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Thread: Beginner to dslr

  1. #21

    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by ZerocoolAstra View Post
    I don't think I will live long enough to see the day that DSLRs fade away

    Mirrorless cameras... hmmm, still nowhere near in my opinion.
    Why not? What benefit is there in sticking to a large sized DSLR when mirrorless cameras offer similar image quality but in a much smaller package?
    Samsung NX10+30mm, Fuji S6500FD

  2. #22
    Senior Member luckyorange's Avatar
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    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahmatt View Post
    Why not? What benefit is there in sticking to a large sized DSLR when mirrorless cameras offer similar image quality but in a much smaller package?
    well i guess its up to preference =)
    Last edited by luckyorange; 11th May 2011 at 12:20 PM.
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  3. #23
    Senior Member ZerocoolAstra's Avatar
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    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahmatt View Post
    Why not? What benefit is there in sticking to a large sized DSLR when mirrorless cameras offer similar image quality but in a much smaller package?
    Coz image quality is not the only defining criteria in choosing a camera system.
    Anyway this is all personal opinion.
    I'm glad you are enjoying the use of your mirrorless APS-C camera very much

  4. #24
    Member Eye4you's Avatar
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    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahmatt View Post
    Why not? What benefit is there in sticking to a large sized DSLR when mirrorless cameras offer similar image quality but in a much smaller package?
    IMO the first place you have made the right decision that is to ask before buying, before I bought my DSLR I have a Fujifilm finepix ( cant remember the model )and was happy with it till the day it lost.After the lost incident I thought of getting a DSLR and just blindly choose a cam without asking and end up with again Fujifilm HS10 as I was persuade by the salesman that it is a good camera, at first I was content with it till the day I meet a friend that show me a photo with some creative shots that my bridge cam cant do! Then I realize to myself that that is what I want to do at the first place!

    Well learning by the costly mistake I decide to do research on what is DSLR and came across CS and now Im an happy owner of a DSLR camera.Even thou there is not much time for me and my DSLR I still drag myself to do research on how to shoot with it, trust me it is fun to learn and worth it!

  5. #25
    Member Alan Chan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahmatt View Post
    This is why I eventually went with a mirrorless option (Samsung NX) - I personally think that DSLRs will fade away soon anyway.
    Mirrorless and DSLR serves two very different market. there are still many reason to use a DSLR over a mirrorless, and vice versa.

    and sensor is also a factor, why do you think medium format is still around for $50k? think dynamic range.

    like what zerocool mentioned, both with improve alone their own path. Its hard to replace a D3s using a mirrorless.
    if nothing else, my finger will go numb shooting with a tiny camera all day, especially with a heavy lens. oh and i need the viewfinder very badly... lol
    Last edited by Alan Chan; 11th May 2011 at 12:53 PM.
    Nikon D700| 70-200mm f/2.8G VR2| 28-70mm f/2.8D| 85mm f/1.8G| 50mm f/1.8G| SB900/SB28| MB-D10

  6. #26

    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    well i saw the rumors of an FF NEX on Alpha Rumors. we'll see how that progresses the "mirrorless domination" then. LOL.

    right now, it's still cool to sling a huge black bling-with-lens on the neck

  7. #27
    Senior Member luckyorange's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by kei1309 View Post
    well i saw the rumors of an FF NEX on Alpha Rumors. we'll see how that progresses the "mirrorless domination" then. LOL.

    right now, it's still cool to sling a huge black bling-with-lens on the neck
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  8. #28

    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahmatt View Post
    Why not? What benefit is there in sticking to a large sized DSLR when mirrorless cameras offer similar image quality but in a much smaller package?
    so meaning? sell our dslr and change into mirrorless camera?

  9. #29
    Senior Member ZerocoolAstra's Avatar
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    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by nicorn View Post
    so meaning? sell our dslr and change into mirrorless camera?
    It's entirely your choice
    Exploring! :)

  10. #30

    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by ZerocoolAstra View Post
    It's entirely your choice
    cant as i like large sized dslr

  11. #31

    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan Chan View Post
    Mirrorless and DSLR serves two very different market. there are still many reason to use a DSLR over a mirrorless, and vice versa.

    and sensor is also a factor, why do you think medium format is still around for $50k? think dynamic range.

    like what zerocool mentioned, both with improve alone their own path. Its hard to replace a D3s using a mirrorless.
    if nothing else, my finger will go numb shooting with a tiny camera all day, especially with a heavy lens. oh and i need the viewfinder very badly... lol
    I do not think the markets differ as much as you think. What is the proportion of medium format users compared to entry level, professional APS-C and full-frame DSLRs? I think it is very very small, and getting smaller all the time.

