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Thread: Organiser refuses to remove my images from thread and challenges me

  1. #41
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    Default Re: Organiser refuses to remove my images from thread and challenges me

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    that is kind of.. different logic.

    here the model is using the photographer's image of her without permission, handing out to organisers like it is her right to do so, despite no permission given by photographer.

    i agree that there are no fixed rules. and yes, without a MODEL RELEASE FORM, the photographer cannot use the image commercially. if he has obtained a MODEL RELEASE FORM, the model cannot demand a share of the pay if it is specified in the model release form.

    if you are supporting the model based on logic that she is in the picture, then you might as well say that the model can sell the pictures on stock photography websites... because that is what she is doing here, she is taking it that she has rights to the image and is giving them out to workshop organisers/advertisers for advertisement.

    in that case, theoretically there is PROFIT involved, so based on your example above, surrephoto should demand for a cut of the profits.
    Nightmare, few things must bear in mind here. 1st it was a photoshoot and not a commercial shoot. 2nd what was the agreement stated before the shoot (only they know) , from my side here a photoshoot with a model even when we paid her is for personal usage only. Posting on any site other than personal needs her prior permission (which I usually asked for). 3rd no release form were signed so the photographer have no rights to claim from anybody even though he have the full right to use for himself (and not use it commercially unless specified with the model) 4th here the model is using the photo as her portfolio , the picture itself is not generating income. It is her work later on that make the money. I agree with you however if this picture were to generate income, the photographer have the right to a share to it ( or full share if the model sign a 'full' release ). 5th in general, models have some basic right to use her pictures as her portfolio unless on certain shoot , usually commercial, where she have signed all rights away and the photos were guarded for commercial reasons.

    You are refering the site which discuss commercial shoots where most terms were commercially specified. Here is a hobby shoot , maybe...I said maybe, the model can turn around and sue the photographer for releasing her photograph outside his personal domain.

  2. #42
    Moderator nightwolf75's Avatar
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    Default Re: Organiser refuses to remove my images from thread and challenges me

    i think catchlights has nicely laid out the conditions. shall we leave it to the 2 parties to settle this offline, rather than contributing speculations, regardless how well-meaning they are?

    TS could use the report post function if he feels aggrieved by the lack of action by the other party. i believe, if the complaint is justified, the CS admin team will deleted the offending threads and, perhaps, futher actions will be taken. we have done it before, so we have precedence.
    If Life worked on auto mode then manual mode for photography would have never existed. ― Deeksha Mittal

  3. #43
    Moderator catchlights's Avatar
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    Default Re: Organiser refuses to remove my images from thread and challenges me

    Quote Originally Posted by innerzen View Post
    Nightmare, few things must bear in mind here. 1st it was a photoshoot and not a commercial shoot. 2nd what was the agreement stated before the shoot (only they know) , from my side here a photoshoot with a model even when we paid her is for personal usage only. Posting on any site other than personal needs her prior permission (which I usually asked for). 3rd no release form were signed so the photographer have no rights to claim from anybody even though he have the full right to use for himself (and not use it commercially unless specified with the model) 4th here the model is using the photo as her portfolio , the picture itself is not generating income. It is her work later on that make the money. I agree with you however if this picture were to generate income, the photographer have the right to a share to it ( or full share if the model sign a 'full' release ). 5th in general, models have some basic right to use her pictures as her portfolio unless on certain shoot , usually commercial, where she have signed all rights away and the photos were guarded for commercial reasons.

    You are refering the site which discuss commercial shoots where most terms were commercially specified. Here is a hobby shoot , maybe...I said maybe, the model can turn around and sue the photographer for releasing her photograph outside his personal domain.
    when the model being hired to pose, whether is for personal shoots or for commercial assignment, his/she has already being compensate with wages, no other form of compensation needed unless both parties agreed, as such, models are not entitle to any photos, photographers MAY give her couple of images out of goodwill, but this does not means the models own the photos.

    please read more details about Model release - Wikipedia

    and also

    Ownership

    Generally, the person who created the work (i.e. the author) owns the copyright in the work.
    However, there are exceptions to this general rule. Some exceptions are:

    Employment: If the work is created by an employee pursuant to the terms of his employment, the employer owns the copyright in the work.

    Special situation for newspaper/magazine/periodical employees: Where an employee of a newspaper, magazine or periodical creates a literary, dramatic or artistic work pursuant to the terms of his employment and for the purpose of publication in a newspaper, magazine or periodical, the proprietor of the newspaper, magazine or periodical owns the copyright in respect of publication in or reproduction for the purpose of publication in any newspaper, magazine or periodical. The employee owns the remaining rights that make up the copyright bundle of exclusive rights.
    Commissioning: If a portrait/photograph/engraving is commissioned by another party, the commissioner owns the copyright in the work. If the portrait/photograph/engraving is required for a particular purpose, this purpose must be communicated to the commissioned party. While the commissioner is the copyright owner, the commissioned party has the right to stop others from doing any act comprised in the copyright, unless such act is done for the particular purpose for which the portrait/photograph/engraving is created.

    For other types of commissioned works, ownership belongs to the commissioned party, unless the commissioner and commissioned party otherwise agree.

    As mentioned in the introduction, the copyright owner may transfer his rights to another party or entity either partially or wholly.

    taken from http://www.ipos.gov.sg/leftNav/cop/O...and+Rights.htm
    Shoot to Live, Live to Shoot
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  4. #44
    Moderator catchlights's Avatar
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    Default Re: Organiser refuses to remove my images from thread and challenges me

    last checked the images has been removed.

    Marvin you may wish to close this thread if it has served the purpose.
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  5. #45

    Default Re: Organiser refuses to remove my images from thread and challenges me

    Thanks all for the kind advices. The image has been removed from jaykay's thread and thus i will be closing this thread.

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