price difference is only around 300 (body only comparison). I am not sure about how you do it, being able to afford a 35mm, a zoom lens and a sb-400 all with SG$300. You must show me how you do it. Personally, with SG$300 I cannot even afford the 35/1.8G. If you talk about the kit to kit comparison, it is not very fair because, the 18-105VR is a much different and more useful lens than the 18-55VR. Even for kit to kit comparison, the price difference is around $500, how you are able to squeeze in those items really perplexes me. A 35/1.8G and the SB400 would already push me over the edge. You can still fit in a Zoom lens. And what about filters? Those add up u know.
Video is the same as D90 so what's there to compare. They are both OVER-rated. Horizontal scanning issues cause the video to wobble in a Jello like manner if moved very fast. The best video implementation so far on a interchangeble lens digital still camera is the Panasonic GH-1. Nothing comes close at this point in time.
About that flip down screen. Yes it is long over due. But the placement of the hinge is one of the worst execution I have seen coming from Nikon. Try opening that swivel screen when your camera is on a tripod. You will see what I mean. Olympus, Panasonic and Sony got it right.
D90 have those as well.
Wow! I am so impressed. Wait, D60, D3000 has those as well. Do you keep your main LCD on all the time when you shoot? Hmmm :think:
People do what they think is the best for them. What's wrong with that? Some of the DX lenses are hella expensive as well if you ask me. Plus, some FX lenses are the best in their class out there, even for DX bodies. Example, 70-200/2.8 VR. Is there a DX equivalent with f/2.8?
Yup, and you use this 80% of the time? (Following your argument about M mode) ;p. Seriously, this can be achieved easily by using a timed remote from phottix or similar. This is the thing about technology. D90 has some features even the D300 doesn't have. Why? Just by virtue of the fact it is released later than the D300. That's all. This is evident in all camera brands.
See, there are more to it than what you just griped about. I am not saying D5000 sucks eggs. D5000 is a very good and capable camera. Thing is, it presents a different feature set from the D90. Some will happy with D5000, some will need at least a D90, and some will need at least a D300 or FF D700. OF course, I see a lot of the elitism at work in the camera world. But seriously, it is their money. If the newbies want to get a D3x, so be it. If they diss me for owning a D40x saying it is a low class camera (and believe me, it has happened before), so be it. Because at the end of the day, I am not there to show them my camera. It ain't a popularity contest. I am there to shoot. And the resulting picture is all that matters to me. Not some half-baked comments from people who do not matter to me.
Sorry for the long reply... I just came back from a workout session and needed some release. Got carried away... heee
However, I do not agree with many of your points of contention. I will play the devil's advocate here and give you a run for your money :devil:.
Some old lenses actually have superior optics. The phrase "they don't make them like they used to" applies to some legendary lenses. One of these lens is the AFD 135mm f/2 DC. It allows you to vary the amount/quality of the bokeh. Other examples are your PC lenses. No AFS can do what these lenses do. And some lens options are just not available to AFS owners. For example, the AiS 50mm/1.2. Sure, D90 cannot meter AiS lenses as well. One has to go up to D300 and above to be able to meter with AiS lenses. But I am just showing you that newest doesn't mean the best.
Also, you are mixing older lenses with "manual focus" lenses. On the D90 AFD lenses will all auto-focus. AFD lenses will not autofocus on D5000. That in itself, opens so much possibilities for the D90. AFD lenses are also a lot cheaper. example AFD 30-700 cost SG$200+.
Also, lens choices depends on the composition and what the photographer wants to achieve. There is no one focal length that is better than another. It is all relative. And if I remember correctly, the 35mm/1.8G has CA that is a lot worse than the 50/1.8D. The CA is even in the bokeh, which is very hard to fix in PP. Don't get me wrong, I like the 35/1.8 too. But I find it not as useful as the 50/1.8. Why? Because I measure usefulness in relation to price as well. Everyone gauge with their own needs and their own scale.
