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Thread: Need to vent!!!

  1. #21

    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    Ok, this a a rant and vent thread..... following are e-mails between a client and yours truly. Names and figures are censored for the obvious reasons.


    Snipped for neatness

    Have not heard from him since. What you guys think?
    Kit, I can totally understand where you are coming from. However putting myself at the clients side and reading your reply I would be offended by the tone, I think your reply email probably caused some resentment. Its always good to leave some room for him to retreat gracefully.
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  2. #22

    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by 2100 View Post
    Bro, understand your frustration and I did encounter once like this before. Everything was confirmed/settled over the phone with the MUM,

    Snipped for neatness

    Slammed down the phone.
    Mumzilla, treat as old woman having PMS and extreme mood swing. Lucky never take up the job, if not, more trouble and scolding in store for you.
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  3. #23
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by sjackal View Post
    Kit, I can totally understand where you are coming from. However putting myself at the clients side and reading your reply I would be offended by the tone, I think your reply email probably caused some resentment. Its always good to leave some room for him to retreat gracefully.
    I respect your views on my responses but like I mentioned, I feel the firm response was not uncalled for.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by sjackal View Post
    Mumzilla, treat as old woman having PMS and extreme mood swing. Lucky never take up the job, if not, more trouble and scolding in store for you.
    or she could be just behaving badly trying to bully 2100 into submission.....

  5. #25

    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    Hi Hart, thanks for voicing out your views. Appreciate it.

    It didn't occur to me that I have sounded offensive. Firm and worded strongly perhaps. I did try to keep cool about the responses. That's why I reaponded to his e-mail the next day when I could have done it almost immediately. Will I regret this decision? Maybe but definitely not in the near future.

    I do have my reasons for being firm about providing more photographs without additional costs. In my work, I can anywhere between 10mins to 1 hour just to set up and take a shot. Many times, I have to bow down to adverse weather and less than ideal lighting condition. So an additional photograph could actually mean going back to the location another time or worse, several times just to get that shot. This is usually not communicated to the client but in this instance, the amount of work had been spelt out in the work plan submitted before the quotation since he took interest in finding out what goes into producing the photographs. Being an architect (I am one too) who should be attentive to details and such, I trust that he will appreciate the amount of work required to produce a good photograph.

    Given that, I feel he was just trying out his luck and I don't appreciate that. Hence the firm response. I wish him all the best with another photographer.
    Yes, I do understand about the amount of work that can be involved as I used to shoot interior.

    As I have mentioned, you don't have to say yes to any request. I don't give discount period and I stood firm and I believe you feel the same way.

    However, being firm could come across as "rude" by clients. So just be careful on that.

    For what it worth, it probably a small case but I would most certainly want to make sure I have 0 complaint. Unfortunately, I am depending on photography for my whole income and I deal with very small community and words travel very very fast, especially the bad one.

    What I do is, if I reply this type of questions, I tend to sit back, read my own sentences before hit "send" and see if from a few perspectives.

    I don't see competition is getting any easier, so I will never really let my emotion cloud my decision. One small wrong move could mean tens of hours of hardwork being wasted. Not worth it.

    But anyway... if you don't regret it... its fine.

    Good luck.

    Regards,

    Hart

  6. #26
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Agetan View Post
    Yes, I do understand about the amount of work that can be involved as I used to shoot interior.

    As I have mentioned, you don't have to say yes to any request. I don't give discount period and I stood firm and I believe you feel the same way.

    However, being firm could come across as "rude" by clients. So just be careful on that.

    For what it worth, it probably a small case but I would most certainly want to make sure I have 0 complaint. Unfortunately, I am depending on photography for my whole income and I deal with very small community and words travel very very fast, especially the bad one.

    What I do is, if I reply this type of questions, I tend to sit back, read my own sentences before hit "send" and see if from a few perspectives.

    I don't see competition is getting any easier, so I will never really let my emotion cloud my decision. One small wrong move could mean tens of hours of hardwork being wasted. Not worth it.

    But anyway... if you don't regret it... its fine.

    Good luck.

    Regards,

    Hart
    I see your point on being diplomatic. I think certain things have to be established up front when you are standing your grounds. Like I said, I'm actually quite ok to seal all doors in this instance because the potential trouble which I might experience can be disconcerting. Its not that I have not been approached with requests for additional photographs but the clients were ready to pay accordingly without much fuss.

    Well all I can say is this issue happened before I started working on the assignment so thank god for it. Its would be more difficult to pull out then.

  7. #27

    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    I see your point on being diplomatic. I think certain things have to be established up front when you are standing your grounds. Like I said, I'm actually quite ok to seal all doors in this instance because the potential trouble which I might experience can be disconcerting. Its not that I have not been approached with requests for additional photographs but the clients were ready to pay accordingly without much fuss.

    Well all I can say is this issue happened before I started working on the assignment so thank god for it. Its would be more difficult to pull out then.
    well.... I guess we are very much alike....

    Rather to lost a job than picking up pieces.

    Regards,

    Hart

  8. #28
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Agetan View Post
    well.... I guess we are very much alike....

    Rather to lost a job than picking up pieces.

    Regards,

    Hart
    Definitely!! Losses incurred picking up the pieces can be indefinite. That vs pulling out before any work is done........ no brainer choice

  9. #29

    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    I'd be pissed with your short abrupt reply too. As a consumer myself, this is the kind of tone that can do serious damage to your reputation, even online. Would I recommend others to someone like you based on the email reply? No way!

    But in person, you may be a nice operator but that's another story.

    jmo

  10. #30
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by lancey View Post
    I'd be pissed with your short abrupt reply too. As a consumer myself, this is the kind of tone that can do serious damage to your reputation, even online. Would I recommend others to someone like you based on the email reply? No way!

    But in person, you may be a nice operator but that's another story.

    jmo
    That's fine. Won't loose sleep over it.

  11. #31

    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    That's fine. Won't loose sleep over it.
    so why vent?

  12. #32
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by lancey View Post
    so why vent?
    I meant I won't loose sleep over you not recommending me to others.

  13. #33

    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    ic.

    But you rather vent in public about someone who called on you for an abrupt reply (deservedly so i may add)?

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  15. #35
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Agetan View Post
    Calm down guys...
    I'm cool. I will ignore his one liner flame baits just like what the others have been doing all along

  16. #36

    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    if u dun care about others not recommending you clients( reputation), wtf do u care what your pissed clients tells you over an email?! That makes u vent here?

  17. #37

    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    flame baits?

    get a life pal. No wonder your client got pissed. The guy asked for a few more photos and u literally told him to FO.

  18. #38
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    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kit View Post
    I'm cool. I will ignore his one liner flame baits just like what the others have been doing all along
    I too am in business spanning Singapore and Down Under (not in photog business). I understand your point even more as I tend to come across clients like you mentioned ealier in the thread. Singapore Clients or Singaporeans for that matter tends to make comparison with other vendors and would squeeze more deliverable out from you at a fixed price or suggest a price cut at every opportunity. Which client wouldn't try their luck?

    Westerners tend to respect the contract more and would not indulge in that uncivilised manner.
    Dreamz is the Alternate Realty | Stand Up and Be Counted

  19. #39

    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Stuff happens?

    The first reply can easily be construed as being curt, and as was mentioned in the above, it's very easy to lose the tone of the missive in emails
    I thought the explanation afterwards was very clear and detailed; I assume for brevity's sake the client wouldn't have been afforded that reply in the first place?
    That said, it's a good one to keep as a future template of sorts lol

    Curious myself: If the client returned with a 'favorable' response, i.e. wants to proceed, would you still do it?
    He could still possibly fall into the 'tried his luck, didn't work, so go ahead' category
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  20. #40
    Member hotwork77's Avatar
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    Default Re: Need to vent!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Zichar View Post
    Stuff happens?

    The first reply can easily be construed as being curt, and as was mentioned in the above, it's very easy to lose the tone of the missive in emails
    I thought the explanation afterwards was very clear and detailed; I assume for brevity's sake the client wouldn't have been afforded that reply in the first place?
    That said, it's a good one to keep as a future template of sorts lol

    Curious myself: If the client returned with a 'favorable' response, i.e. wants to proceed, would you still do it?
    He could still possibly fall into the 'tried his luck, didn't work, so go ahead' category
    Maybe he got another vendor? Tried his luck with KIT and no luck so when 2nd vendor comes along he press for a lower cost and maximum deliverables. Never mind the standards are not the same cos his boss won't know or at least he hopes his boss wouldn't notice.
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