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Thread: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

  1. #41
    Senior Member giantcanopy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Quote Originally Posted by flowerpot View Post
    it could be a physical design limitation
    not always possible to put the best parts into a product if the parts just dun fit as well or work as expected ?
    at the "C" camp, they managed to put the ring motor into their 24/1.4 mk1/2 and 85mm ma

    ryan

  2. #42

    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Thanx for the info.

    Wondered about the 24 and 85G, but as mentioned by others and agreed, focusing speed and accuracy have other variables too.

    12-24 under FX should be 14-24, typo maybe?
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  3. #43
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    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Quote Originally Posted by sjackal View Post
    Thanx for the info.

    Wondered about the 24 and 85G, but as mentioned by others and agreed, focusing speed and accuracy have other variables too.

    12-24 under FX should be 14-24, typo maybe?
    Yes u r right it is 14-24mm.

  4. #44

    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    already knew about the 2 types of USM/SWM when I was using Canon system. Dont think it is that big a deal what is being used as long as the lens work properly.

  5. #45
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    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Yes, both Nikon and Canon use two types of motors inside the SWM/USM lenses - ring type and the micro motor type.

    But I don't think your list of which Nikon lenses uses which motor is accurate.

    Quote Originally Posted by mousedeers View Post
    It is not difficult to tell which lens use the Ring-Type motor, just look at the contacts point at the end of the lens. Ten contacts points mean it is Ring-Type motor use. Eight contacts point mean it is mini DC motor use.
    This is incorrect. Take a look inside your camera, just inside the mount at the top where the lens electrical contacts connect, you'll see that the pro Nikon bodies (F5, F100, D2series, D3series, D300 etc) have only 8 contacts (the lesser bodies like the D70, D40, F80 etc have only 7 contacts).

    (found this image on the net to show the electrical contact points inside the camera)



    AF lenses need 5 contacts (2 for power and ground for the lens; 3 for serial communication - communicating lens data back to camera, sending commands to lens like AF or turn VR on etc). AF-S or AF-I lenses need 8 contacts (1 extra high power contact for the lens motor and 1 ground for the lens motor, plus 1 extra read/write for the camera to track direction and speed of lens movement) - though some lesser AF-S lenses only have 7 contacts (eg. the 55-200mm), probably missing that extra read/write contact which the lesser bodies don't have as well since they only have 7 contacts too.

    AF-I and AF-S lenses thus either have 10 or 8 (or even 7 for the lesser AF-S lenses) contacts.



    So why do some AF-S lenses have 10 contacts - while even the pro bodies only have 8 contacts to match up to ?

    Take a look at a Nikon AF-S teleconverter - it has 8 contacts on the camera side, but has 10 contacts on the lens side. The two extra contacts are for the teleconverter to tell the lens that it is connected to a teleconverter and which type (1.4x 1.7x or 2x) so that the lens reports back to the camera the proper aperture/focal length (thus a 70-200/2.8 when connected to a 1.4x teleconverter will report that it is a 98-280/4)

    Even some AF-S lenses which weren't supposed to be used with the Nikon teleconverters had 10 contacts (eg. 17-35), but they'd work properly with Kenko teleconverters because of these contacts.

    So Nikon made AF-S lenses with either 10 contacts or 7 contacts (for the lesser lenses). Even lenses which were not meant to be used with AF-S teleconverters had 10 contacts. Somewhere along the way among the newer AF-S lenses, Nikon must have decided to drop the 2 contacts for those lenses not meant to be used with the AF-S teleconverters, thus they only have 8 contacts (eg. 16-35, 24/1.4, 85/1.4 etc)

  6. #46
    Senior Member fatigue's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Quote Originally Posted by flowerpot View Post
    at least i know the repair cost will be lower if it does breaks down
    +1
    We can even get the parts for U$20
    http://cgi.ebay.com/Nikon-Nikkor-18-...item2a078374f7
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  7. #47
    Member DinoSG's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    very imformative..thanks for sharing..
    Nikon D610 |NIKON 16-35mm F4G | SIGMA 50mm F1.4G | NIKON 70-200mm F2.8G VRII | NIKON SB600

  8. #48

    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Useful info!

    Canon have been labelling their EOS system lenses clearly as either the cheaper Arc Form Drive (AFD) or the more expensive quiet/fast Ultra Sonic Motor (USM) types since the 80s. I always preferred the USMs which maximise the speed that EOS has over rival brands. (I'm a non-fanboy btw, having owned/used most of the regular brands in the market...I buy/use not based on brand alone )

    Of course the diff is that Nikon SLRs have mostly had inbody motors compared to the EOS system.
    Last edited by wilbs; 8th October 2010 at 12:54 AM.