Yes, same sensor same processor. This has been Nikon's practice. D40 and D50 share the same sensor which is a modified D70 sensor. D40x, D60, D3000n and D80 share the the same sensor from D200. D5000 and D90 share the same sensor which is a modified D300 sensor. Other manufacturers do the same thing. Why? Cost savings by reducing production lines, and maximizing use of a product (sensor) during its lifecycle. So differentiation comes from feature set, build and weather sealing. This has always been the case.
One thing, CMOS doesn't mean it is better than CCD. Traditionally CCD is always better than CMOS. CMOS is cheaper to manufacture (if you want to understand the processes in each, I can send you reading material). In actual fact, CMOS has tendency to exhibit more noise. CCD on the other hand sucks up a lot more power. Manufacturing processes and technology have come to a point where CMOS now has caught up with CCD. So remember, that the switch to CMOS is a cost-reduction consideration. Not a performance one.
Dedicated controls and fast access is actually very important to certain kinds of shooting. Just because it does not matter to you, doesn't mean it doesn't matter to other shooters. In manual mode ability to use both dials are heavenly. And 10% on M mode? That is true for you only. I use M mode 80% of the time. Why? I shoot landscape mostly. And for long exposures, M mode is where you get all the flexibility. You cannot do more than 30s on exposure in A mode. For our kind of shooting, we do drag it out a lot. The other part of using M mode is when I shoot with a flash and want to capture more ambient light. pushing ISO up is not the only way to do it. Having a slower shutter speed is another good way to do it. If you want to understand why, I can send you some good reading material.
A lot people talk about having a 18-200mm lens to avoid having to change lenses, so they can "capture the moment" when it comes. It is the same for the quick access buttons. I started out on a D40x. So I know how much these quick access buttons mean to me. Also that top LCD panel is a life saver. Especially when you shoot a lot in the dark like me, and there are other shooters doing long exposures around me, I would prefer not to have my main LCD be on as bright as the rising sun we were trying to capture.
This I agree. I am one of those that think the smaller, the lighter, the better. But the D90 is a lot more comfortable to hold than my old D40x. At least now my pinky can rest somewhere.
It is cheaper, but not by as much as you suggest. Price difference is only around 300 (body only comparison). I am not sure about how you do it, being able to afford a 35mm, a zoom lens and a sb-400 all with SG$300. You must show me how you do it. Personally, with SG$300 I cannot even afford the 35/1.8G. If you talk about the kit to kit comparison, it is not very fair because, the 18-105VR is a much different and more useful lens than the 18-55VR. Even for kit to kit comparison, the price difference is around $500, how you are able to squeeze in those items really perplexes me. A 35/1.8G and the SB400 would already push me over the edge. You can still fit in a Zoom lens. And what about filters? Those add up u know.
Video is the same as D90 so what's there to compare. They are both OVER-rated. Horizontal scanning issues cause the video to wobble in a Jello like manner if moved very fast. The best video implementation so far on a interchangeble lens digital still camera is the Panasonic GH-1. Nothing comes close at this point in time.
About that flip down screen. Yes it is long over due. But the placement of the hinge is one of the worst execution I have seen coming from Nikon. Try opening that swivel screen when your camera is on a tripod. You will see what I mean. Olympus, Panasonic and Sony got it right.
D90 have those as well.
Wow! I am so impressed. Wait, D60, D3000 has those as well. Do you keep your main LCD on all the time when you shoot? Hmmm :think:
People do what they think is the best for them. What's wrong with that? Some of the DX lenses are hella expensive as well if you ask me. Plus, some FX lenses are the best in their class out there, even for DX bodies. Example, 70-200/2.8 VR. Is there a DX equivalent with f/2.8?
Yup, and you use this 80% of the time? (Following your argument about M mode) ;p. Seriously, this can be achieved easily by using a timed remote from phottix or similar. This is the thing about technology. D90 has some features even the D300 doesn't have. Why? Just by virtue of the fact it is released later than the D300. That's all. This is evident in all camera brands.
See, there are more to it than what you just griped about. I am not saying D5000 sucks eggs. D5000 is a very good and capable camera. Thing is, it presents a different feature set from the D90. Some will happy with D5000, some will need at least a D90, and some will need at least a D300 or FF D700. OF course, I see a lot of the elitism at work in the camera world. But seriously, it is their money. If the newbies want to get a D3x, so be it. If they diss me for owning a D40x saying it is a low class camera (and believe me, it has happened before), so be it. Because at the end of the day, I am not there to show them my camera. It ain't a popularity contest. I am there to shoot. And the resulting picture is all that matters to me. Not some half-baked comments from people who do not matter to me.
Sorry for the long reply... I just came back from a workout session and needed some release. Got carried away... heee
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In this case u shd like Olympus system then eg, E3, E30 & E620. which has the swivel LCD screen which make sense...
thumbs up for daredevil123!! 
the TS sounds like he's suffering from a case of sour grapes, or inferiority complex. You bought a D5000 and feel frustrated with the amount of bashing (warranted or not, is another matter), so you feel the need to justify your purchase.
Having more or less utilized the feature-set of my D80, I'm glad I didn't buy a D40 when first starting out. But like Daredevil said, that doesn't mean the entry-level Nikons are totally useless. Nikon still sells them by the bucketload precisely because there is a huge market out there who are just interested in using their DSLRs more or less the way they used their compacts, but just wanting better image quality. They have no intention to buy extra lenses or accessories.
Walk around Orchard Rd, and you see more and more tourists walking around with DSLRs in hand. And what do they carry? Entry-level DSLR + 18-55 kit lens. This is precisely the market that D3000/D5000 and their competitors are targetting.
the TS sounds like he's suffering from a case of sour grapes, or inferiority complex. You bought a D5000 and feel frustrated with the amount of bashing (warranted or not, is another matter), so you feel the need to justify your purchase.
Having more or less utilized the feature-set of my D80, I'm glad I didn't buy a D40 when first starting out. But like Daredevil said, that doesn't mean the entry-level Nikons are totally useless. Nikon still sells them by the bucketload precisely because there is a huge market out there who are just interested in using their DSLRs more or less the way they used their compacts, but just wanting better image quality. They have no intention to buy extra lenses or accessories.
Walk around Orchard Rd, and you see more and more tourists walking around with DSLRs in hand. And what do they carry? Entry-level DSLR + 18-55 kit lens. This is precisely the market that D3000/D5000 and their competitors are targetting.
gimumancer said:
I'm not sure what this has to do with the D90 vs D5000 comparison. Both cameras are DX-format, so... talking about FX lenses is irrelevant.
Balance....? That's a weird one.
I intend to buy FX cam in the future, so I specially buy a DX-format camera that is heavier, to balance the heavier FX lenses...?
really? does anyone make purchase decisions that way?
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gimumancer said:
having the 2 dials means you can also change white balance easily and quickly.
On a recent shoot, I was alternating between indoors (tungsten lighting) and outdoors (late afternoon). It was a simple process to hold the 'WB' button whilst turning the rear dial to change WB preset, then simultaneously turn the front dial to fine-tune the WB setting.
The top LCD also means you aren't blinded by the screen backlight when trying to adjust settings in poor lighting.
Sony's implementation is also not bad, though I think Panasonic G-1/GH-1 and Olympus have the best swivel screen designs.
:bsmilie: I was in "the mood" for a reply. Not good or bad mood. Just in that state of mind. hard to explain. Glad you enjoyed it :bsmilie:
No. I will not bash you. 5Dm2 is a good camera. Remember to PM me when you do decide to go that route. I would love to buy some 2nd hand stuff from you.
Well these apply to serious photographers like you, but remember, d5k is targeted at more casual photographers like me hence the simpler controls. I just don't see myself buying more then 3 lens in a lifetime, and I am sure I can find 3 compatible lens (nikkor or 3rd party) that would suit 90% my shooting needs. I am sure a lot of casual shooters would do that too.
yah you're right about that especially the perspective. But then again as a casual shooter, I just want a light cheap portrait lens and the 35mm fits the bill. Cheap in comparison with the 50mm 1.4.
Nice info thanks.
Yah that 10% is based on my experience of 2 months shooting. If it's 80% in your case, then yeah you should have a dedicated control, no question about it. I only shoot manual when i dont like the exposure metered by shooting A or S. No need to send me reading material, just give me the keywords and I'll study them myself thanks.
I based this on the COMEX price. d90 sells for 1998, d5k sells for 1299. That's 699$ difference. 35mm is 360$ in cathay. That leaves you 339$. sb400 maybe 200$? 139$ can buy you a cheap 2nd hand zoom lens (nikkor or 3rd party) :bsmilie:
They are over rated for a meticulous individual like you. But videos primary purpose for me is to preserve those fond memories. With HD recording, the videos are crisp. For the horizontal scanning, just move the video slowly. I'm actually just pointing out that d5k can also do what d90 can do.
Bugs me that also, why wouldn't you want it flip down when using a tripod? If you have a tripod, you have the luxury of time to properly compose your pic. Better compose it in viewfinder instead. I just dont see any scenario where you need to flip down the screen when in a tripod. But then again, that's for now since Ive been only using it for 2 months
No it does not. Im referring to the 20 scene modes.
No I dont keep it on all the time, I used it all the time to change setting because it does not have top lcd. When you tilt it in portrait mode, the screen also adjusts. D3k is a different story since it's a newer model.
Ok you're right, maybe I went strongly on that. Apologies for that, to each his own as they say.
Actually never used it yet :bsmilie: but it's just one of the features that the d90 doesn't have. Who knows maybe I'm gonna do a stop motion movie ala tim burton
Yeah thanks for replying, this is actually good so newbies can see both sides and be presented with these arguments. Keep 'em coming..
y bash the brand/models?
jus bash the pic
looks like D5000 is damn superb...mayb i should trade my d90+grip in for 1...
read it as D5K,sounds MUCH MUCH better n lagi pro leh
jus bash the pic
looks like D5000 is damn superb...mayb i should trade my d90+grip in for 1...
read it as D5K,sounds MUCH MUCH better n lagi pro leh
reviews from ard the world
http://www.engadget.com/2009/04/28/nikon-d5000-review-head-to-head-with-d90/
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090419154007AAY8ZKA
http://photo.net/nikon-camera-forum/00TFB1
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1034&message=31807002
ultimately, go for the 1 which u r comfortable with, in terms of the feel and also ur budget.
http://www.engadget.com/2009/04/28/nikon-d5000-review-head-to-head-with-d90/
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090419154007AAY8ZKA
http://photo.net/nikon-camera-forum/00TFB1
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1034&message=31807002
ultimately, go for the 1 which u r comfortable with, in terms of the feel and also ur budget.
thumbs up for daredevil123!!
the TS sounds like he's suffering from a case of sour grapes, or inferiority complex. You bought a D5000 and feel frustrated with the amount of bashing (warranted or not, is another matter), so you feel the need to justify your purchase.
Having more or less utilized the feature-set of my D80, I'm glad I didn't buy a D40 when first starting out. But like Daredevil said, that doesn't mean the entry-level Nikons are totally useless. Nikon still sells them by the bucketload precisely because there is a huge market out there who are just interested in using their DSLRs more or less the way they used their compacts, but just wanting better image quality. They have no intention to buy extra lenses or accessories.
Walk around Orchard Rd, and you see more and more tourists walking around with DSLRs in hand. And what do they carry? Entry-level DSLR + 18-55 kit lens. This is precisely the market that D3000/D5000 and their competitors are targetting.
Yah you are right, I will admit to that I felt that at first, the d5k service advisory even made that worse, but now is a different story, after I have weighed on my plans, I realized I've made the right decision
..but then again, that's for now coz i've been using it for just a short period of time, let us see maybe 1 year from now if still feel the same heheheThat's mainly the processing hardware. The actual software they load onto there can be different.
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