Nikon AF 180mm + 2x TC

[harlequin2902]

Hi,

Is there anyone here who is using the AF 180mm f2.8 IF-ED with a TC-20EII for bird photography ? (or if you used this combination before moving up to those $$$ ones like the AFS 400mm or AFS 500mm) Would love to read about your experience with this combination for bird photography.

I'm wondering how much actual improvement on the quality of the captured image I'll see over the 70-300G which I'm currently using for the same purpose

Thanks.

[ITD]

Originally Posted by harlequin2902 Hi, Is there anyone here who is using the AF 180mm f2.8 IF-ED with a TC-20EII for bird photography ? (or if you used this combination before moving up to those $$$ ones like the AFS 400mm or AFS 500mm) Would love to read about your experience with this combination for bird photography. I'm wondering how much actual improvement on the quality of the captured image I'll see over the 70-300G which I'm currently using for the same purpose Thanks.

can also try this forum:
http://www.naturephotosociety.org.sg...conf=DCConfID1

[harlequin2902]

Originally Posted by ITD can also try this forum: http://www.naturephotosociety.org.sg...conf=DCConfID1

Hi,

Thanks for the link, ITD

[ITD]

dun mention u r welcome.

[insomia]

Ok first off this is from memory, the design of the 180 both manual and AF versions gives a great medium tele lens that is not really designed to work well with the manual Nikon TC's. There were some reports that the Kenko or Tamaron APO TC work better with the lens. Nikon's own TC14E and TC20E would not out of the box fit onto non AFS lens there is however a do it at your own risk modification of filing off a tab on the mounting ring of the TC. So unless you want to do a mod to a TC20E there is little chance of hooking up this to the 180AF. There were some attemps to use the TC14E or TC20E with the 180 but I cannot remember the results.

If you have say the 80-200AFS or the new VR version the TCD20E could with a DSLR make it a sort of workable tele lens for bird. But if when you get more serious there is nothing the quite replaces long glass as you no longer then need to worry so much about flexing of the combined lens with TC to camera.

[harlequin2902]

Originally Posted by insomia Ok first off this is from memory, the design of the 180 both manual and AF versions gives a great medium tele lens that is not really designed to work well with the manual Nikon TC's. There were some reports that the Kenko or Tamaron APO TC work better with the lens. Nikon's own TC14E and TC20E would not out of the box fit onto non AFS lens there is however a do it at your own risk modification of filing off a tab on the mounting ring of the TC. So unless you want to do a mod to a TC20E there is little chance of hooking up this to the 180AF. There were some attemps to use the TC14E or TC20E with the 180 but I cannot remember the results. If you have say the 80-200AFS or the new VR version the TCD20E could with a DSLR make it a sort of workable tele lens for bird. But if when you get more serious there is nothing the quite replaces long glass as you no longer then need to worry so much about flexing of the combined lens with TC to camera.

Hi insomnia,

Thanks for sharing .

OTOH, what about the old AFS 300mm IF-ED (f/4 version) + TC14E for the same purpose ?

[Vinnievinyl]

harlequin2902,

I own the 180, both TC14E and TC20E. They will not fit onto the 180mm at all, even if the tab on the TC are removed. The rear of the 180mm is a square opening which is too small for the TC to fit in.

For bird photography at a lower cost, the AFS300 f4 with the TC14E or TC20E is the best choice. The 300mm f4 is renowed for its quality with TC on it, but it does get a bit of slow down on AF with the 1.4x and no AF with the 2x. IMHO, the 70-200mm with 2X is too soft.

Vincent

[harlequin2902]

Originally Posted by Vinnievinyl harlequin2902, I own the 180, both TC14E and TC20E. They will not fit onto the 180mm at all, even if the tab on the TC are removed. The rear of the 180mm is a square opening which is too small for the TC to fit in. For bird photography at a lower cost, the AFS300 f4 with the TC14E or TC20E is the best choice. The 300mm f4 is renowed for its quality with TC on it, but it does get a bit of slow down on AF with the 1.4x and no AF with the 2x. IMHO, the 70-200mm with 2X is too soft. Vincent

Hi Vincent,

Ok, thanks for sharing. I think I know which one to set my sights on for now . But it seems like ít's quite difficult to find a new AFS 300mm f4 here (since now they are selling the newer f2.8) ? Nikon SG helped me to do a quick check that day, and it turned out that only one shop still has one pc left. So maybe by the time I am ready to get it, it may be stock-out islandwide

Thanks.

[erwinx]

i had a love-hate relationship with the 300 f/4 AF-S. Even though the lens is sharp, the lousy tripod collar really affects sharpness at anything less than 1/125. I tried (over)tightening it, putting foam in between etc. Didn't work. Needless to say, i no longer have that lens.


http://www.naturfotograf.com/lens_tele.html

[Vinnievinyl]

Originally Posted by harlequin2902 Hi Vincent, Ok, thanks for sharing. I think I know which one to set my sights on for now . But it seems like ít's quite difficult to find a new AFS 300mm f4 here (since now they are selling the newer f2.8) ? Nikon SG helped me to do a quick check that day, and it turned out that only one shop still has one pc left. So maybe by the time I am ready to get it, it may be stock-out islandwide Thanks.