    The quality of the modern APS-C sensor has improved a lot compared to say 5 years ago, and professionals are getting sufficient resolution, dynamic range and high ISO IQ without having to go medium format. Even the full-frame camera is under threat from APS-C - I see less and less difference with each passing generation. Full-frame camera makers are increasingly riding on prestige and smooth marketing.

    Anyway, all the reasons for staying DSLR are losing weight now. Optical view finder? EVFs are getting damn smooth now. Phase detect AF? Contrast detect AF is now equally fast and possibly more accurate. Battery life? New mirrorless cameras are getting about 400 shots (which is not to be laughed at), and you can still buy an extra battery and save weight. Compatibility with legacy lenses? Plenty of adapters now available.

    My belief is that in the very near future APS-C sensors will be put into mirrorless feature rich cameras for the professional. The Samsung NX20 is rumored to be this type of camera. Some companies have already switched allegiance completely - Olympus is not making DSLRs anymore. Sony is switching to the translucent mirror (which is neither here nor there but at least they acknowledge that small size is where the future is). Pentax has announced the intention of producing a mirrorless camera. Canikon are still hawing on the possibility, but the market will prevail I think. The consumer wants smaller, so smaller will be the future.
    Samsung NX10+30mm, Fuji S6500FD

  12. #32

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahmatt

    I do not think the markets differ as much as you think. What is the proportion of medium format users compared to entry level, professional APS-C and full-frame DSLRs? I think it is very very small, and getting smaller all the time.

    The quality of the modern APS-C sensor has improved a lot compared to say 5 years ago, and professionals are getting sufficient resolution, dynamic range and high ISO IQ without having to go medium format. Even the full-frame camera is under threat from APS-C - I see less and less difference with each passing generation. Full-frame camera makers are increasingly riding on prestige and smooth marketing.

    Anyway, all the reasons for staying DSLR are losing weight now. Optical view finder? EVFs are getting damn smooth now. Phase detect AF? Contrast detect AF is now equally fast and possibly more accurate. Battery life? New mirrorless cameras are getting about 400 shots (which is not to be laughed at), and you can still buy an extra battery and save weight. Compatibility with legacy lenses? Plenty of adapters now available.

    My belief is that in the very near future APS-C sensors will be put into mirrorless feature rich cameras for the professional. The Samsung NX20 is rumored to be this type of camera. Some companies have already switched allegiance completely - Olympus is not making DSLRs anymore. Sony is switching to the translucent mirror (which is neither here nor there but at least they acknowledge that small size is where the future is). Pentax has announced the intention of producing a mirrorless camera. Canikon are still hawing on the possibility, but the market will prevail I think. The consumer wants smaller, so smaller will be the future.
    As you said, this is your belief, why force it onto others? I believe that there's a market for both systems. Personally I like the feel and grip of a larger body in my hands. It's just a different feel from a compact sized camera.

  13. #33

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    Luckyorange: I don't think lugging wifey plus kids to shoot would be the same as u and yr gf shooting. Ha ha.

    Personally I think with advancing technology, mirriorless or not is one preferences. Maybe I am old sch la, let's why I prefer dslr ha ha.
    Weather is 1 enemy we can't really predict, even with my P&S camera. But u quite sure even rainy days can take gd pics.

  14. #34

    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    I am not trying to force anything on anybody. Just observing the market trends.

    Mirrorless is a technology. It does not necessarily have to translate to small size and compact design. No doubt in the future camera makers will design "mirrorless" bodies with nice fat grips with plenty of buttons and wheels to cater for the market.
    Samsung NX10+30mm, Fuji S6500FD

  15. #35
    Senior Member luckyorange's Avatar
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    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by fringster0 View Post
    Luckyorange: I don't think lugging wifey plus kids to shoot would be the same as u and yr gf shooting. Ha ha.

    Personally I think with advancing technology, mirriorless or not is one preferences. Maybe I am old sch la, let's why I prefer dslr ha ha.
    Weather is 1 enemy we can't really predict, even with my P&S camera. But u quite sure even rainy days can take gd pics.
    Oh!!! thats true. But its fun to shoot alone too~! maybe with some shooting kaki? =) well we can go shoot tgt if u dont mind haha
    Last edited by luckyorange; 11th May 2011 at 02:37 PM.
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  16. #36
    Moderator daredevil123's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahmatt

    Why not? What benefit is there in sticking to a large sized DSLR when mirrorless cameras offer similar image quality but in a much smaller package?
    Shoot with a Dslr or medium format and you will know why.

