D70 caution #2: Preflash is NOT 'nearly-invisible'

[khinmarn]

The monitor preflash is strong enough to false trigger slave units.

I like to utilize the built-in flash to 'wirelessly' trigger strobe and remote slaves. I have never objected the lack of PC sync function in the amateur models, but with the D70 this is a major setback, I can no longer use this handy method anymore.

Although the flash sync has been upped to 1/500s, the preflash is a dumb down for otherwise an excellent camera which could be utilized by pros. Even the consumer grade cameras of today had mostly eliminate this crude way to derive the correct flash exposure.

[kahheng]

Originally Posted by khinmarn I have never objected the lack of PC sync function in the amateur models. I have always utilize the built-in flash to 'wirelessly' trigger strobe and remote slaves. With the D70 this is a major setback, the monitor preflash is strong enough to false trigger slave units. I can no longer use this method anymore. Although the flash sync has been upped to 1/500s, the preflash is a dumb down for otherwise an excellent camera which could be utilized by pros. Even the consumer grade cameras of today had mostly eliminate this crude way to derive the correct flash exposure.

Surely you don't mean to say that the D70 has NO hotshoe and you don't mean to say that because of that you can't hook up a hotshoe adapter foot with a PC sync socket and you don't mean to say that you then can't hook that up to a wireless transmitter; OR you don't mean to say you can't just use a Wein IR transmitter with the camera's hotshoe without using the pop-up flash?

[moriarty]

What do you mean by "the monitor prefalsh is strong enough to trigger the slave"? As far as I know, the slave flashes are not triggered by light. They are triggered by IR waves with a perticular frequency. So, I do not think the slave flahses can ever be triggered by monitor preflsh. Correct me if I am wrong.

[Dennis]

Nikon expect you to use their SB-800 and SB-600, surely no problem.

[khinmarn]

Originally Posted by kahheng Surely you don't mean to say that the D70 has NO hotshoe and you don't mean to say that because of that you can't hook up a hotshoe adapter foot with a PC sync socket and you don't mean to say that you then can't hook that up to a wireless transmitter; OR you don't mean to say you can't just use a Wein IR transmitter with the camera's hotshoe without using the pop-up flash?

I do agree, the hotshoe can be used. But your suggestion for wireless would cost $300 for something that I get for free with F80/100!! Anyway, I regard the preflash implementation is a step backwards for Nikon.

[wibawa]

Originally Posted by khinmarn The monitor preflash is strong enough to false trigger slave units.

I'm not sure why you post this info and the other one...
Both has been clearly stated & discussed way before d70 was available in the market.

By saying the statement without informing that wireless ttl flash can be done with optional sb600/sb800 is not quite right, IMO.

[weihui]

Originally Posted by wibawa I'm not sure why you post this info and the other one... Both has been clearly stated & discussed way before d70 was available in the market. By saying the statement without informing that wireless ttl flash can be done with optional sb600/sb800 is not quite right, IMO.

I think he's pretty new to DSLR. D70 should be his first DSLR. Let's say welcome to the 'real' world .

All these topics have been discussed as early as D100 launched? Nothing is new here... Go search or read a few topics and you will know.

[Jed]

Nikon have had a problem with this for some time, again absolutely nothing new. Nikon's claim that the monitor preflash is unnoticeable depends largely upon the user using front curtain sync. If done so, then the preflash merges as one into the main flash, making it seem like only one single flash to the naked eye.

Unfortunately, this means that for people who want to use on board flashes to trigger slaves, then they are stuck because there is no way to turn off the preflash. With a Nikon flash gun, it's easy enough to switch to normal non-preflashed TTL, or manual mode, or A mode, or AA mode. End of discussion, problem solved. The whole issue is that a built in flash is no designed to trigger off camera flash units, because its output will directly influence the multiple flash set up as there is no way of dialling down the main flash directly.

I seem to recall vaguely reading that the D70 actually supported turning the preflash off, so as to enable standard wireless shooting. But you're on your own with this one with regards to confirming it and figuring out how to do it.

I think the theory goes that for someone who's buying a D70, multiple flash is not going to be high on your list of priorities, so it wasn't a big option. And I wouldn't call it a problem... the EOS 1D, 1Ds, 1DmkII, D1, D1x, D1h, D2h all have the same problem, they cannot trigger a remote flash with their onboard flash unit either.

[gadrian]

Originally Posted by Jed I seem to recall vaguely reading that the D70 actually supported turning the preflash off, so as to enable standard wireless shooting. But you're on your own with this one with regards to confirming it and figuring out how to do it.

If I am not mistaken.. it is the same as the D100.. turn you flash mode for D-TTL to M.

[Jed]

Hmm, can you do that for the built in flash? Would be interested to find out how you do this.

[czeyang]

Originally Posted by Jed Hmm, can you do that for the built in flash? Would be interested to find out how you do this.

CSM19 allows you to set to built in flash to ttl, manual or commander mode.

[YSLee]

*whine*

http://www.bythom.com/sb25.htm

"TTL flash control on most TTL-capable Nikon bodies, monitor pre-flash on F90/N90 or later bodies;

Introduced in 1992."

[Jed]

Originally Posted by czeyang CSM19 allows you to set to built in flash to ttl, manual or commander mode.

Thanks very much Czeyang. Pity my DSLR doesn't seem to let me do that. But it seems:

[1] I know the D70 better than the original poster even though I don't own one and he does.
[2] It renders his original complaint moot since there is a way around his problem, he just doesn't know his camera well enough.

[gadrian]

Originally Posted by Jed Thanks very much Czeyang. Pity my DSLR doesn't seem to let me do that. But it seems: [1] I know the D70 better than the original poster even though I don't own one and he does. [2] It renders his original complaint moot since there is a way around his problem, he just doesn't know his camera well enough.

Nikon USA's press-release on the D70's built speedlight

"The D70’s built-in speedlight can also be used in Commander Mode to remotely control one group of multiple wireless SB-600 and/or SB-800 Speedlights for new opportunities in flash picture taking not realized with lesser systems. Alternately, you can attach an SB-800 used as the Master Speedlight and use it for even more control of up to three remote groups of wireless speedlights, with each group consisting of any number of Nikon SB-800 or SB-600 Speedlight units."

[sehsuan]

Originally Posted by khinmarn The monitor preflash is strong enough to false trigger slave units. I like to utilize the built-in flash to 'wirelessly' trigger strobe and remote slaves. I have never objected the lack of PC sync function in the amateur models, but with the D70 this is a major setback, I can no longer use this handy method anymore. Although the flash sync has been upped to 1/500s, the preflash is a dumb down for otherwise an excellent camera which could be utilized by pros. Even the consumer grade cameras of today had mostly eliminate this crude way to derive the correct flash exposure.

um. whatever you call it, seems like most current marketed flash systems all use a preflash to check for TTL metering, whatever prefix-TTL they're called - i, D, A, E etc...

[Larry]

Originally Posted by khinmarn I like to utilize the built-in flash to 'wirelessly' trigger strobe and remote slaves. I have never objected the lack of PC sync function in the amateur models, but with the D70 this is a major setback, I can no longer use this handy method anymore.

there's a workaround solution around this. get the AS-15 flash adapter. mounts to the flash hotshoe, allows PC sync. so can use your strobes and studio lights.

[khinmarn]

Originally Posted by gadrian If I am not mistaken.. it is the same as the D100.. turn you flash mode for D-TTL to M.

Solution for Caution #2 received from GADRIAN
Under Custom Setting 19: Flash mode, it can be changed to Manual mode - select desired output ie. full power, 1/2, 1/4, 1/8, 1/16 etc. And voila NO monitor preflash is emitted, allowing the built-in Speedlight to function as master flash.

Thanks for the word of wisdom, your advise is what I was hoping to find!

[gadrian]

Originally Posted by khinmarn Solution for Caution #2 received from GADRIAN Under Custom Setting 19: Flash mode, it can be changed to Manual mode - select desired output ie. full power, 1/2, 1/4, 1/8, 1/16 etc. And voila NO monitor preflash is emitted, allowing the built-in Speedlight to function as master flash. Thanks for the word of wisdom, your advise is what I was hoping to find!

Glad to help.. just keep asking.. and will try to help.

[showtime]

Originally Posted by khinmarn The monitor preflash is strong enough to false trigger slave units. I like to utilize the built-in flash to 'wirelessly' trigger strobe and remote slaves. I have never objected the lack of PC sync function in the amateur models, but with the D70 this is a major setback, I can no longer use this handy method anymore. Although the flash sync has been upped to 1/500s, the preflash is a dumb down for otherwise an excellent camera which could be utilized by pros. Even the consumer grade cameras of today had mostly eliminate this crude way to derive the correct flash exposure.

i believe that there are ways to cancel the monitor preflash just like the D100 does.... albeit in a different manner.

[Larry]

speaking of remote flash, has anyone tried using the built-in Speedlight as a master commander for a remote SB800 unit? does it work?