You probably should wait for a while to see what new product Nikon may launch for the olympic game. But if you insist on getting one, you may want to check with "The camera workshop". Erwin is right about the collar, It is advice to change it to a 3rd party one like what Kirk have.

check kirk website here, http://www.kirkphoto.com.

Vincent

[smallaperture]

Originally Posted by Vinnievinyl harlequin2902, For bird photography at a lower cost, the AFS300 f4 with the TC14E or TC20E is the best choice. The 300mm f4 is renowed for its quality with TC on it, but it does get a bit of slow down on AF with the 1.4x and no AF with the 2x. IMHO, the 70-200mm with 2X is too soft. Vincent

I got the older AF300F4 and use it with the Kenko Pro300 1.4x TC. Works pretty well in moderate light outdoors. Hardly any drop in optical quality with the TC. However, it is a little slow in AF - get round this by either pre-focus or use MF. For birds, got to be real fast to shoot. Only shot in the zoo and JBP only. Haven't tried free-roaming birds yet. I will try it at Sungei Buroh in Sep/Oct.

[KNIGHT ONG]

Anyone here care to share your experience of using TC-20E on VR 70-200mmf2.8 lens ? What is the quality likes ?

[harlequin2902]

Originally Posted by erwinx i had a love-hate relationship with the 300 f/4 AF-S. Even though the lens is sharp, the lousy tripod collar really affects sharpness at anything less than 1/125. I tried (over)tightening it, putting foam in between etc. Didn't work. Needless to say, i no longer have that lens. http://www.naturfotograf.com/lens_tele.html

Originally Posted by Vinnievinyl You probably should wait for a while to see what new product Nikon may launch for the olympic game. But if you insist on getting one, you may want to check with "The camera workshop". Erwin is right about the collar, It is advice to change it to a 3rd party one like what Kirk have. check kirk website here, http://www.kirkphoto.com.

Originally Posted by smallaperture I got the older AF300F4 and use it with the Kenko Pro300 1.4x TC. Works pretty well in moderate light outdoors. Hardly any drop in optical quality with the TC. However, it is a little slow in AF - get round this by either pre-focus or use MF. For birds, got to be real fast to shoot. Only shot in the zoo and JBP only. Haven't tried free-roaming birds yet. I will try it at Sungei Buroh in Sep/Oct.

Ok, thanks again for all your replies, erwinx, vincent and smallaperture.

smallaperture : I usually practice my bird shooting at botanical gardens. Would you like to come down one day with the 300mm f4 to try there ? I would love to see it in action before buying. I hope the AF 300 f4 and AFS 300 f4 aren't too different ?

[AJ23]

Originally Posted by harlequin2902 I hope the AF 300 f4 and AFS 300 f4 aren't too different?

The main difference is in the focusing speed, with everything else held constant.

[Vinnievinyl]

Originally Posted by harlequin2902 Ok, thanks again for all your replies, erwinx, vincent and smallaperture. smallaperture : I usually practice my bird shooting at botanical gardens. Would you like to come down one day with the 300mm f4 to try there ? I would love to see it in action before buying. I hope the AF 300 f4 and AFS 300 f4 aren't too different ?

Hi Harlequin2902,

Frankly speaking, most of my good perching shots are manually focus to get the ultimate sharpness on key point of focus(Normally the eyes). The auto-focus, including the long lenses I own, are usually being use for in-flight shot only.

In contrary to many people think that a new AFS lens will produce better result than a old manual lens, good images are normally produce thu good understanding of the subject, nature or non-nature alike. I knew of a very famous portrait photographer, he would spend the first hour interact with the model before he starts the shoot, and it's the same for nature. Just that we may need to spend more time understand a bird.

Coming back to the lens combo, I reckon both the AF and AFS version are close on the optical performance. If you can spare more cash, the AFS is dearer but the non-AFS is as good. Take note the filter size for the non-AFS is 82mm and the AFS is a more common 77mm.

Cheers

Vincent

[harlequin2902]

Originally Posted by Vinnievinyl Hi Harlequin2902, Frankly speaking, most of my good perching shots are manually focus to get the ultimate sharpness on key point of focus(Normally the eyes). The auto-focus, including the long lenses I own, are usually being use for in-flight shot only. In contrary to many people think that a new AFS lens will produce better result than a old manual lens, good images are normally produce thu good understanding of the subject, nature or non-nature alike. I knew of a very famous portrait photographer, he would spend the first hour interact with the model before he starts the shoot, and it's the same for nature. Just that we may need to spend more time understand a bird. Coming back to the lens combo, I reckon both the AF and AFS version are close on the optical performance. If you can spare more cash, the AFS is dearer but the non-AFS is as good. Take note the filter size for the non-AFS is 82mm and the AFS is a more common 77mm. Cheers Vincent

Right, thanks again for the reply, Vincent.

[justarius]

Try this link here: http://www.nikonlinks.com/lenstest.html

I'm sufficiently convinced by this (and arguments elsewhere at www.nikonians.com), to buy a Kenko Pro 300 2X teleconvertor for my 180/2.8 recently at B&H while I was in New York. I haven't had time to test it though.