    And there are a lot of advantages of semi pro crop sensor bodies over entry level. The fact that you don't use them personally doesn't mean they are useless.

  17. #37
    Moderator daredevil123's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahmatt
    I am not trying to force anything on anybody. Just observing the market trends.

    Mirrorless is a technology. It does not necessarily have to translate to small size and compact design. No doubt in the future camera makers will design "mirrorless" bodies with nice fat grips with plenty of buttons and wheels to cater for the market.
    The day evf and sensor is as good as our naked eyes, will be the day optical viewfinder be facing phasing out.

    And that day is very very very far away and probably not in our lifetimes.

    For the casual shooter, mirrorless may make sense. But not for commercial and serious camera work.

  18. #38
    Member Alan Chan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahmatt View Post
    I do not think the markets differ as much as you think. What is the proportion of medium format users compared to entry level, professional APS-C and full-frame DSLRs? I think it is very very small, and getting smaller all the time.

    The quality of the modern APS-C sensor has improved a lot compared to say 5 years ago, and professionals are getting sufficient resolution, dynamic range and high ISO IQ without having to go medium format. Even the full-frame camera is under threat from APS-C - I see less and less difference with each passing generation. Full-frame camera makers are increasingly riding on prestige and smooth marketing.

    Anyway, all the reasons for staying DSLR are losing weight now. Optical view finder? EVFs are getting damn smooth now. Phase detect AF? Contrast detect AF is now equally fast and possibly more accurate. Battery life? New mirrorless cameras are getting about 400 shots (which is not to be laughed at), and you can still buy an extra battery and save weight. Compatibility with legacy lenses? Plenty of adapters now available.

    My belief is that in the very near future APS-C sensors will be put into mirrorless feature rich cameras for the professional. The Samsung NX20 is rumored to be this type of camera. Some companies have already switched allegiance completely - Olympus is not making DSLRs anymore. Sony is switching to the translucent mirror (which is neither here nor there but at least they acknowledge that small size is where the future is). Pentax has announced the intention of producing a mirrorless camera. Canikon are still hawing on the possibility, but the market will prevail I think. The consumer wants smaller, so smaller will be the future.
    there are many ways to look at things.

    1) market wise, why samsung and sony is paving their own ways? maybe not to fight head on with the big boys as they are late comers, altho sony bought over minotar (correct me if i'm wrong about this), so they attack on the sector that is not covered by nikon or canon?

    2) crop-sensor were made before full frame, would canon and nikon waste their resources if there is no diif? APS-C can only take a range of about 5 stops of light while medium can take up to 12-14 stops.

    3) yes medium format is a niche market, and so will be dslr even if mirrorless catch up. well dslr has always been niche market for many decades until recent years even before mirrorless.

    4) its funny coz even when using my D90, my last two fingers can get numb when shooting for too long without putting it down. after adding the battery grip, the problem is gone! funny how size works both ways, there are girls who want small camera and guys who want big ones.

    even in my previous post, i never meant mirrorless to be useless or inferior, and i still think its the users choice. the market trend may only reflects the entry and hobby level users, it might be different in the professional world. ofcoz i wouldnt know how many in CS had switch over to mirrorless from dslr.
    Last edited by Alan Chan; 11th May 2011 at 03:05 PM.
    Nikon D700| 70-200mm f/2.8G VR2| 28-70mm f/2.8D| 85mm f/1.8G| 50mm f/1.8G| SB900/SB28| MB-D10

  19. #39
    Member Alan Chan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by fringster0 View Post
    Luckyorange: I don't think lugging wifey plus kids to shoot would be the same as u and yr gf shooting. Ha ha.
    i bring my D700 on many of my family outing, even to the playgrounds.
    Nikon D700| 70-200mm f/2.8G VR2| 28-70mm f/2.8D| 85mm f/1.8G| 50mm f/1.8G| SB900/SB28| MB-D10

  20. #40

    Default Re: Beginner to dslr

    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil123 View Post
    The day evf and sensor is as good as our naked eyes, will be the day optical viewfinder be facing phasing out.

    And that day is very very very far away and probably not in our lifetimes.

    For the casual shooter, mirrorless may make sense. But not for commercial and serious camera work.
    I disagree actually. Who could have predicted the almost complete phase out of film cameras 10 years back? But now hardly anyone uses film.

    EVFs are already very good, almost good enough for sports photography. And EVFs provide more information on screen so in some ways it is preferred.

    Sensor quality is independent of whether the camera is mirrorless or a DSLR. A mirrorless camera may even have medium format sensors or full frame sensors in the near future. Why should mirrorless cameras be restricted to APS-C only?
    Samsung NX10+30mm, Fuji S6500FD

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