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Thread: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

  1. #81

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    I have looked at TS's photos and am intrigued enough to post the following question. Why were some elements out of focus? Was it too slow a shutter speed or too big an aperture setting? Taking pictures of crew moving about in cabin lighting- what would be optimal f no and aperture? would only the use of flash prevent blurring? Is there a combination of f no and shutter speed without flash that would result in sharp photos? Would flash guarantee non-blurriness on such an occasion? Hope you could kindly enlighten me. Thanks.
    Last edited by canon450D; 15th March 2010 at 09:30 PM.

  2. #82
    Member whizzard's Avatar
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    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by canon450D View Post
    I have looked at TS's photos and am intrigued enough to post the following question. Why were some elements out of focus? Was it too slow a shutter speed or too big an aperture setting? Taking pictures of crew moving about in cabin lighting- what would be optimal f no and aperture? would only the use of flash prevent blurring? Is there a combination of f no and shutter speed without flash that would result in sharp photos? Would flash guarantee non-blurriness on such an occasion? Hope you could kindly enlighten me. Thanks.
    Thanks for your feedback on my photos.

    I used a 35 mm and was shooting at f1.4, which on retrospect, I should have used a smaller aperture since it created such a shallow DOF that other than the focal point, the rest was rendered OOF.

    As I wasn't using a flash, I bumped up my ISO setting (believe it was ISO 1,000) so that my shutter speed need not be too slow in order not to risk blurriness from camera shake. The general rule of thumb I have been taught is to ensure that the shutter speed is at least the reciprocal of the lens' focal length to avoid blurring due to camera shake.

    In summary, if I were to take the photos again, I would use a much smaller aperture e.g. f5.6(instead of f1.4) to reduce the shallow DOF, compensate that with a higher ISO of say 3,200 and maybe a shutter speed of 60 or so, depending on the lighting, without a flash unit. Hopefully, more of the photo would be sharper.

  3. #83

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    From the picture, I find that the guy pointing at you is a very rude gesture to stop you from taking picture. You can actually play punk by complaining to his chief crew for not telling you politely to put off your camera. It will leave him a bad record and affect his future career in air-line. I have several friends working onboard in SIA, they say taking pictures in plane is not allow only during taking off and landing period.

  4. #84

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    simple rule of thumb (and like others have mentioned), if taking pictures of people working, if they allow you to snap, go ahead, smile at them, let them be aware, everybody is happy, but if they frown or overtly object, just point your camera away, and smile apologetically...

    forget about whether the law allows you to do this and that, that we must live to the very last letter of the law... have some give and take and we can all live in a more gracious society... and don't forget, they are making a living and are already under stress to perform, whereas we are practicing our skills...

  5. #85

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by boxboxbox View Post
    From the picture, I find that the guy pointing at you is a very rude gesture to stop you from taking picture. You can actually play punk by complaining to his chief crew for not telling you politely to put off your camera. It will leave him a bad record and affect his future career in air-line. I have several friends working onboard in SIA, they say taking pictures in plane is not allow only during taking off and landing period.
    I am not too sure about this, just because we can kick up a fuss doesn't mean we should.

  6. #86
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    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by agape01 View Post
    This is service in business class.

    Frankly speaking, the TS can easily launch a serious complaint to SIA for discrimination. Since you're a frequent flier on SQ, you have every single right to take shots in the plane as there is no written notice that photography is not allowed. I remember some years back after 9/11 someone in CS went to photograph inside of a cockpit and posted it on CS. Frankly speaking that person should be arrested and not you. Totally agree where you are coming from, but on the other hand you could have just sat in your seat and take the shots from there.

    The ang moh on the other hand was not repremanded and yes, you have every right to ask. True it may cause a scene, but of course this can be asked much later in the flight with the chief steward.

    Anyway, that is my opinion about the whole thing.
    I didn't want to create a scene then as it would be uncomfortable for me, the steward and the angmoh, not to mention the other neighbouring passengers in the cabin.

    Since its SIA, and it prides itself as a great service company, I am also curious to see their response, and whether they truly value customer service or its just lip service.

    Koh Boon Hwee (after he left SIA) once recounted with pride to me about the "service recovery" that is imbued in SIA. There was a passenger on 1st class who asked the stewardess to give him the remainder of the bottle of caviar that he did not finish at the end of the inflight service. According to policy, the stewardess was not allowed to do that. However, seeing the look of disappointment on the passenger's face, at the end of the flight, just as the passenger was disembarking the plane, she presented him with an unopened bottle of caviar, gift wrapped, and said "Sir, we don't give our customers a half used bottle of caviar. Here's a new bottle for you to enjoy."

    I am curious to see how an organisation that prides itself with such exemplary service culture would respond to my feedback.

  7. #87

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by ahbian View Post
    I am not too sure about this, just because we can kick up a fuss doesn't mean we should.
    i agree with this.

    at the end of the day, even if say, person x knows nothing about photographers' rights, getting him into trouble without first trying to talk to him nicely and explain, etc.. is not going to help people's impressions of photographers as a community.

  8. #88
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    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by boxboxbox View Post
    From the picture, I find that the guy pointing at you is a very rude gesture to stop you from taking picture. You can actually play punk by complaining to his chief crew for not telling you politely to put off your camera. It will leave him a bad record and affect his future career in air-line. I have several friends working onboard in SIA, they say taking pictures in plane is not allow only during taking off and landing period.
    I could have shifted the focus on him and started snapping away, which I didn't, as that was not my intent.

    I was taken aback ... like, woah OK better stop snapping right away. That was my last photo BTW.

  9. #89

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by ahbian View Post
    I am not too sure about this, just because we can kick up a fuss doesn't mean we should.
    agreed... we can pursue this to see how far it may go for our own understanding or perversely for our amusement, but the other party's livelihood is at stake here... live and let live...

  10. #90

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by ahbian View Post
    I am not too sure about this, just because we can kick up a fuss doesn't mean we should.
    it is just a suggestion to let him know that he can actually file a complain, the air-crew have demerit point and they will do their best not to offend passenger.


    Quote Originally Posted by whizzard View Post
    I could have shifted the focus on him and started snapping away, which I didn't, as that was not my intent.

    I was taken aback ... like, woah OK better stop snapping right away. That was my last photo BTW.
    Yeah i will react the same way if i were you, don't really want to attract so much attention and make my flight unpleasant.

  11. #91

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by whizzard View Post
    I just found out that photography is not allowed onboard a SIA aircraft.

    I was flying to Sydney earlier this week and decided to take some photos in the plane whilst I was at my seat. The steward came charging at me and gesturing rather rudely that photography is not alllowed onboard an aircraft.

    Wonder if anyone encountered the same? I wasn't even using a flash or intruding on any of the passengers' privacy. Sigh .....
    Actually in most airlines they have this policy whereby you're not supposed to take any photos of the interior and layouts,got nothing got to do with comfort or intrusion of others,or usage of flash. It is simply for safety and security. This ruling has been in the industry for quite sometimes already actually. I know it may sounds ridiculous...same goes to the bill in the UK on photography in public places. But apparently,this is how the terrorist gains information. hope this info helps...

  12. #92

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    It's Air Asia's fault!

  13. #93

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by kiwi2 View Post
    No offence I'll just be direct here: Please be more sensible.

    Who are you and why should the steward trust you? Please consider the general safety of the public.

    Your case reminds me of this guy at a US airport. He was carrying this super huge thingy. I can't remember what it was, some kinda musical instrument or whatever. He didn't want to check it in. And yet, if you looked at it, you'd know it was also ridiculous to hand carry it because of its super huge size. Yet he insisted, quarreled and even made life very difficult for a female airport staff. Her other staff got to step in to help out. Finally, the colleague told the passenger: "Look, she's only DOING HER JOB!"

    Yes, no photography is allowed on SQ flights. I'm surprised you (and some others here) didn't know this since you said you are a "loyal flyer of SQ". This No Photographer rule was enforced a few years ago as far as my own experience tells me. Maybe it was enforced even earlier.

    I've looked at your pics. What were you trying to achieve? There's no meaning to it, either artistically or for the sake of photography. It looks more like voyeurism except that the stewardess was dressed up. Come on, stop giving the craps lament Oh what a pity, I wish to improve my skills in photography. There are many other ways to do that.

    Sure, you can justify all you want that you are harmless blah blah.... But who are you? you're a nobody to SIA. If it's so easy, everyone can say I'm harmless and lurking around could be a real terrorist.

    Why no photography on board a plane? That's a no brainer. This rule is being enforced in many places also eg shopping centers etc. For those who have little travel experience, or have traveled but too lazy to think much, here are some:

    1. Terrorism. Photography is one means terrorists use to plan their stuffs. Nuff said.
    2. Using the photos for commercial purposes.
    3. Invasion of privacy/creating distractions among fellow passengers .

    I can list more but please use a bit of the grey matter to help you get the answers.

    I'm not sure why the caucasian got away with his flash photography. Did the steward see it? Perhaps not. If so, I'm sure he would have told him to stop taking pics also.

    Sometimes, it's hard. It's not always so clear cut when photography is allowed. It's nothing to do with race or skin color.

    So please don't be a simpleton and say "But I'm harmless and I want to learn my photography."
    very well said!

  14. #94
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    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by theRBK View Post
    agreed... we can pursue this to see how far it may go for our own understanding or perversely for our amusement, but the other party's livelihood is at stake here... live and let live...
    I don't know how to put this across. After the "incident" and after he had handed me the piece of paper with his name on it as per my request, I couldn't sleep the entire flight and decided to watch the movies onboard for the entire flight until 7:00am.

    Now, if I were him, being a professional customer service provider with many years of experience to boot, surely I would realise that this passenger is a little upset. Since this passenger was awake throughout the 8-hour flight, I would have ample opportunities to exercise service recovery (no need to offer me free vouchers, etc, etc).

    If I were him, I would have approached the passenger, apologised that I had to prevent the passenger from taking photos onboard the plane as it is against company policy for phototaking (assuming this is true) and perhaps just crack a joke or two to diffuse the situation. Being a very experienced cabin crew who would probably have seen and handled more "severe" incidents than this and carried out many service recoveries before, he had a choice and he made his choice, probably aware of the consequences. Maybe it was his ego that prevented him from doing so, maybe not, who knows.

    I believe he has done his rationalisation and believed that he acted appropriately, in which case there wasn't much else he needed to do.

    Anyway, the reason I posted this thread is just to share my "newly discovered" knowledge that phototaking is not allowed onboard a SIA aircraft. Its interesting that the thread has morphed into many other mini topics and also interesting to see some of the characters in CS. But, that's not something I am complaining about since its something I would have been expected to anticipate when I decided to post the first message.
    Last edited by whizzard; 15th March 2010 at 11:56 PM.

  15. #95

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    First time i heard that no photography is allow onboard. I have took some photos Eg: meals, skyline, sunrise and even has asked the stewardess to take a photo of me and my wife before. No problem. Maybe im lucky :P
    Last edited by creative-studio; 15th March 2010 at 11:59 PM.
    "Enjoy the fun of photography :)"

  16. #96

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    The reason is because your camera was "too big".

    * * *

    Articles Allowed Onboard

    All airline members of the International Air transport Association (IATA) have agreed to observe the following baggage regulations. You may carry onboard the articles listed below free of charge, over and above your free baggage allowance (subject to local country specific restrictions, if any):

    * A lady’s handbag
    * An overcoat
    * An umbrella or walking stick
    * A laptop or notebook computer
    * A small camera
    * A reasonable amount of reading material for the flight
    * Infant’s food for consumption in flight and infant’s carrying basket
    * A pair of crutches and/or other prosthetic devices for the passenger’s use provided the passenger is dependent upon them

  17. #97

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by pokiemon View Post
    how about asking nightmare to pose for you in sia uniform? he can do cheeky poses. he may even pay you.
    actually, i don't want to wear anything.

  18. #98
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    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    actually, i don't want to wear anything.
    Oh my, then I definitely am not qualified to take photos of you. Afraid I may use the wrong aperture and can't capture you crisp and sharp!

  19. #99

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by kiwi2 View Post
    Yes, no photography is allowed on SQ flights. I'm surprised you (and some others here) didn't know this since you said you are a "loyal flyer of SQ". This No Photographer rule was enforced a few years ago as far as my own experience tells me. Maybe it was enforced even earlier.
    i'm also surprised that i didn't know this, along with the 10,000 other people in my frequent flights on sq that have been taking photos happily during sq flights, with the air stewardesses and air stewards walking by.

    i have even gone to the back row where they do their things during flight time sometimes, bumped into them while taking pictures with dslr through the window there, no one said anything.

    i must be invisible!

  20. #100

    Default Re: No photography onboard SIA aircraft

    Quote Originally Posted by whizzard View Post
    Oh my, then I definitely am not qualified to take photos of you. Afraid I may use the wrong aperture and can't capture you crisp and sharp!
    anyways, i'm not sure why they stopped you,

    but suffice to say, whatever your intentions were, giving benefit of doubt as to stated reason - i think perhaps if you place yourself in the other party's shoes... whether it is air steward, air stewardess, perhaps it is nicer to ask for permission next time.

    certainly you might have a right to take photos of the staff - that's more or less probably the case.. but if you have been shooting them nonstop and they are noticing it the females in particular do also have a right to feel uneasy.. and perhaps too paiseh to speak to you.

    remember, as a photographer, your subjects, unless it is a landscape, etc.. also has feelings. even if it doesn't, you should take care to take into consideration what your actions may result in. not everyone is very happy to take pictures, some people may be good looking but camera-shy.. one or two may be normal and acceptable to them, 10 and counting might be overboard.

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