Page 7 of 8 FirstFirst ... 25678 LastLast
Results 121 to 140 of 142

Thread: Recommendations for my first film SLR

  1. #121

    Default

    Originally posted by Kit


    Yeah, good effort but I personally think that the "good effort" can be put into better use like..........erm..........taking photos.

    Then again, its just me, I might be wrong. Not experienced enough to understand what photography really means...........
    We can't/won't/don't use all of our leisure time to go out and take photos...just like the time we spent on the forum, one might say it is wasting time here...and is better to be used in outdoor photo taking . However, I think what's really count is that as long as you enjoy the process...enjoy what you do...then this equipment crazyness is also part of enjoying photography. For me, photography doesn't mean taking photo and admiring photo only, but also the enjoyment I got from studying, owning, buying, dreaming, and using my gear.
    DR KOH KHO KING

  2. #122
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    u n k n o w n
    Posts
    692

    Default

    Originally posted by Kit


    Yeah, good effort but I personally think that the "good effort" can be put into better use like..........erm..........taking photos.

    Then again, its just me, I might be wrong. Not experienced enough to understand what photography really means...........
    aiyoyo....... expert, why don't you let me get my gear first before I can put all my efforts in photography? don't you think so? A great gear can accompany you for quite a long time...........
    Last edited by 007; 12th May 2002 at 12:19 AM.

  3. #123
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Upper Bukit Timah
    Posts
    11,667

    Default

    Originally posted by Kho King


    We can't/won't/don't use all of our leisure time to go out and take photos...just like the time we spent on the forum, one might say it is wasting time here...and is better to be used in outdoor photo taking . However, I think what's really count is that as long as you enjoy the process...enjoy what you do...then this equipment crazyness is also part of enjoying photography. For me, photography doesn't mean taking photo and admiring photo only, but also the enjoyment I got from studying, owning, buying, dreaming, and using my gear.
    Oh, quite enlightening. Well to me, the "process" is actually to get out there and make good use of my equipment. No pictures, no process. I don't get as much satisfaction just studying, owning, buying and dreaming. But hey, its just me, I might be wrong....again.

  4. #124

    Default

    Originally posted by Kit

    But hey, its just me, I might be wrong....again.
    There is no right or wrong...just different person enjoy life/photography differently.

    Happy Shooting!
    DR KOH KHO KING

  5. #125
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Upper Bukit Timah
    Posts
    11,667

    Default

    Originally posted by 007


    aiyoyo....... expert, why don't you let me get my gear first before I can throw my efforts in photography? don't you think so? A great gear can accompany you for quite a long time...........
    Thanks for the compliment. I am by no means any so called "expert". I'll let other "more deserving" people have that title.

    Nobody's stopping you from getting your gear. I think you've done more than enough to help you decide on what you want to get. Great gear only accompany you for a long time only if you use them well..........

  6. #126
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    u n k n o w n
    Posts
    692

    Default

    Originally posted by Kit


    Thanks for the compliment. I am by no means any so called "expert". I'll let other "more deserving" people have that title.

    Nobody's stopping you from getting your gear. I think you've done more than enough to help you decide on what you want to get. Great gear only accompany you for a long time only if you use them well..........
    10Q 10Q .
    I owe you this time.......

  7. #127
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    u n k n o w n
    Posts
    692

    Default

    There are, so far some pros and cons that I have gathered:

    1) F80 better than Eos 30 in dust proof. This is may be due to the design of the Eos 30, that gathers lot of dust either in their lenses or body/sensor.

    2) Eos 30 wins F80 by lot of additional functions that quite close to the professional SLR. Lot of things to let amarteur to play with (for quite long time). But another thing is, can EOS 30 last that long? (longer than F80?). Nikon is famous in durability. But now, both (mainly) are made by plastic, then this does not really matter. Yet, still , i read somewhere that the EOS 30 is a bit weak in the built.

    3) Eos 30 beats F80 in the Sports photography. F80 is great under some very distractive light condition. Eos 30 is poor under low light condition. And many users complain about the build in pop-up flash strobe as an AF asist light.

    4) F80 is more advance in the sharpness. But EOS 30 is greater in more lively and saturated colours. There are some argument said that the Canon's technology is 10 years ahead F80. With some reasonable price, we can get Canon's IS, USM lens. Whereby, for nikon, only some very expensive and top range lenses have these functions. A very simple tech is the eye controlled focus.

    5) The F80's design is better for those who are wearing spectacles. The handgrip for F80 is better than EOS. These are some facts.

    There are many examples that the buyers change their mind on the spot when choosing the camera. As you all can see, these two cameras, are made to compete with their rivals. Simple enough?

  8. #128
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    3,911

    Default

    Originally posted by 007
    There are, so far some pros and cons that I have gathered:
    1) F80 better than Eos 30 in dust proof. This is may be due to the design of the Eos 30, that gathers lot of dust either in their lenses or body/sensor.

    No idea where you get this from. Dust is not really an issue on film SLRs. If you pull a lens off an SLR, whether an EOS 3 or an EOS 300, dust is going to get in.

    2) Eos 30 wins F80 by lot of additional functions that quite close to the professional SLR. Lot of things to let amarteur to play with (for quite long time).

    How so? Frankly, I think both cameras will keep you happy if you don't start suffering from equipment lust. Even an EOS300 or F65 will do you fine.

    But another thing is, can EOS 30 last that long? (longer than F80?).

    Where did you get this from? Both should last you long enough, I don't see why the F80 might last longer.

    Nikon is famous in durability.

    Another one of those lovely myths flying around.

    3) Eos 30 beats F80 in the Sports photography.

    Why? What gives you this impression?

    4) F80 is more advance in the sharpness. But EOS 30 is greater in more lively and saturated colours.

    What?!? Are you talking about digital cameras?! How does a camera affect the sharpness (with notable exceptions in specialist areas) or colours?

    There are some argument said that the Canon's technology is 10 years ahead F80.

    Where did you get this from again? And even ceding the argument (which I'm not), do you need the superadvanced technology?

    With some reasonable price, we can get Canon's IS, USM lens. Whereby, for nikon, only some very expensive and top range lenses have these functions.

    Yes, agreed, but it comes back to the same thing I've been banging my head on about. Do you need IS and USM? Now I know, and I don't deny, that if you can get both and not pay more for it, then why not. But frankly, don't get lulled into this "I need USM and IS" thing. You don't, and you can take good pictures perfectly well without them.

    A very simple tech is the eye controlled focus.

    Which isn't really very useful at all. Among other things, Canon would have put it on their EOS1v or 1d cameras.

    5) The F80's design is better for those who are wearing spectacles. The handgrip for F80 is better than EOS. These are some facts.

    Yeah. Not too many in this LONG thread so far...

  9. #129
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    u n k n o w n
    Posts
    692

    Default

    Thanks Jed for telling me these.
    By the way, I didn't really experience these / or I came out with these by my imagination? I only highlighted some info that most of the users mentioned in some reviews. These issues I have read them quite frequently -- which means that these might be really happened. As this is my first system, therefore, it is better that I made a correct decission.

  10. #130

    Default

    I think this kind of arguments is getting nowhere....
    You want something cheap and good and yet having best of both world...this is impossible!
    Definitely, each model brands do have their advantages as well as disadvantages, pick a camera which you find comfortable with, be it Nikon, Cannon, Minolta or others.......the most important thing is whether you are happy with your purchase!

  11. #131
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    u n k n o w n
    Posts
    692

    Default

    6) The partial meter
    The main reasons for choosing F80 over EOS 30 are:
    The 10% partial meter of EOS 300 performs not satisfied at all especially for the spot meter . Hence a true spot meter was a must for users if spot meter is important /more oftenly used.
    Two command dials (for adjusting shutter speed and aperture). This is important for some users that use manual metering mode often and it's really uncomfortable to adjust shutter speed first, then hold down a button and adjust the aperture with the same command dial (EOS 300). With F80 users can adjust these two parameters independantly at the same time very easy.

    (sorry, I didn't mean to challenge you all, just that I would like to record down some important facts as a guideline to newbie? or might be some simple info, I merely summarize, didn't really my own experience, )
    Last edited by 007; 12th May 2002 at 02:06 AM.

  12. #132
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    u n k n o w n
    Posts
    692

    Default

    Originally posted by scanner
    I think this kind of arguments is getting nowhere....
    You want something cheap and good and yet having best of both world...this is impossible!
    Definitely, each model brands do have their advantages as well as disadvantages, pick a camera which you find comfortable with, be it Nikon, Cannon, Minolta or others.......the most important thing is whether you are happy with your purchase!
    If last time / with lot of $$$, yes!
    But with limited budget? No, ! must make precise decission.
    Why last time simpler? Last time we can easily choose a gear. But not now! Cause now (even F80) is launched because of the market strategy. So, as a consumer, it is better that we choose carefully.

    Just my $0.02 worth?

  13. #133

    Default

    Originally posted by 007


    If last time / with lot of $$$, yes!
    But with limited budget? No, ! must make precise decission.
    Why last time simpler? Last time we can easily choose a gear. But not now! Cause now (even F80) is launched because of the market strategy. So, as a consumer, it is better that we choose carefully.

    Just my $0.02 worth?
    If that is the case, ask yourself this Qns and list them down.
    What you really need from this camera? Better grip? Fast focus? Eye control? and so on.......apart from the extra features which you might not really need it.

    From then go, you might have a clearer picture which to choose from, but do remember that you need to set aside an amount of money to purchase good lens as well.

    My 2 cents worth of inputs as well.

  14. #134
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    3,911

    Default

    And I emphasis Scanner's words:

    What you really need from this camera?

  15. #135
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Perth Australia
    Posts
    2,548

    Default

    Rather than fart about with stupid excel worksheets I suggest you really spend some time performing a brutally honest assessment of your needs as Jed has suggested.

    In order to get you started here are some of the questions you really need to find answers for.

    1) What types of photography do I want to do? (be specific, very specific here), eg: family snaps, parties, travel, BirdPark/Zoo, real wildlife in the wild, sports, macro and closeup etc.

    2) Do I want to to spend more on gear in the future?

    3) What is the minimum set of absolute requirements that the camera has to meet in terms of quality, cost, and quality.

    4) How long do I intend to keep the camera for?

    Once you have answered these questions honestly and with some thought you are ready to head down to a camera shop to try out the various cameras in your price range.

    Brand is a lot less important than how a camera feels in your hand!
    The Ang Moh from Hell
    Professional Photography - many are called, few are chosen!

  16. #136
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Northwest
    Posts
    5,011

    Default

    To yeppie, munfai and 007,

    My personal view:

    If you have not owned or used an SLR before, my guess is you have not really grasped the meaning of all the detailed specifications you are trying to compare between the different models. Please don't get me wrong, I am not saying that you don't know what spot metering or what rear curtain sync is.

    What I am saying is you may not have realised which of the specifications matters more to you and which you would not care less for.

    Every one on this forum has his/her own experience, priorities and preferences. When you scout forums for opinions and try to generate a somewhat generic concensus on which is the better brand/model base on what you have read, you will normally end up running in circles (not to mention the heated arguments you will stir up...). Believe me, I have gone thorugh the same cycle, and I am occasionally still doing that. For example, I am presently tring to decide on which printer to buy...Epson or Canon.... but let's not go there...

    I feel that photography is a beautiful hobby to have, but you got to be prepared to put in the investment. Between time and money, you got to strike a good balance. What kit was trying to say is, you could be wasting all these time comparing specs, and then finally get a camera for reason's that you will find invalid later as you get more familiar with the equipment, and then regret that you should have just picked any camera and invested the time saved on taking more pictures.

    Yes, it is important to know what you really want so that you can get the correct gear. But questions Ian raised for you generally cannot be answered with full confidence until you have invested enough time in shooting.

    Don't worry so much about getting the perfect camera for your first buy. Even if it is not perfect, it will not be too wrong. The best thing you can do is not to expand your system too quickly, so that in the worst case if you decide to switch brand entirely, the system you have on hand would not be too difficult to get rid of.

    I am sure tons of good picture has been taken with all the different cameras mentioned in this thread.

    My first camera was a Minolta X700. I used it for a few years, understanding its limitations, as well as understanding what matters more for myself. And when I was ready to buy my second camera, I knew exactly what I wanted. The most important thing was that I learned the most about photographty while I was using the modest X700.

    There was a comment earlier about Nikon cameras being more "plastic". After working 10 years as a product development enginner, I can tell you that "plastic" is the way for Nikon (as well as many other product manufacturers) to bring to consumers ergonomic camera designs at the right price point. I am not bothered by plastic feel, as I am more concerened about the grip.

    When Nikon released the CP995, I read a lot of complains on dpreview about the lens-side body casing being made of plastic rather than magnesium alloy. The worst thing was, these complaints were made by people who has not even touched or seen the actual camera. After the dust has settled, I have not heard of any report about a camera failure due to the plastic body.

    To sum up, you will never find the perfect gear. If you come across a limitation in your gear, try to find a work-around. Most of the time these are nothing more than slight inconveniences, and should be looked at as opportunities for you to learn something more about photography that deepens your understanding and helps you to grow into a more proficient photographer.

    Thank you!
    Last edited by roygoh; 12th May 2002 at 07:44 AM.
    As complexity rises, precise statements lose meaning and meaningful statements lose precision.

  17. #137
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    3,911

    Default

    * Stands and applauds Roy. *

  18. #138
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Northwest
    Posts
    5,011

    Default

    Originally posted by Jed
    * Stands and applauds Roy. *


    Coming from you, Jed, I take that as a great honour.
    As complexity rises, precise statements lose meaning and meaningful statements lose precision.

  19. #139

    Default

    Originally posted by roygoh




    Coming from you, Jed, I take that as a great honour.
    Aiyo
    no shy no shy..
    hehhehehhehhheheh

  20. #140
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Upper Bukit Timah
    Posts
    11,667

    Default

    Its good to think before you buy, as important as to think before you shoot. But I think you're really spending your efforts in all the wrong places. That would explain why you're still indecisive. For me, I'll bought myself a great camera that suit my needs without doing what you've done so far. Its pretty obvious that you're read some info before you put them down on a spread sheet but why??? Who cares about banal spread sheets when there's catalogues lying around??? Do you think they helped at all? I don't think so. Why? Because it haven't allowed you to take the first step in photography yet.............taking pictures.

Page 7 of 8 FirstFirst ... 25678 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •