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Thread: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

  1. #1
    Member bullseyez's Avatar
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    Default blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    hi all, im having a prob when taking some landscape i like. i always like to take blue sky n cloud with some ground. but always the lower part of the photo(ground) turn out very dark.
    i tried CPL on it yet still can get wat i wan. pls help



    setting as follow: 1/250, f/10, iso-100, CPL attach, focus point at the ground.

    thx all for helping in advance
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    Member bullseyez's Avatar
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    What goes around comes around

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    Moderator Octarine's Avatar
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    Topics to read up:
    Metering methods (camera manual is a good starting point), Google also helps
    Exposure, Exposure compensation, Histogram
    Dynamic range
    GND filters
    EOS

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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    The issue u are facing is that the sky is much brighter than the ground. With this kinda scene, there is no way to expose correctly for BOTH the air and ground unless

    1) You use a gradient ND filter
    2) You can do an exposure merge
    3) You can overexpose the sky and do correct exposure for your buildings then pull back the sky in post process since details on it are usually less important that those on the buildings

    To do (3), just point your camera at the building, or somewhere low, press the * button on your camera once, then recompose and take your shot.

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    Member bullseyez's Avatar
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    Quote Originally Posted by sabee View Post
    The issue u are facing is that the sky is much brighter than the ground. With this kinda scene, there is no way to expose correctly for BOTH the air and ground unless

    1) You use a gradient ND filter
    2) You can do an exposure merge
    3) You can overexpose the sky and do correct exposure for your buildings then pull back the sky in post process since details on it are usually less important that those on the buildings

    To do (3), just point your camera at the building, or somewhere low, press the * button on your camera once, then recompose and take your shot.
    wat u mean by recompose?
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    1) Point at somewhere without too much sky (lower part of buildings for eg)
    2) Press the * button once
    3) Point at where you want to shoot
    4) Press your shuttter

    Done Sky will be overexposed but at least you'll get details on your buildings.

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    Member bullseyez's Avatar
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    Quote Originally Posted by sabee View Post
    1) Point at somewhere without too much sky (lower part of buildings for eg)
    2) Press the * button once
    3) Point at where you want to shoot
    4) Press your shuttter

    Done Sky will be overexposed but at least you'll get details on your buildings.
    but wat i wan is sky not over expose
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    As mentioned, its not possible without a ND grad or multiple exposure. What you "want" is irrelevant here unfortunately because of sensor limitation.

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    Member bullseyez's Avatar
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    Quote Originally Posted by sabee View Post
    As mentioned, its not possible without a ND grad or multiple exposure. What you "want" is irrelevant here unfortunately because of sensor limitation.
    got it. so a ND grad is needed then. can guide me more on ND grad? like how it really work?
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    Moderator Octarine's Avatar
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    Quote Originally Posted by bullseyez View Post
    got it. so a ND grad is needed then. can guide me more on ND grad? like how it really work?
    Got spoon to feed you?
    Use the search function upper right hand or use Google: key in "Gradual Neutral Density filter" (short: GND) - read. Other key words: Tianya and Cokin - the two most common filter brands for GND.
    EOS

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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    A ND grad, or graduated neutral density filter, is a filter that has gray areas near the top of it, and clear areas near the bottom. Basically the gray areas at the top will make the sky darker so they don't become overexposed and the clear area over your buildings allows them to be properly exposed.

    Here's a more detailed article: http://www.great-landscape-photograp...d-filters.html

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    Moderator daredevil123's Avatar
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    Also look up on the following:

    HDR
    Exposure blending
    Bracketing

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    Senior Member Numnumball's Avatar
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    Quote Originally Posted by bullseyez View Post
    but wat i wan is sky not over expose
    Thats when u need ND Grads, and how strong u need (0.3,0.6,0.9 , 1-3 stops etc) is another thing to think abt..

    If you add a GND filter without covering the subject interest in the dense portion of the filter, you will still get a correctly exposed subject and suppression of the exposure of the sky according to the strength of the GND u used. As the sky is not within the sampled area of metering, the camera will not compensate in metering.

    Whether the sky is adequately and appropriately suppressed of overexposure, it all depends on how bright is the sky and how strong is the GND in terms of density in terms of number of stops.
    One thing to note is u should meter spot through the clear (less dense) portion of the GND. Otherwise (if matrix/centerwieghted is used), u may get partial compensation..

    HTH.
    Last edited by Numnumball; 5th February 2010 at 12:05 PM.
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  14. #14

    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    Can we spot meter the sky and spot meter the trees and try to find hte mid point inbetween these exposure? then whatever else we'll use pp to settle. Will TS lose alot of details both sides?
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    Moderator daredevil123's Avatar
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    Quote Originally Posted by blurry80 View Post
    Can we spot meter the sky and spot meter the trees and try to find hte mid point inbetween these exposure? then whatever else we'll use pp to settle. Will TS lose alot of details both sides?
    If you shoot RAW and want to balance the exposures in PP, it is advisable to use the technique called "Exposing to the Right". Meaning, you slightly overexpose as much as you can without clipping any of the highlights (look at the histogram). After that, in PP, pull back on exposure in PP, and add Graduated exposure reduction on areas you need.

    This is how I took this shot, since it is too cold to set up GNDs and filter holders. Temperature is around -22 degC at that time. Just shoot and go back into the house:

    Final result


    resized jpg out of camera (I shoot in RAW + BASIC)


    One thing though, this will work if the differences in exposure in the bright and dark areas is not too big. If too big, you need multiple exposures and do blending in layers.
    Last edited by daredevil123; 5th February 2010 at 12:42 PM.

  16. #16

    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    Quote Originally Posted by blurry80 View Post
    Can we spot meter the sky and spot meter the trees and try to find hte mid point inbetween these exposure? then whatever else we'll use pp to settle. Will TS lose alot of details both sides?
    you might still end up with blown out highlights

    or blocked shadows

    even if the shadows are not blocked, you will get noise when recovering the details

    your choice

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    Senior Member Diavonex's Avatar
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?


  18. #18

    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    whats the diff between ND filter and polariser filter?

    cos poloriser makes the sky nicer also...

  19. #19
    Moderator Octarine's Avatar
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    Default Re: blue sky & cloud but dark ground?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeeeey View Post
    whats the diff between ND filter and polariser filter?
    cos poloriser makes the sky nicer also...
    A CPL filters a certain level of light, it's a selective cutting / passing through of light based on polarization layer. ND and GND don't select, they cut all kinds of layers in the same way. It's nicely described on the links provided. No ND will help when you want to filter reflections - but it helps independently from where the sun is coming. A CPL might work as ND2 but will always filter also selectively and the effect depends on the direction / position to the sun. The right tool for the right purpose.
    EOS

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