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Thread: How do you all do it?

  1. #21
    Member iamnubie's Avatar
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    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    I can take better picture than the photographer i hired for my wedding, but that doesn't mean i will not respect them, he has his own value and he helps me to take pictures, if those "professional geared relatives" talk bad about you, then they are just talk kok, if the married couple ask them to do the coverage i am sure they don't want to spend their time doing it, they just want to be ACKNOWLEDGE as BETTER PHOTOGRAPHER with BETTER GEAR, they have the gear (and maybe some skill) but they will never have the mental

    don't be burdened, no need to care this kind of people, just improve yourself
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  2. #22
    Member mabmy's Avatar
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    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    After reading through every post.. i understand that everyone has one common viewpoint. Don't like it, don't shoot it no matter what. A very good advice i must say. The thing is, in real life situation, i am not spared from people close to me from taking the job. Honestly to me, its never about the money. I don't see photography as a good stable/side source of income for me. The hassle is just not worth it like some of the examples mentioned by kiwi2. Myself. i have never quote a price to them,$500 or less are always quote by the "clients" themselves, when i ask them what is their budget and i just simply agree, not before i recommend them to look elsewhere of course. Same routine and answer every time.. giving me those puppy eyes look. I enjoy being there seeing people having fun, but to document it, i really have no interest.
    Your pictures speaks for you, not your camera.

  3. #23

    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Agetan View Post
    I just say things in my perspective.

    As with relative and friends, I don't normally do their wedding unless they can treat me like a photographer. So I deal with them like I deal with any of my clients. That is to ensure you prepare the clients as well as possible so they understand and respect you as a photographer.
    Just a thought on this one, when you are approached by relatives and friends, do you attend the wedding as a guest as well? As in do you sit down for the food and chit chat in between the important events (march-in, toasting, speech etc)?

  4. #24

    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Quote Originally Posted by mabmy View Post
    After reading through every post.. i understand that everyone has one common viewpoint. Don't like it, don't shoot it no matter what. A very good advice i must say. The thing is, in real life situation, i am not spared from people close to me from taking the job. Honestly to me, its never about the money. I don't see photography as a good stable/side source of income for me. The hassle is just not worth it like some of the examples mentioned by kiwi2. Myself. i have never quote a price to them,$500 or less are always quote by the "clients" themselves, when i ask them what is their budget and i just simply agree, not before i recommend them to look elsewhere of course. Same routine and answer every time.. giving me those puppy eyes look. I enjoy being there seeing people having fun, but to document it, i really have no interest.
    Then, what is your point?

    If you don't liketo do something, then why are you doing it? If you weren't, then, what is the point of this thread. IF you are shooting even if you are not enjoying the experience and have no interest in it, then, WTF, why are you still doing it?
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  5. #25

    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    No interest means raise price. With the $$$, get 2 tokong dSLRs and tokong Nikkor lenses. 4/3 keep as backup's backup (just squeeze into da bag)
    Last edited by 2100; 4th January 2011 at 06:47 PM.

  6. #26

    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Interesting thread!

  7. #27
    Member Kboy123's Avatar
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    Default

    Ts is really lucky to have friends ask to shoot for their weddings, i asked mine to let me shoot for their weddings, they asked me to perform a gig for them.. Haha

  8. #28
    Member mabmy's Avatar
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    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuffed View Post
    Just a thought on this one, when you are approached by relatives and friends, do you attend the wedding as a guest as well? As in do you sit down for the food and chit chat in between the important events (march-in, toasting, speech etc)?
    No this means i attend as a photographer. No chit chatting or sitting down to have a meal. I only do all that after the event.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadpoet View Post
    Then, what is your point?

    If you don't liketo do something, then why are you doing it? If you weren't, then, what is the point of this thread. IF you are shooting even if you are not enjoying the experience and have no interest in it, then, WTF, why are you still doing it?
    The point of this thread, like in my earlier post, says that i have respect for wedding photographers who have to go through all these hell. The reason why i did it is because some are families who i can't reject and some are friends who are quite close to me. don't like it, but hard to say no. I had only shoot a stranger's wedding, a friend of friend one time and that is the one where by the vg left. The question is how do you all do it tolerating all these, that's all. Sorry if my ranting and whining actually pissed you off.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2100 View Post
    No interest means raise price. With the $$$, get 2 tokong dSLRs and tokong Nikkor lenses. 4/3 keep as backup's backup (just squeeze into da bag)
    LOL i like that idea! I really am not sure if anyone had shot a wedding for family members and friends of 17 ~ 18 years and get low balled with super power words like we are family/friends. If you have how do you overcome this?
    Your pictures speaks for you, not your camera.

