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Thread: Whats the different from CF and FF?

  1. #41

    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    anyways, there is a quick explanation for the 102 deg.

    please see http://www.sigmaphoto.com/shop/10-20...c-hsm-sigma#n1

    please take note of the small little 1 subscript.

    please click on it.

    then please find out what the crop factor for sigma is. tada, problem solved. it is 1.7x.

    http://dpanswers.com/content/tech_crop.php

    wiki gives http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angle_of_view

    18mm as 100 deg diagonal FOV, so... that's the reason.

  2. #42
    New Member kriegsketten's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    no, focal length is not really representative of field of view.

    10mm fisheye for example on DX lens will have a much wider FOV than a 10mm rectilinear lens.

    so things like how well the distortion is corrected would also PROBABLY affect effective FOV.

    that said, we can usually expect a 10mm lens to be wider than an 11mm lens, given that they are both rectilinear.
    Exactly, but don't forget how each lens element is created - curvature of the surface etc...the light reflected off from one element to the next WILL be different if they are created differently between two lenses (whether both 10mm and rectilinear or not). Basic science...
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  3. #43
    Senior Member ZerocoolAstra's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    no, focal length is not really representative of field of view.

    10mm fisheye for example on DX lens will have a much wider FOV than a 10mm rectilinear lens.

    so things like how well the distortion is corrected would also PROBABLY affect effective FOV.

    that said, we can usually expect a 10mm lens to be wider than an 11mm lens, given that they are both rectilinear.
    hmmmm you have a point...
    damn this is too much for me...
    brain is half asleep...
    Exploring! :)

  4. #44
    New Member kriegsketten's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    anyways, there is a quick explanation for the 102 deg.

    please see http://www.sigmaphoto.com/shop/10-20...c-hsm-sigma#n1

    please take note of the small little 1 subscript.

    please click on it.

    then please find out what the crop factor for sigma is. tada, problem solved. it is 1.7x.

    http://dpanswers.com/content/tech_crop.php

    wiki gives http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angle_of_view

    18mm as 100 deg diagonal FOV, so... that's the reason.
    So what it is saying is, if you put that lens on a 1.5 crop body, the angle of view should equate to 109 deg?
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  5. #45
    New Member kriegsketten's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rashkae View Post
    You should try shooting with the Sigma 12-24 of FF.
    Oh okay lolz owned! Oh WOW, a whopping 122 degrees! Move over, Nikon 14-24mm!
    Last edited by kriegsketten; 5th August 2010 at 11:14 PM.
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  6. #46

    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by kriegsketten View Post
    So what it is saying is, if you put that lens on a 1.5 crop body, the angle of view should equate to 109 deg?
    what it is saying is that sigma is idiotically listing FOV on its website as that of the lens on 1.7x crop body.

  7. #47
    New Member kriegsketten's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    what it is saying is that sigma is idiotically listing FOV on its website as that of the lens on 1.7x crop body.
    Haiz... I see... But no leh, is it because it is to support Sigma's own Crop DSLR body?

    *edit: Ah yes! The Sigma SD15 is a 1.7x crop sensor!!! CASE CLOSED... Nobody's falsifying ANYTHING!
    Last edited by kriegsketten; 5th August 2010 at 11:22 PM.
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  8. #48
    Senior Member ZerocoolAstra's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    phew... ~faint~
    Exploring! :)

  9. #49
    Deregistered wootsk's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    no, focal length is not really representative of field of view.

    10mm fisheye for example on DX lens will have a much wider FOV than a 10mm rectilinear lens.

    so things like how well the distortion is corrected would also PROBABLY affect effective FOV.

    that said, we can usually expect a 10mm lens to be wider than an 11mm lens, given that they are both rectilinear.
    Aiya, just lean back a bit and you still see the covered area is the same.

