Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 73

Thread: what happen to thread-invitation to nude photography

  1. #41
    vince123123
    Guests

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pro Image
    Larry is right and the legal age is 21 and above but that doesn't mean any photographer can still take nude shots. If caught, you better have your lawyer's mobile phone ready.
    Under what law/statute/case which you gather that taking photos of people under the age of 21 is ILLEGAL?

    illegal acts and legal capacity to enter into a contract fall under the separate realms of criminal and civil liability.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pro Image
    Organizers who organise shoots without knowing the girls age will be the first to be fined or go to jail or both. Next is photographers who participate will be charge too. Even with the model's consent who is under the age of 21! So Guys and Gals out there, please ask all the organizers on all aspect that concerning the models age and background.
    for criminal, can point me to the law which says its ILLEGAL to take photos of a person UNDER 21?

    for civil liability, first it is unclear under the current case law that the age of a minor is 21 (although probably so, according to a leading commentator)

    second, even if a minor contracts, it doesn't mean the contract is without legal effect, even if it means the minor may not be bound by the contract.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pro Image
    Parents/Legal guardian have every right to sue any organizers/photographers who shoot their children below the age of 21 without their consent. So I think the thread starter maybe under age, correct me if I am wrong.
    in any event, under what legal right does the parent/legal guardian assert to sue the organisers? contract? tort? others?

    the answer is that its more than it meets the eye

  2. #42
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    3,911

    Default

    Ooooh yes. Lovely. See below.

  3. #43
    vince123123
    Guests

    Default

    LOL

  4. #44
    Deregistered
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Planet Nikon
    Posts
    21,905

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by hwchoy
    I model your lens will *crack*
    Can try, how? Game?

  5. #45

    Default

    does it means u need to apply for a license to shoot?

  6. #46
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Last planet from the sun
    Posts
    2,822

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by vince123123
    Under what law/statute/case which you gather that taking photos of people under the age of 21 is ILLEGAL?

    illegal acts and legal capacity to enter into a contract fall under the separate realms of criminal and civil liability.



    for criminal, can point me to the law which says its ILLEGAL to take photos of a person UNDER 21?

    for civil liability, first it is unclear under the current case law that the age of a minor is 21 (although probably so, according to a leading commentator)

    second, even if a minor contracts, it doesn't mean the contract is without legal effect, even if it means the minor may not be bound by the contract.



    in any event, under what legal right does the parent/legal guardian assert to sue the organisers? contract? tort? others?

    the answer is that its more than it meets the eye
    Welll you are right on some parts which I totally agree. Then again, although there is no law at the moment regarding this issue, if a model age 21 and below decide to cry foul what will happend? What will you do if you are the photographer or the organizer? Hope to hear your view.........not flaming you. I hope to get a better insight view on what you can and cannot do.

    Still learning over here......on Singapore Law

    Thanks
    Last edited by Pro Image; 18th March 2004 at 01:12 PM.

  7. #47
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    singapore
    Posts
    5,499

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by reachme2003
    Larry,
    Moderator

    Would your action be any different if the thread starter was of legal age, thus with legal capacity to contract and 'artfully' positioned so as not to infringe Undesirable Publications Act.
    reachme2003, you raised a good point so I thought I should clarify further.

    In principle, no my action wouldn't be any different. Reasons being...

    - that nude photography is a very sensitive topic, subject to many ethical, social and legal considerations and implications.
    - any serious photographer/model interested in pursuing this aspect of photography shouldn't even be canvassing openly or publicly, but should privately engage or work with like-minded people, preferably professionals, to maintain a level of acceptability and legality.
    - CS is after all a public/open forum, where anyone can join and anyone can also hide behind the anonymity of the Internet, unless organizations like PSS or SAFRA where membership is regulated and controlled. there isn't any practical way to determine or enforce if any CS members are of legal age or not.
    - ClubSNAP should not, and would not, be the arbitary judge of what is 'artfully' positioned or legally/socailly acceptable. That's the premise of the SBA or MDA. We have been consistent in that any activities/images regarding nude photography or workshops have been removed, with/without explanation.

    Generally the CS mods are of the consensus that such a position is more for members' protection and benefits. Again, I emphasise that other than maintaining a level of decency and acceptability in our growing community, ClubSNAP has nothing to gain.