  9. #29
    Member mabmy's Avatar
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    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kboy123 View Post
    Ts is really lucky to have friends ask to shoot for their weddings, i asked mine to let me shoot for their weddings, they asked me to perform a gig for them.. Haha
    I rather do gig, sing until throat hurts and then MC for 2~3 days.
    Your pictures speaks for you, not your camera.

  10. #30

    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Heard this from someone. He tell the peeps "eh friend, u shoot as a hobby i suppose? but i shoot for money one leh, i'm paid for this job, dont like that leh"

    something along this line, tsk tsk. i think just tell them straight, afterall you r the official photographer, but then again i noe many peeps dunno how to be 'automatic' one, likes to shoot as if they are the official photographer when clearly they r not.

  11. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by mabmy

    LOL i like that idea! I really am not sure if anyone had shot a wedding for family members and friends of 17 ~ 18 years and get low balled with super power words like we are family/friends. If you have how do you overcome this?
    dun say I teach you... And I dun practice this...

    Have you ever wondered when you go shopping and buy things... There's always discounts but the final price seems to get higher every season?

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  12. #32
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    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Quote Originally Posted by mabmy View Post
    No this means i attend as a photographer. No chit chatting or sitting down to have a meal. I only do all that after the event.
    From your posts, it sounds like you'd be MUCH better off just attending as a regular guest.

    You could continue attending as a photographer of course, IF you can bear to charge your "clients" an amount that you feel can adequately compensate you (~$5k as Deadpoet suggested) AND provided that your "client" is willing to cough out the money.

    Something tells me you'd be happier and will actually be eating something at the weddings.

  13. #33

    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    I think it is obvious what the main issue is in your case. You must learn how to reject your family and relatives amicably.

    From my guess, you are too accommodating and afraid to offend them. I can identify what you mean cos I was in that position some 6-7 years ago. It was a good classmate. And she wanted all her close friends to help out on her wedding day, including the photographer. She asked me to help her photograph. I said no politely and offered to give her many contacts of full time wedding photographers.

    A few weeks later, she called me again and told me she'd rather I take the pics for her. So what could I do right? Pretty last minute. In the end I did it.

    But looking back, if you asked me, I think I'd rather have not. Cos wedding photography is such a tiring affair and it's taxing if you do it for free or even charge lowly with little reward. Maybe if you're some young student wanting to earn some pocket money and hardly care much about the process, it's a different story.

    But for friends' weddings, I want to enjoy the process. I want to be A GUEST, not a photographer. Moreover, the weddings in Singapore can be such a hectic thing. Waking up before sunrise, lots and lots of family and group shots, and literally rushing here and there to the homes of the bride, groom, bride, new home (if available), hotel reception, hotel ballroom all in a day. Not as easy as some think.

    I can tell weddings are not your cup of tea and that is causing you to feel disturbed. It has hardly anything to do with knowing how paid photographers cope. For them, they have their own set of difficulties and they overcome them cos hey, they are paid and it's their job.

    I don't see anything much in common with what you are going thru compared to what a paid photographer does.

    In future, just reject politely and explain to them you may like photography but not weddings. It will tire you out and you will not enjoy the process. If they still insist, then they are being cheapskate and never consider your feelings. All the more you should counter-insist by rejecting them without feeling any remorse!

  14. #34

    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    The videographer is doing the right thing, there is not way to edit out the scenes that has two (______________) jumping up and down and running around. and also can't just deliver the footage like that to his customers and tell them this is their "friends"' fault.
    I can see where you are coming from, but I also feel for the poor couple who will be left with no footage or photos ... In my heart, that can't be right neither...

    -- marios

  15. #35

    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    My personal opinion is

    1.before accepting the job, state your terms and conditions to the couple.
    2.do not be rude if 'unexpected' photographers with D3 and D3x turn up on that day and take your desired positions. No one wants a wedding to turn ugly. Refer to point 1.
    3.The AD photographer needs to get into position quickly; if not you can kindly ask them to move. Refer to point 2.
    4.Think out of the box. If you are always thinking the same positions (shots) of the 'hobbyist' photographer, your images will come out 'common'. Of course if that is what the couple is looking for then it can't be helped.
    5.Wedding photographers need passion to survive. They can't get real rich but rather they get satisfaction from each unique wedding. If you aren't enjoying it, QUIT.
    You don't take a photograph, you make it. ~Ansel Adams

  16. #36
    Senior Member limwhow's Avatar
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    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Quote Originally Posted by David View Post
    In future, just reject politely and explain to them you may like photography but not weddings. It will tire you out and you will not enjoy the process. If they still insist, then they are being cheapskate and never consider your feelings. All the more you should counter-insist by rejecting them without feeling any remorse!
    I just want to say that I find this statement of yours very well-said.
    Mabmy brother, I feel that whether we are doing it professionally full time, or on a part time basis, this will be the principle which one should follow.
    What do you say?

