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Thread: Groupon Deals Photographers

  1. #41

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by sinned79 View Post
    let's be the devil here.

    start a brand name (which you will close down and start another).

    hire free photographers who dun mind working for free to build up their portfolio.

    advertise thru groupon and offer too good to be true photography service at a peanut price.

    let these free photographers do the job while you collect the payment.

    close down this brand name, start a new one and repeat the cycle.

    not bad eh?
    *blacklist sinned79* hahaha

  2. #42

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    well, if you still want to use Groupon as a marketing channels, pls try to do this :

    1. Negotiate a lower commission to Groupon. Usually it is 50% but it can be negotiated to be lower . Believe me, Groupon need you more as an merchant rather than you needing them as an marketing channel. Have Groupon send you the check as soon as the deal is closed!

    2. Offer an lower discount like 30-40% . Offering 80% discount is just killing yrself. the maths has been worked out by the others in the earlier posts. Potentially u are just earning $5-$10 an hour. This is before costs. So most likely you are losing money. Might as well go and work in a fast food chain.

    3. Set a limit to the the no of coupons that can be sold. Your weekends will be gone if you sell 500 coupons. and there will be a lot of buyers will be unhappy since they can't book a weekend slot with you.

    5. here is the secret- group buying or bulk purchase for photo shoots is not new. It has already been going on in the various forums. the difference is for such deals, they are win win situations.

    Remember ..dun kill yr brand (unlesss you do not have one to start with)..and yourself (from overworking).
    :)

  3. #43

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by kentwong81 View Post
    Think about it. If you can recruit many photographer-wanna-be for free from the forums, you collect $15 without doing the photoshoot and editing yourself, why not? Sigh...
    but i saw some deals not that much discount..... so why offer 90% discount? so i wonder is it becos groupons make it 90% discount?
    Eat breath LIVERPOOL!!!

  4. #44

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by futsal123 View Post
    Really got such ppl ah? Haiz...
    I know there are MANY photographer-wanna-be who are willing to do for FREE. And the people with very good "business-minded" will fully "utilize" this "unlimited" resources to earn their own money.

    This idea might have started some time ago and we only discover it now. Pity those photographer-wanna-be who have been exploited.
    Last edited by kentwong81; 27th September 2011 at 12:01 PM.
    Kent Wong Photography |Leica Q & Leica M-P 240 | 75 & 28mm Summilux

  5. #45

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by fotoudavid View Post
    but i saw some deals not that much discount..... so why offer 90% discount? so i wonder is it becos groupons make it 90% discount?
    Yah the pricing doesn't seem right. But i got a feeling that the 'real' sales comes after the shoot. Additional pic, $30 etc, hardcopy ah...have! additional $50 for framed up etc etc.

  6. #46

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by kentwong81 View Post
    I know there are MANY photographer-wanna-be who are willing to do for FREE. And the people with very good "business-minded" will fully "utilize" this "unlimited" resources to earn their own money.

    This idea might have started some time ago and we only discover it now. Pity those photographer-wanna-be who have been exploited.
    Although it's a business world, I'll say good luck to the hirer if he/she feels that they can answer to their consciences for whatever they did.

  7. #47

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by futsal123 View Post
    although it's a business world, i'll say good luck to the hirer if he/she feels that they can answer to their consciences for whatever they did.
    like like like

  8. #48
    Moderator catchlights's Avatar
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    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by futsal123 View Post
    Good to see different views here. At least everyone might find something useful to learn.

    Ok, on ur views, there is 2 points here that we should establish:
    1. The analogy is from $2 jump to $8. Of cos it will cause a shock to some. But for photography services on Groupon, it's different. Ppl know that on a normal day, a 90min shoot is not $15. Consumers know that this is an offer. Like I said, lowballers will always remain lowball. There are those who are 'normal'.
    2. Groupon doesn't kill the brand. Eu Yan Seng, Manhantten Fish market, dian xiao er is doing it also.
    they have different range of products, but photographers unlikely to offer so many range of services or products

    Quote Originally Posted by futsal123 View Post
    Really got such ppl ah? Haiz...
    thanks to our members highlighted to me, now at least two companies are looking for weekend warriors here.

    Quote Originally Posted by futsal123 View Post
    Yah the pricing doesn't seem right. But i got a feeling that the 'real' sales comes after the shoot. Additional pic, $30 etc, hardcopy ah...have! additional $50 for framed up etc etc.
    read my previous post and sprewell's blog on how Groupon works.
    Shoot to Live, Live to Shoot
    www.benjaminloo.com | iStock portfolio

  9. #49

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    How you know all the details? You being approached?

    Quote Originally Posted by sfoto100 View Post
    some of them go advertise in the Services Wanted section. They look for free lance photographers and then they bind you by contract, asking you to commit to several weekends per month.. so they don't have to do the **** work... those photographers who took up the jobs have to bring their equipment, lights, shoot and then edit!!

  10. #50

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    i think i will send request to groupon see how they response haha
    Eat breath LIVERPOOL!!!

  11. #51

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    My photo page: TDR Photography

  12. #52

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by TheoDR View Post
    Using uncouth, sexist language in their advertisment. They can only attract the type of clients they want to attract.
    WTB Manfrotto RC4 L Bracket

  13. #53

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    This Groupon thing is good!

    It keeps all the cheapo photogs busy and tired so that means more good gigs will go real photogs.

  14. #54
    Member sprewell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by sjackal View Post
    Using uncouth, sexist language in their advertisment. They can only attract the type of clients they want to attract.
    That page was created in jest and to mock the Groupon incident lahhhh
    Hasselblad 503CW | 100mm f/3.5 CF | Contax 645 | Zeiss 80mm f/2 | Website

  15. #55

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by sprewell View Post
    That page was created in jest and to mock the Groupon incident lahhhh
    i like it liao!

    we need to post some "work" there u know

  16. #56

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by sprewell View Post
    That page was created in jest and to mock the Groupon incident lahhhh
    I see.
    WTB Manfrotto RC4 L Bracket

  17. #57

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by futsal123 View Post
    Good to see different views here. At least everyone might find something useful to learn.

    Ok, on ur views, there is 2 points here that we should establish:
    1. The analogy is from $2 jump to $8. Of cos it will cause a shock to some. But for photography services on Groupon, it's different. Ppl know that on a normal day, a 90min shoot is not $15. Consumers know that this is an offer. Like I said, lowballers will always remain lowball. There are those who are 'normal'.
    2. Groupon doesn't kill the brand. Eu Yan Seng, Manhantten Fish market, dian xiao er is doing it also.
    Bro, this is your central argument. It hinges on the assumption that people know that on a 'normal day', 'a 90 min shoot is not $15'.

    The problem is that you apply this to all companies equally. This is not true. Most consumers do in fact know that on a 'normal day' for Eu Yan Seng, Manhatten Fish Market, Dian Xiao Er, the price is not what Groupon offers. I 100% agree. So if you have this kind of brand, sure, consider Groupon.

    However, how do they know what 'a 90 min shoot' is worth for a photographer they've never heard of? If a newbie photographer is charging, a 90 min shoot may not even be worth $15. If a pro is charging, then sure, it's probably normally far more than $15- but how would they know you're a pro, and what your 'normal day' rates are?

    Besides, say they know your 'normal day' rates. What's stopping me from going to ANOTHER pro doing Groupon as well the next time I need a 90 min shoot? So each Pro does it only once, but visitors to Groupon get an endless stream of 'pro photographers' charging $15. In short, a 'normal price' for these customers are now... $15.

    You see that with no-name salons or restaurants with no established price. Today I eat there on a Groupon deal, tomorrow I eat somewhere else, also on a Groupon deal. I understand they are all professional restaurants for whom a "normal day" is not this price; but I have the ability to choose from different professional restaurants everyday. Who earns from all this? Groupon.

    But this is not even a no-name salon or restaurant, with significant cost overheads and fixed costs. You are an individual providing a service. They can't walk in, look at your establishment, and know that a ten-course dinner here surely couldn't cost $15. Instead, you are providing a service. Unless you are like a David Gan, for whom everybody knows how much your service is worth, unfortunately, customers who have never heard of you will just assume you are worth $15.

    This is not 'lowballing'. It is simply saying, 'well, I have no way of telling how good you are... I can't look at the product, I can't look at your overheads, I can't look at the freshness of your ingredients vs other restaurants. You may have good gear, but so does the other pro down the street. You give me nice photos, but almost all wedding photos I see are great. I'm really not so discerning between photographers, unlike for restaurants. So how to tell how good you are? Well, since you charge $15, you are willing to take $15. You must be worth $15."

    Again, this is not lowballing. It is taking your price as an indication of quality.

  18. #58

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    BTW, for anyone who doesn't know (some people seem confused).

    Groupon comes to you and insists that you offer a discount. Say 80% off. They then say, I will sell coupons for you, and I take a commission- about half. So the starving restaurant or photographer thinks, "wow, I don't pay any money, and I get cash upfront!"

    Yes, but your brand dies, your margins suffer, and guess what, that repeat business you're counting on? He just bought another Groupon deal offered by your competitor. Eventually the whole industry ends up killing themselves.

    Here's a link to an article explaining one owner's experience about how her brand was killed (the owner runs a restaurant, but her experience of how even LOYAL customers eventually ask for discounts is telling):
    http://posiescafe.com/wp/?p=316
    Last edited by cannedpineapples; 27th September 2011 at 05:37 PM.

  19. #59

    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    Quote Originally Posted by cannedpineapples View Post
    BTW, for anyone who doesn't know (some people seem confused).

    Groupon comes to you and insists that you offer a discount. Say 80% off. They then say, I will sell coupons for you, and I take a commission- about half. So the starving restaurant or photographer thinks, "wow, I don't pay any money, and I get cash upfront!"

    Yes, but your brand dies, your margins suffer, and guess what, that repeat business you're counting on? He just bought another Groupon deal offered by your competitor. Eventually the whole industry ends up killing themselves.

    Here's a link to an article explaining one owner's experience about how her brand was killed (the owner runs a restaurant, but her experience of how even LOYAL customers eventually ask for discounts is telling):
    http://posiescafe.com/wp/?p=316
    Gosh, that's a good read!
    My photo page: TDR Photography

  20. #60
    Deregistered allenleonhart's Avatar
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    Default Re: Groupon Deals Photographers

    just to highlight, at least to my (limited) knowledge of the people i have interacted in the industry.


    many practice this, even wedding photographers/agencies.

    by being the contractor, they take up job offers at X rate. after which, they would hire a freelance/ supposedly associate photographer at 70% of the offer and effectively do nothing but make a phone call.

    after which, freelance takes over and does almost everything.

    not that i'm frowning on this practice, as it might provide jobs to people who otherwise might not get it, but i question the effectiveness and how much middle man money can be absorbed, which might had allowed the photographer himself to do his own advertising if he decides to charge that high.

    if i were to push it a little further, take a job, pass it to a guy who does it for free for portfolio, they can potentially earn a lot.

    but all these are merely hypothetical. we can raise these till the cows come home....

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