    Hope this makes matters clearer, for reachme2003 and all members.

  8. #48
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Tampines, Singapore.
    Posts
    1,899

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by espn
    Can try, how? Game?
    wait, let me check MY IC number first, don't want my mom to sue you

  9. #49

    Default

    Is it posibble to request them to re-open the thread? Nude photograph is art.

  10. #50
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    singapore
    Posts
    5,499

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by juste_millieu
    Is it posibble to request them to re-open the thread? Nude photograph is art.
    juste_millieu, i thought we made our stand very very clear already on this. No we will not re-open the thread, and in any case, the thread wasn't about nude photography. it was about someone offering to be a nude model. And yes while I agree that nude photography is a form of art, there is a time and place for it and a online forum is definitely not the right place for it. There are minors here that we have to consider.

  11. #51
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    WAT? WAN TO STALK MI AH? LOLZ
    Posts
    1,916

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by juste_millieu
    Is it posibble to request them to re-open the thread? Nude photograph is art.
    yr avatar is cute enuff... bodylandscape may sound betta ?

  12. #52
    Senior Member Sion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    新天地
    Posts
    4,768

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by juste_millieu
    Is it posibble to request them to re-open the thread? Nude photograph is art.
    Larry is protecting CS' interests and indirectly protecting us from a couple of years of free curry rice and ocassional free haircuts in a cell. Don't know whether you can get photo outings or not in there.


  13. #53

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Larry
    juste_millieu, i thought we made our stand very very clear already on this. No we will not re-open the thread, and in any case, the thread wasn't about nude photography. it was about someone offering to be a nude model. And yes while I agree that nude photography is a form of art, there is a time and place for it and a online forum is definitely not the right place for it. There are minors here that we have to consider.

    feel moderator action is appropriate.....

  14. #54

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sion
    Larry is protecting CS' interests and indirectly protecting us from a couple of years of free curry rice and ocassional free haircuts in a cell. Don't know whether you can get photo outings or not in there.

    u get outing everyday. but the best camera u can pray for is a kodak instant camera (or worse, a lomo without film...)

  15. #55

    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by Larry
    juste_millieu, i thought we made our stand very very clear already on this. No we will not re-open the thread, and in any case, the thread wasn't about nude photography. it was about someone offering to be a nude model. And yes while I agree that nude photography is a form of art, there is a time and place for it and a online forum is definitely not the right place for it. There are minors here that we have to consider.
    No, I will not request for the thread to be reopened. However, your tone is paternalistic. You mentioned that at CS, there are minors. But there are also many who are advanced in age and matured in outlook too.

    'Online forum' is not the platform for nude photography or for someone to offer to pose nude. I think that such a position is unnecessary. Taking into account the nature of online forum, the approach should be 'let the 'buyer/s be aware' or cavet emptor.

  16. #56
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Riddle Realms
    Posts
    5,688

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by reachme2003
    No, I will not request for the thread to be reopened. However, your tone is paternalistic. You mentioned that at CS, there are minors. But there are also many who are advanced in age and matured in outlook too.

    'Online forum' is not the platform for nude photography or for someone to offer to pose nude. I think that such a position is unnecessary. Taking into account the nature of online forum, the approach should be 'let the 'buyer/s be aware' or cavet emptor.
    Reachme2003... now, you are a person who seems quite comfortable with the application of law or at least, you have managed to phrase your earlier question in very precise yet thought provoking manner.

    Surely now, you can see what we are trying to to. And if you can, i shall spell it out to you. We have been trying to tactfully explain why the action was taken. Mayhaps it was an oversight that the thread was removed without any apparent reasons but it was eventually corrected with a very concise, if not succinct explanation from the one of the Moderators.

    Now, if you still do not have see the reason or the logic behind what we 're trying to do, and of course, think that this forum is way too regimented in terms of moderation, then perchance you might be in the wrong place?

    We do need to cater to a more liberal/mature audience but of course, we have amongst us, young impressionable youths or even impressionable adults. I'm quite sure a whole lot of us would love to have a free liberal forum where you will have the liberty to speak and post but then, when flames starts to appear and the whole forums degenerates, what would you one do then?