  17. #37
    Deregistered allenleonhart's Avatar
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    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    my take: stepping out last minute (as mentioned by someone abv abt a VG) is very unprofessional imho, especially when u said u took the job and it is unlikely that they can call in any last minute backup professionals to take over u, be it videographer or photographer. ur leaving them no ground and potentially spoiling a wedding itself.

    remember, u are always open to discussion with the couple. set up a few ground rules with them before the AD. let them know ur supposed to cover for them. they can have friends shooting, fine. but the bride and groom shld let them know that u are doing ur job and dun kajiao u.

    while many have directly say dun take up the job, to me at least i'll say, why not? i do not sincerely believe that ppl are out to "make u get 0 shots". ppl are there for a wedding. if they get into ur way, let them know. let the couple know. there are many ways around the problem, and not just throwing in the towel. i find it very unprofessional. i'm not saying i approve of the GWC actions. but there are still amiciable ways to get stuff done. also, there is money to be earned. dun forget that.

    i believe its a lot on TS's confidence itself. from his first post, i get the feeling he is lacking the confidence in his skills. being a photographer, or at least an event photographer/wedding photographer, there has to be some interaction with the ppl. by doing so, ur portraying urself not as a stranger at an event, but also someone who really has their best wishes for the bride and groom. this shld give u some leeway into some matters.

    just my opinions.

  18. #38

    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Quote Originally Posted by allenleonhart View Post
    i do not sincerely believe that ppl are out to "make u get 0 shots".
    unfortunately, there are.

  19. #39
    Moderator catchlights's Avatar
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    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Quote Originally Posted by allenleonhart View Post
    my take: stepping out last minute (as mentioned by someone abv abt a VG) is very unprofessional imho, especially when u said u took the job and it is unlikely that they can call in any last minute backup professionals to take over u, be it videographer or photographer. ur leaving them no ground and potentially spoiling a wedding itself.

    remember, u are always open to discussion with the couple. set up a few ground rules with them before the AD. let them know ur supposed to cover for them. they can have friends shooting, fine. but the bride and groom shld let them know that u are doing ur job and dun kajiao u.

    while many have directly say dun take up the job, to me at least i'll say, why not? i do not sincerely believe that ppl are out to "make u get 0 shots". ppl are there for a wedding. if they get into ur way, let them know. let the couple know. there are many ways around the problem, and not just throwing in the towel. i find it very unprofessional. i'm not saying i approve of the GWC actions. but there are still amiciable ways to get stuff done. also, there is money to be earned. dun forget that.

    i believe its a lot on TS's confidence itself. from his first post, i get the feeling he is lacking the confidence in his skills. being a photographer, or at least an event photographer/wedding photographer, there has to be some interaction with the ppl. by doing so, ur portraying urself not as a stranger at an event, but also someone who really has their best wishes for the bride and groom. this shld give u some leeway into some matters.

    just my opinions.
    there are many people think that they have a "camera" so they have the licence to shoot.

    they think they can shoot anyone or anything at anywhere at anytime in anyway they want it, just look around this forum you will see many of them here.
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  20. #40

    Default Re: How do you all do it?

    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    there are many people think that they have a "camera" so they have the licence to shoot.

    they think they can shoot anyone or anything at anywhere at anytime in anyway they want it, just look around this forum you will see many of them here.
    this i agree. i had a bad experience while shooting the MBS last year. i just so happened to be standing in front of a bunch of tourists carrying expensive gear who came after i set up.

    i was only shooting with an NEX at that time, but they heckled me till i got fed up and left.

    i feel that there is one main issue with most people who have DSLRs:

    they think that they have better equipment so the one with lesser equipment has to step aside for them, regardless of the fact that having a high-end bad-ass piece of equipment doesn't necessarily mean great pictures (as in the case of the TS).

    and TS i understand your situation too. though i've not shot weddings, back in school was made to photograph events so many times (but not paid, but CCA points given). the last straw came when i was just blasted by the school admin because they wanted building-sized posters (revealed after the photo submission. at first they said it was "small posters") and my humble camera back then couldn't do it and they hinted that my skills were useless. i told them to go hire a professional with MF and walked off. after that i just stopped helping people shoot events, even if it's for money or CCA points.

    although i enjoyed shooting, it's just not the same when people push you around after low-balling you for your services, be it the hirer(s) or their acquaintances. frankly speaking, you're being made use of just because you have a camera and their other friends would probably asked for more (those with those really fancy cameras)

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