  10. #50
    New Member kriegsketten's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by wootsk View Post
    Aiya, just lean back a bit and you still see the covered area is the same.
    So simple har?? It depends on the objects in the distance that you want to cover okay? The further the distance, the greater the differences - you'll need to do more than leaning back...maybe take a few steps onto the road of on-coming traffic if you're on the bridge's ledge... I thought my math already fail, yours failed 1.5x over mine! lolz
    Last edited by kriegsketten; 5th August 2010 at 11:45 PM.
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  11. #51
    Moderator daredevil123's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Hmmmm so NNB's 16mm is 2 degress wider than my 11mm. But what I saw seems to so much more than 2degrees.

    Nevermind. Tomorrow morning is our sunrise shoot. I will setup next to him and we do a shoot out again.

  12. #52
    Senior Member ZerocoolAstra's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil123 View Post
    Hmmmm so NNB's 16mm is 2 degress wider than my 11mm. But what I saw seems to so much more than 2degrees.

    Nevermind. Tomorrow morning is our sunrise shoot. I will setup next to him and we do a shoot out again.
    For a 1 degree difference on either side of the perpendicular, the difference (@200m straight line distance) is 3.5m
    [tangent (1 degree) x 200m]

    So NNB is seeing 7m wider at a distance of 200m, and 7m taller. Quite a lot
    Last edited by ZerocoolAstra; 6th August 2010 at 08:44 AM.
    Exploring! :)

  13. #53
    New Member kriegsketten's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by ZerocoolAstra View Post
    For a 1 degree difference on either side of the perpendicular, the difference (@200m straight line distance) is 3.5m
    [tangent (1 degree) x 200m]

    So NNB is seeing 7m wider at a distance of 200m, and 7m taller. Quite a lot
    Whatever you do DD123, do not, I repeat DO NOT challenge his shots when you try to capture Battam Island on a clear day! You'll only get disappointed much much more!

    I think most peeps have the misconception of degree differences. True, 3 degrees may not be much when you shoot objects are close range. Eg. Group of people against a wall, 2 meters away (yeah, you can just lean back in this case). But the same 3 degrees will fan out to much greater differences against objects 100 km away! For the same scene, you can even notice the BIG change between just 1 deg difference. We use UWA for the great expanse of nature and city skylines, not normal day-to-day shoots, hence the crave for greater FOVs where 1 deg extra may make or break a photo composition if walking space is limited...

    Whatever it is, ZCA has clearly illustrated the math in all this, maybe he will coach us during one of the outings??
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  14. #54
    New Member kriegsketten's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil123 View Post
    Hmmmm so NNB's 16mm is 2 degress wider than my 11mm. But what I saw seems to so much more than 2degrees.

    Nevermind. Tomorrow morning is our sunrise shoot. I will setup next to him and we do a shoot out again.
    2? 107 - 104 = 3 degrees, laddie... one extra deg makes a great difference already! I wish I can draw up a diagram - it would clearly illustrate the situation...
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  15. #55
    Moderator daredevil123's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by ZerocoolAstra View Post
    For a 1 degree difference on either side of the perpendicular, the difference (@200m straight line distance) is 3.5m
    [tangent (1 degree) x 200m]

    So NNB is seeing 7m wider at a distance of 200m, and 7m taller. Quite a lot
    Even for 3 degrees, for subjects 200m away... still it is around 10m difference. But What I saw in NNB's shot is very very very much wider... Maybe my mind is playing tricks on me?

    hmmmm. We will find out tomorrow.

  16. #56
    New Member kriegsketten's Avatar
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    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Quote Originally Posted by daredevil123 View Post
    Even for 3 degrees, for subjects 200m away... still it is around 10m difference. But What I saw in NNB's shot is very very very much wider... Maybe my mind is playing tricks on me?

    hmmmm. We will find out tomorrow.
    Well, please do check on it and post images with detailed descriptions (object distance etc) for scientific research and break down analysis...
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  17. #57

    Default Re: Whats the different from CF and FF?

    Full frame will give you a better dynamic range compared to a regular APS-C sensor.

    Sheesh! Can't believe nobody has brought this up so far in this thread.
    Last edited by Shahmatt; 6th August 2010 at 03:10 PM.
    Samsung NX10+30mm, Fuji S6500FD

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