  9. #49

    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Thanks gooseberry
    so the list might be wrong.. and the 24 1.4 and 85 1.4 might be indeed using the better motor instead of the cheaper motor? glad to know that I didn't shoot an email to nikon yet

  10. #50

    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Great post, I knew about the Canon glass, but I never thought about the same holding true of the Nikon lenses...Makes me wonder about my newly aquired Olympus M4/3 glass as well, though I think they all have the larger type moters...For my Nikon gear, I continue to mostly use non g lenses (no motor to fail)...I've had some of this glass for over 20 years...Of course my Olympus M4/3 AF lenses are all "g" type (motor in lense) so go figure!. I've always felt that any lense over $1000 should not fail for at least 20 years so I have tried to stay away from motorized glass...That will change soon when I get the Olympus 150 F2 at $2300 (for my new smaller travel kit)...I do envy the apparent faster focus speed of some of the SWM glass though. Anyway I still shoot primarily in MF (in studio) so the AF speed is kinda moot. Anybody have failure rate data???

    Cheers
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  11. #51

    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Wow those are some steep repair costs. This is very informative! Thanks for sharing.

  12. #52
    Member kwttan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Thanks for the great piece of information. Also surprise the latest 24f1.4g and 85f1.4g are not ring-type motor.
    Can it be due to the size of lens and the component inside that prevent having ring-type motor in it? (took a quick glance and did not read all threads, if asked before just ignore this statement)
    D700 * 70-200 F/2.8 VRII * 24-120 F/4 * 50 F/1.4G * SB900
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  13. #53
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    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Quote Originally Posted by fatigue View Post
    +1
    We can even get the parts for U$20
    http://cgi.ebay.com/Nikon-Nikkor-18-...item2a078374f7
    Quote Originally Posted by mousedeers View Post
    Three years back,

    The cost to change Ring-Type motor on the 17-35mm F2.8 is $735 Sing$.

    The cost changing the Ring-Type motor of the AFS 80-200mm F2.8 the cost is $835 Sing$.
    OMG! Anybody knows how much it costs for US$20 thing cost nowadays at NCS.......

  14. #54
    Senior Member luna_sea83's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    if you look at the ebay link, it states that it is used previously with signs of wear and tear.

    Naturally a new part will definately cost more and additional warranty is provided by service centre, you may buy a used 20 bucks motor from him but do you have the what it takes to dismantle the lens assembly?

  15. #55
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    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeroDivine View Post
    Thanks gooseberry
    so the list might be wrong.. and the 24 1.4 and 85 1.4 might be indeed using the better motor instead of the cheaper motor? glad to know that I didn't shoot an email to nikon yet
    No probs... just sharing info, as using the "10/8 contact rule" to say what type of motor a lens has is incorrect. Even the list is inconsistent with that supposed rule anyway - the 18-70 and both versions of the 18-200 all have 10 contacts, but are listed as having the micro motor.

    The only real way of knowing is either Nikon states which motor is in which lens, or someone who has actually opened up each of the lenses and seen what motor is used.

  16. #56

    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    very informative thread!

  17. #57
    Senior Member fatigue's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Quote Originally Posted by mousedeers View Post
    The gears
    What your sources didn't tell. hahaha.. Just kidding
    This belt drive mechanism is not from Nikon lens. It should be from Sigma
    I don't think the motor is SWM
    Last edited by fatigue; 8th October 2010 at 07:15 PM.
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  18. #58
    Senior Member fatigue's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    Quote Originally Posted by gooseberry View Post
    No probs... just sharing info, as using the "10/8 contact rule" to say what type of motor a lens has is incorrect. Even the list is inconsistent with that supposed rule anyway - the 18-70 and both versions of the 18-200 all have 10 contacts, but are listed as having the micro motor.

    The only real way of knowing is either Nikon states which motor is in which lens, or someone who has actually opened up each of the lenses and seen what motor is used.
    Yes, quite inconsistent
    AF-S DX 18-70/3.5-4.5G IF-ED should be ring motor
    AF-S 105/2.8G IF-ED Micro VR has a micro motor at the back but it also has one big mechanism in front
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  19. #59

    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    strange, i remember reading that the 16-85mm DX had a ring motor, with it being the top nikon APS-C walkaround lens.

  20. #60

    Default Re: Nikon Does not tell you all the truth of SWM Silent Wave Motor?

    BTW..Anybody know what the average life expectancy of the motor is for my 17-35 2.8 swm. I've had it for many years now.

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