    We can allow it but you too need to understand that we received feedback in the form of PMs to "inform" us that such contents are not appropriate. And if you go through this thread, you will see that there are members who support the removal of the thread while there are some who thinks that the thread should be allowed to continue. There will be always 2 sides to the coin and there is always a flip side.

    So who is right then? Remember, it's always very easy to play the devil's advocate but it's alot worse by far (for some of us) to be stuck between the devil and the deep blue sea.

    Good day.
    Last edited by Wolfgang; 25th March 2004 at 12:37 AM.
    --
    "High Wired, Dream Sired"

  17. #57

    Question

    Hi,
    I have a query (pardon me if it sounds silly) :

    Say if a female photographer takes nude artistic shots of a female/male model (with model's consent), and the model is under 21 yrs old, is there any breaking of law??


  18. #58
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Riddle Realms
    Posts
    5,688

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by isis
    Hi,
    I have a query (pardon me if it sounds silly) :

    Say if a female photographer takes nude artistic shots of a female/male model (with model's consent), and the model is under 21 yrs old, is there any breaking of law??

    There is no such thing as a silly question (although I know of some people here who might beg to disagree) but I digress...

    There is no issue here on whether the photographer is Male or Female. But there is a big issue here when you mention the model is under 21. Under 21 means anything between a new born to 20 years old.

    Remember, themodel might be willing to signan agreement to absolve you of all responsibilities of doing the shoot but if the subject's parents found out and doesn't like what they se, they can still go lodge a magistrate complaint and claim that the photographer had either

    i. misled
    ii. coerced or even
    iii. using a form of bribe as a form of inducement

    and even if you wave that signed agreement in their face, there is nothing to say that the subject's legal guardian cannot proceed with a civil suit. And therein lies all the trouble. The photographer might just get off but the amount of time spent in court, the legals fees to be paid etc etc...

    Do you really need all these grief because of a artistic photo shoot?

    But of course, if the shoot happened and it was between 2 consenting adults and both parties knew what was going on, and of course, if there was a 3rd party available as chaperon, that would be a different issue all together.

    But of course, there is always another way to argue about this issue, and there will always be another point of view.

    Cheers.
    Last edited by Wolfgang; 25th March 2004 at 01:21 AM.
    --
    "High Wired, Dream Sired"

  19. #59
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    singapore
    Posts
    5,499

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by isis
    Hi,
    I have a query (pardon me if it sounds silly) :

    Say if a female photographer takes nude artistic shots of a female/male model (with model's consent), and the model is under 21 yrs old, is there any breaking of law??

    ok, i'm no lawyer, nor am i pretending to be knowledgeable about such legalities (so, lawyers in the house, pls feel free to correct me), but i think there's a few points to consider here...
    - according to the Age of Majority in SG, which is 21 years, any contractual agreements signed by a "minor" is not actionable. means it "holds no water". so to my understanding, even if a under-21 signs a model release form, it might not be legally submissible in case of a lawsuit/dispute/etc.
    - it depends on how the shoot was conducted - mabbe there's a chaperon/parent present to make sure everything is above-board? this relates more to sexual harrassment or molestation (doesn't mean a female can't be molested by another female AFAIK).
    - and ultimately, what is being done with the shots taken? to be exhibited in public (then MITA approval is needed if i not wrong)? used for personal portfolio or collection (in which case this is all moot since the photos will never be seen by public).

    so... in brief, i think there are many MANY social/ethical/legal complications and scenarios with such arrangements. let's come up with a few "what-if" situations. what if the photos accidentally gets "leaked" out into the Internet and the model sues? or what if the model sues for molestation, citing that she was manhandled/drugged/abused? or the parents finds out and sues the photographer for misleading a minor?

    which brings me back to my point - i'm not saying that nude photography is wrong. i'm saying if someone is really interested in artistic nudes (without going into motives or motivations), make your arrangments/queries IN PRIVATE, best by going to professionals for advice (the art schools should be of help here, since they have experience in hiring nude models for anatomical drawings, i think). posting public online threads is simply asking for trouble IMHO.

  20. #60
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    singapore
    Posts
    5,499

    Default

    oops i think i just repeated Wolfgang's answer... but the points are basically the same.

Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •