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Thread: Recommendations for my first film SLR

  1. #101

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    after looking at my budget again, I've decided to stay with consumer digital until DSLRs becomes affordable or SLRs become dirt cheap!

  2. #102
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    See... that's the problem. All this buy F80, buy EOS 30 thing. Now the poor chap is frightened off.

    You don't need an F80 or EOS30 to take nice pics.

    Trust me, if you can forget p**** envy and lusting after new gear (if you have either, then you won't stop before you end up with a 1D/D1x anyway, so the F80/EOS30 is a moot point), then you can be perfectly happy with your F55, F65, EOS300, etc, for a good long time. And it will be sufficient for 90% of the photography you do.

  3. #103
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    Originally posted by panz
    The FM2 is bullet proof when fitted with a lens.....read in an article about a war photojournalist in NAM getting hit and found the logged bullet in his FM2....

    Warning!! No scientific proof
    Think you must have misread the article panz, the FM2 wasn't released till 1982 some 7 years after the Vietnam war ended. In 1975 at the end of the American debacle Nikon were producing the F2 and EL Nikkormat bodies but not any of the FM series.
    The Ang Moh from Hell
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  4. #104
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    Originally posted by munfai

    Would a beginner, or even a pro, ever reach shutter speeds of 1/1000 frequently? I doubt it, unless he/she is really specialized in some area. And other things like on-demand grid lines, viewfinder coverage, light illumination, well i can do without them, so why pay for it?
    Well speaking as one of this forums professional photographers the answer is yes I use 1/1000th and higher all the time, in fact I frequently see 1/4000 and faster speeds using ISO 100 emulsions.

    LCD illumination is essential if you are going to undertake night time shooting as there's no other way of reading the display at night. Unlike the older Nikon bodies the newer ones really do require illumination, especially of the viewfinder display information.

    Guess this makes your arguement look a bit flaccid.
    The Ang Moh from Hell
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  5. #105
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    Originally posted by Kho King

    The biggest strength of Nikon is the compatibilty with older lenses and its manual focus line.

    You can't use those old Canon lenses (FD mount) in new EOS body, and they are not fully compatible. There are no EOS manual focus offers by Canon nowadays. Nikon has not changed its lens mount since Nikon F till now Nikon D1x. You can use almost all Nikkor lenses on the latest D1x as well as on the old 20 years old Nikon FM.
    There's nothing I hate more than half truths and ill conceived half truths at that.

    Nikon's biggest strength is it's massive system as a whole, and the lenses, while an integral part of the system are not the entire reason why Nikon is preferred by many professionals.

    Eos bodies can indeed use FD lenses, via custom adaptor mounts and indeed Canon made special adapters available to the professional Canon users during the FD to EOS transition period and a simpler version is still available.

    The F mount has undergone numerous changes over the years, specifically AI, AIS, AF, AFS modifications while keeping compatability with the original F mount. Yet more half truths from you Kho.

    Finally, the FM is not a 20 year old design, it's a 25 year old body as it reached the general population internationally in 1977.

    The ang moh hath spoken
    The Ang Moh from Hell
    Professional Photography - many are called, few are chosen!

  6. #106

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    wow 1 day at work and so many replies! sorry for not participating earlier, I wasn't able to access the forums from where I was.

    no I have not gone to buy the camera and NO I have not given photography and taken up painting (no offense to painters, just some crap of mine).

    I printed out a lot of stuff last night to read up on, mainly on the comparisions of the EOS cameras and Nikon cameras. Was also trying to understand the Nikon mount and the different types of lenses. Seems like the Nikon syustem has a lot more abbreviations than the Canon, or maybe I was more exposed to Canon.

    an update, my office has a Nikon F601 which I believe is an old and beginner SLR. I plan to start with it for the time being and learn more abt film in the meantime instead of camera functions, which I'm unsure which camera I'll get eventually. Somehow I like the EOS 30 and may be getting it next month or so after playing with the F601. Because the camera is $800-$900 without lenses, it is a bit off budget if I include lenses and therefore I have to put it on hold for a month or so.

    so for the time being the camera problem is settled and a big THANK YOU to all who replied. sorry for a bit of tension between a few members, I believe it all healthy debate right?

    erm..... part 2 of my quest. which film should i start with? I believe slide film right? is the procedure of taking with slide film same as negatives? do most developers do slide? wat do i do when i get back the developed slides? i choose which one i like and print it? how abt a typical description of wat happens from buying the film to getting it back? also which film exactly to start with? hehheh a lot of qns..... sorry again......

  7. #107
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    Originally posted by yeppie99
    erm..... part 2 of my quest. which film should i start with? I believe slide film right? is the procedure of taking with slide film same as negatives? do most developers do slide? wat do i do when i get back the developed slides? i choose which one i like and print it? how abt a typical description of wat happens from buying the film to getting it back? also which film exactly to start with? hehheh a lot of qns..... sorry again......
    oohhhh boooyyy... i see another can of worms being opened again...

    anyway to answer some of your question, yes you basically take photos with slide film like you would with neg film - loading, camera controls, etc. not every developer can do slide, so don't bother with your neighbourhood "auntie" store... however the good thing is, slide film is cheap to develop, even with mounting. RGB charges around $7 (i think, not very sure) for a roll of 36 with mounting... it's the slide-to-print process that's expensive, so choose your shots carefully before ordering prints.

    hope that helps... some. i'm sure you'll get more suggestions in this thread...

  8. #108
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    Originally posted by yeppie99
    erm..... part 2 of my quest. which film should i start with? I believe slide film right? is the procedure of taking with slide film same as negatives? do most developers do slide? wat do i do when i get back the developed slides? i choose which one i like and print it? how abt a typical description of wat happens from buying the film to getting it back? also which film exactly to start with? hehheh a lot of qns..... sorry again......
    I'd recommend you run a few rolls of print film (negative film) at the start to get the feel of the camera and photography in general. Once your comfortable then move on to chromes (slides) as shooting chromes will help hone your skill in getting good exposure levels. Good starting out film includes Kodak Gold 100 or 200 ISO, Fuji Superia in 100, 200 or 400 ISO ratings. Avoid Kodak Max 400 as it's awful stuff, grainy and with pretty foul colours.

    As for slide film, well it depends on what your personal tastes are, I'd recommend you try out as many different slide films as possible and settle on 2-3 slide films based on your personal preferences for things like colour cast and cost etc.

    Most Minilabs send slide of to be processed by a large scale lab known in the business as a wholesale lab that only deals with other labs.

    What happens is your film is picked up from the Minilab at some point during the day or next day and is delivered to the wholesale lab. This lab then processes the slide film, and mounts it before dispatching it back to the Minilab where it is then available for pickup.

    Prints from slides require either an internegative be made before printing, or if the Lab has the right technology a direct print from the slide can be made. Each method has it's own advantages and disadvantages and it's worth exploring each method if possible.
    The Ang Moh from Hell
    Professional Photography - many are called, few are chosen!

  9. #109
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    Default headache headache.........

    My eyes ---> I am still choosing btw F80(N80) or EOS 30/33 (Elan7) until I really wahaha........ cannot take it, later I am going to summarize what I have read recently. .... Really difficult to decide. Basically there are few simple enough argument:
    1) Chose any system, won't be wrong (Canon /Nikon)
    But I don't have experience with either one.........and read somewhere that both have "plastic" feel/toy ??
    2) Consider the lens, not the body
    Both made by a big portion of plastic? and ............(confusing , confusing)
    3) It is the photographer that does matter
    Without good tool how to take good pictures? (i read somewhere that there are some photographer/professional one.......they are using point and shoot camera!)

    ........what a mystery world!

  10. #110

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    my sentiments exactly... got headache reading all the threads already.... sigh..

  11. #111
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    Default Re: headache headache.........

    Originally posted by 007

    1) Chose any system, won't be wrong (Canon /Nikon)
    But I don't have experience with either one.........and read somewhere that both have "plastic" feel/toy ??
    All of the current production consumer and semi pro bodies suffer from the dreaded 'feel like plastic' syndrome. However when all is said and done if you can't decide which system to buy then it's worth considering the ergonomics of the cameras you are interested in. No matter how good a camera is, if it doesn't feel right in your hand you'll never be happy.

    Why not go along on one of the field trips organised by various memebers of Club Snap? I'm sure that some of the kind people who go on such trips would be glad to let you try out different cameras and explain their features.
    Originally posted by 007

    2) Consider the lens, not the body
    Both made by a big portion of plastic? and ............(confusing , confusing)
    Ultimately the camera is merely a vehicle to expose the film to the light falling on it from the lens. Lenses are really the most critical factor in a system and more importance should be placed on the lens than the camera body. Of secondary importance in most photography are features such as VR/IS (gyroscopic lens stabilizers), Fast AF speed such as AFS/USM and colour of the lens, cosmetics etc.
    Originally posted by 007

    3) It is the photographer that does matter
    Without good tool how to take good pictures? (i read somewhere that there are some photographer/professional one.......they are using point and shoot camera!)
    This is the truth, no amount of technology will make someone a competent photographer as competence comes from a combination of technical skill, artistic vision and the ability to put on film what they 'see' as a final shot. Technology can assist the photographer, but it is not a panacea for a lack of knowledge and ability gained from real world experience. Reading something and knowing it academically is not the same as being able to put such knowledge to practical use, thus in the case of photography book only or theoretical knowledge doesn't equate to good images on film.
    Originally posted by 007

    ........what a mystery world!
    Sadly many find it extremely confusing for the first couple of years, however in time this world becomes much less daunting and clearer.
    The Ang Moh from Hell
    Professional Photography - many are called, few are chosen!

  12. #112
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    I must say, I really liao.

    But I got the first source to share:


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    Second part.
    Really
    to compile these lists..........



  14. #114
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    Third part
    Btw, these comparisons are for newbies...sorry ... too primitive in information to some extends.........

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    Whoa!!! You actually did all that ah? So where do you find time to..........erm.............take pictures???

  16. #116
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    Sorry, still compiling the information that I have gathered..
    headache headache headache......


    by the way, I just pressed "print screen" not taking pictures.




  17. #117
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    sorry to light the flame again.........

    Canon Vs Nikon
    (I knew this is a very naive question and has been debated in many forums)

    Let's make a local one!






  18. #118

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    Good effort 007, but you can actually get info of comparison (same brand but different model) from B&H website. Will save lots of your time in typing. Good effort anywhere. What's your conclusion then? The AP quote of F80 with 28-80mm lens is definitely a very best buy for newcomer to SLR.
    DR KOH KHO KING

  19. #119
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    Originally posted by Kho King
    Good effort 007, but you can actually get info of comparison (same brand but different model) from B&H website. Will save lots of your time in typing. Good effort anywhere. What's your conclusion then? The AP quote of F80 with 28-80mm lens is definitely a very best buy for newcomer to SLR.
    Yeah, good effort but I personally think that the "good effort" can be put into better use like..........erm..........taking photos.

    Then again, its just me, I might be wrong. Not experienced enough to understand what photography really means...........

  20. #120
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    Assumption:
    The Faith in the brand
    1. We always heard that most of the complaints are thrown toward Canon. You seldom heard that nikon users complain about the nikon products that they have used. Why? I think mainly is because a lot of users still believe in the myth of the nikon (brand). I strongly agree that after years of experiences,
    sure Nikon, such a big and well-known company gained a lot of experiences in producing their precious equipment.
    But under certain circumstances (eg: competitiveness, cost, market, ) after much consideration, Nikon has to do some
    changes to survive. The biggest change is the change from metal body to "plastic" body..etc. So, you can easily notice that
    let's say a camera user was given a nikon F80 and canon EOS 30. Let's say there are some problems in F80 (no because
    of the manufacturers fault), then he will draw and conclusion that" it is not the nikon's fault, it is my fault. It is merely
    my fault! There are so many professional photographers out there, they didn't complain about that!, It is my fault!"
    Whereby, for an EOS 30, the user will complain a lot. I think this mainly depends on the faith of the user. I strongly agree that it is the matter of the creativity of the users themselves, not the equipment. But without a proper equipment, it is impossible to produce good images.

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