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Thread: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

  1. #21

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    Use dof calculator

  2. #22

    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    Quote Originally Posted by ahboy168 View Post
    Not all lens at same focus length and aperture, and assume all equal give the same amount of oof blur.
    Normally, there is a reason why some lens are cheaper ...
    Wrong, they WILL give the same amount of OOF blur. But that does not mean they will both have the same quality of bokeh.
    Alpha

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinholecam

    You don't need a lens.
    You need a technique

    http://blog.buiphotography.com/2009/...th-directions/

    Its also good to just say that you want a shallow DOF portrait, rather than use the term now commonly abused here as 'bokeh shot', (bokeh is only referencing to the quality of the OOF rendering).
    If you need shallow DOF, the factors are subject distance, aperture and bkgnd distance. (no guarantee that bokeh is 'good')
    If bokeh is wanted (subjective as to what looks appealing), then it has something to do with lens design and bkgnd type.
    But he still need a slight longer focal length lens to achieve this effectively. Though his lens arsenal is more than adequate for that. I feel the 35mm F/1.4 is for scene portrait with human subject in it with a slightly blur background for his purpose in traveling.
    Equipment: D800|D700|11-16|28-75|105 Micro VR|50 F1.4G|85 F1.8G
    Through the Lens of Cowseye

  4. #24

    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cowseye View Post
    But he still need a slight longer focal length lens to achieve this effectively. Though his lens arsenal is more than adequate for that. I feel the 35mm F/1.4 is for scene portrait with human subject in it with a slightly blur background for his purpose in traveling.
    Just use a cheaper 85/1.8, 100/2.8.
    Expectation need to be realistic using a wide angle lens for less dof.
    The usual rules apply (ie. F-stop, subject distance, bkgnd distance, focal length)

  5. #25

    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    Are you using 35mm onto a FF body? That would be wide angle portrait already. FF should pair with 50mm lens where as DX pair with 35mm for your full body portrait photo.

  6. #26
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    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    Generally, most people will think of 85/135mm when talking about lens for creamy portrait. 35mm is more of a walk around lens, one which you can still use when there is space limitation, e.g. a night market.

    Wide angle primes are good for giving thin dof while capturing the environment, like environment portrait. The environment here could refer to the general environment (like a market, scenery or back alley) or a famous landmark(some famous tower or statue).

    If you want the creamy background, just use a long lens. That is, a 135mm @f/2 will give more background blur than a 50mm f/1.2 at the same subject size in the frame. You will get more dof with the 135mm too. Of course, we might not always have the luxury of space to stand so far away to use the 135mm, so that is where a shorter lens is useful.

    http://toothwalker.org/optics/dof.html
    http://www.bobatkins.com/photography...cal/bokeh.html
    5D III l 14/2.8 l 24/1.4L II l Σ 50/1.4 l Σ 150/2.8 macro l 28-75/2.8 l

  7. #27

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    Exactly. The right tool for the right job. It is not always the case u can play with distance. So larger format camera still can offer something unique.

    But of course a good portrait does not have to be a bokeh one, or in proper but longer terms, a portrait with shallow dof. Wa so long leh... Thirsty liao.. I now know why ppl come out with short names...

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinholecam

    Just use a cheaper 85/1.8, 100/2.8.
    Expectation need to be realistic using a wide angle lens for less dof.
    The usual rules apply (ie. F-stop, subject distance, bkgnd distance, focal length)
    Agree. But since he has a 24-70mm and a 70-200mm, he can employ those lenses for a creamier bg compare to a 35mm while using brenizer method. Like u said he probably dun need a new lens.
    Equipment: D800|D700|11-16|28-75|105 Micro VR|50 F1.4G|85 F1.8G
    Through the Lens of Cowseye

  9. #29

    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    For those who use crop factor APS-C, 35mm f1.4 will probably still not be enough to satisfy that bokeh-backgroundblur-hunger.

    My recommendations are simply; save up and go to full-frame. There are plenty of a selections for 50mm and various 85mms that will exhibit their full capabilities.

    After using 35 f1.4 for a while, my conclusion is that it still has insufficient depth and too much bg blur for certain purposes. This is the big trade-off and difference when wanting more light and ISO performance in full-frame.

  10. #30
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    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    you want cheap and shallow depth of field, get samyang 85mm f/1.4. google it, seems like a gd performer and inexpensive.

  11. #31
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    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    no point talk and talk ... can someone show some pics illustrating the difference between a good, average and poor bokeh .... i.e. different lens taken at the same F-stop, FL & lighting condition on the same subject?

  12. #32

    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    Quote Originally Posted by alantkh View Post
    I bought it to shoot portraits of my family on my upcoming Trip.

    I have the 14-24mm and 70-200mm so the 35mm is a nice addition. Frankly, when I buy 35mm f1.4, the intention is not to blur the background into oblivion. One of the idea of taking travel portraits for me is the background. It is nice to blur the background a little so the subject pops out though. At 35mm and shooting full body portraits, I THINK I might need f1.4 to get the kind of blur I want. Especially sometimes my subject don't really fill up the frame as I want to show a bit more of the places I go...

    I think the 35mm f1.4 is a very unique lens, hopefullly it will give me a different kind of picture. The 14-24mm and 70-200mm are very distinctive lens.
    I second this. A 85/1.4 and a 35/1.4 fill different needs. Can you imagine that you have to keep backing up to take a full body shot while on holiday...?
    A 35 gives a different "feel" as it takes in a wider fov while maintaining the size of your subject in the photo as compared to a 85. It should be a great addition as a "touring" lens.
    Last edited by coolthought; 27th October 2011 at 06:42 PM.
    Coolthought - 冷静思考 - クールだ http://xaa.xanga.com/0aba0666d143253.../t35917343.gif

  13. #33

    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    Quote Originally Posted by fireput View Post
    no point talk and talk ... can someone show some pics illustrating the difference between a good, average and poor bokeh .... i.e. different lens taken at the same F-stop, FL & lighting condition on the same subject?
    Then you can go google and search for yourself. A forum is for discussion ("talk") anyway.

  14. #34

    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    how about these few photos? Taken with a 35/1.8 lens and crop sensor camera. Is the dof thin enough for your desired "bokeh portraits"?
    Shayna | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
    Untitled | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
    Garrett | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

    PS. not mine photos
    Last edited by coolthought; 27th October 2011 at 09:02 PM.
    Coolthought - 冷静思考 - クールだ http://xaa.xanga.com/0aba0666d143253.../t35917343.gif

  15. #35

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    Not bad. But none r full body. ff is still better lah...

  16. #36

    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    Quote Originally Posted by sfoto100 View Post
    Not bad. But none r full body. ff is still better lah...
    note that these are shot with a crop sensor body and a 35/1.8 and not with a full frame body with a 35/1.4
    and you didn't state it have to be a full body portraits.
    Last edited by coolthought; 27th October 2011 at 09:47 PM.
    Coolthought - 冷静思考 - クールだ http://xaa.xanga.com/0aba0666d143253.../t35917343.gif

  17. #37

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    I did state in first post what.

  18. #38

    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    Quote Originally Posted by sfoto100 View Post
    I did state in first post what.
    ah...my mistake...
    I have to dig real deep to find these few photos.... not many who bought a 35 prime are doing thin dof portrait shots.
    It is so happen that I am looking at for photos taken with a 35/1.8 that I found these.... I think 35/1.4 may still be possible on a cropped sensor body... probably get the person to curl up. lol
    Coolthought - 冷静思考 - クールだ http://xaa.xanga.com/0aba0666d143253.../t35917343.gif

  19. #39

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    Actually even with ff, the dof will still be wider than using 50 , 85. It is no big deal, most know it. But I dont in the beginning n spend so much time researching on samyang 35 mm ... Straining my eyes.. Checking price .. All the while forgot this basic fact that longer focal length give narrower dof.. Hence I post this to remind others..

  20. #40

    Default Re: using 35mm f1.4 on crop for bokeh portraits - forget it!

    it depend on your shooting distance from subject and preference. anyway, that is what the bns here is for.[
    Coolthought - 冷静思考 - クールだ http://xaa.xanga.com/0aba0666d143253.../t35917343.gif

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