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Thread: how do you calculate the resale value

  1. #21

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Lowballers stay out! Hahaha
    Tum podem extulit horridulum...日出東方﹐唯我不敗。

  2. #22
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    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    One seller told me "At this price, why not I buy from you instead?"

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  3. #23

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paranoid View Post
    One seller told me "At this price, why not I buy from you instead?"

    Tum podem extulit horridulum...日出東方﹐唯我不敗。

  4. #24

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    IMHO, resale value strongly depends on the demand of the lens.

    If you monitor the BnS market well, you know some 2nd hand lenses can fetch a good price (buy 3rd hand, sell 2nd hand also no problem); while some depreciates much faster. Why? There's no definite formula for this phenomenon but the demands that determines it.

    When less people are looking for the lens and the seller can't get it off, they will eventually reduce the price to attract the "demand".
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  5. #25

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Quote Originally Posted by eyes View Post
    Assuming that the useful life span of the lens is 10 years (or 120 months), and that the recommended retail price of Nikkor AF-S DX NIKKOR 35mm f/1.8G: SGD 399.00 (source: Nikon Singapore), the lens sold within the 1 year period should be priced around SGD 200.00.

    I know some folks will argue on the intangibility or aesthetic aspects of the items being sold. But buyers like me buy a lens only to take pictures and not frame them in trophies in galleries or museums for adoration; therefore, I price goods based purely on functional value.

    Hence the double decline depreciation.
    50% depreciation seems a bit excessive for an item that is still within warranty period, considering the useful life is 10 years. Just my opinion though.

  6. #26

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Quote Originally Posted by szeping View Post
    IMHO, resale value strongly depends on the demand of the lens.

    If you monitor the BnS market well, you know some 2nd hand lenses can fetch a good price (buy 3rd hand, sell 2nd hand also no problem); while some depreciates much faster. Why? There's no definite formula for this phenomenon but the demands that determines it.

    When less people are looking for the lens and the seller can't get it off, they will eventually reduce the price to attract the "demand".
    There's another method to drive demand- bid pedaling. By introducing false demands not just they create an opportunity to raise prices, they also build a culture of unethical behaviour. Demand is measureable so as false demands. Hence the saying, "there's a formula for everything that is created" or "the creator of the universe is the greatest mathematician."

    Quote Originally Posted by Muckafutha View Post
    50% depreciation seems a bit excessive for an item that is still within warranty period, considering the useful life is 10 years. Just my opinion though.

    In the beginning, I used to think of depreciation only in linear terms; however, after understanding that the mean time to failure (MTF in engineering terms & in 6 Sigma methodology) for electro-mechanical parts are not linear, I change my stance to adopt the double declining method to determine the benchmark that I'll use. This double declining method is not unique, even cars in Singapore are subjected to this type of depreciation.

    Although it is generally fair and acceptable that a Japanese lens can be said to have a useful lifespan of 10 years, but do production last the same 10 years? It is good to remember that the modern lens in it's complexity includes electro-magnetic (not electromagnets only but we're talking about semi-conductors) and mechanical parts which will certainly fail- though the failure time-span varies greatly amongst copies.

    In the event one does fail, how does the owner get to repair it unless there's another copy to cannibalise on?

    Another example are modern batteries with micro chips. You can't use after market batteries and we all know batteries have a life span. When the manufacturer no longer produces the model and decides to change the battery design for it's newer camera lines, where in the world can one find a replacement for a dead battery to run the digital camera.

    Hence, I believe the double declining depreciation method for the initial assessment in price determination is a fair choice.

    The exception I'll make is that it's a Leica equivalent (luxury, not normal good, snob item) or non electronic lens which are usually almost 100 percent mechanical and almost a no brainer to repair.

    Tum podem extulit horridulum...日出東方﹐唯我不敗。

  7. #27
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    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    In camera shops the usual deal used to be you walk out of the shop with the lens and it drops in value by 25%. Those days are long gone but it's a realistic price drop as second hand is second hand no matter how you figure it.
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  8. #28

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    If you are the buyer you will wish the price to be low... if you are the seller you will wish you sell at a good price.. So what is the problem... if the price is high just ignore why want to try yr luck and get funny replies... If the buyer thinks that his lens is made from gold then let him continue his dream lor..

  9. #29

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Quote Originally Posted by Paranoid View Post
    One seller told me "At this price, why not I buy from you instead?"

    that must have been me. and i would still say the same thing.

  10. #30
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    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Yes I've always found the used market in Singapore to a be a bit fudgy. I'll never understand how some people expect to get so much for their gear.

    [1] Warranties are generally not transferable.
    [2] You have no idea what the lens has been through even if it looks alright externally. That risk is tangible and the price should be discounted for to take this into account.
    [3] A used lens is never going to be in the same condition as a new one, even one that has been cared for. There will be some wear on the mechanisms, some dust inside, etc.

    When you take all that into account then in all honesty even a 20% reduction starts to look a bit stingy. People pay sizeable amounts for extended warranties, for example.

    But it's all a demand/supply thing as people have pointed out, and the unfortunate fact is for some reason there are people out there that will pay close to new prices.

    In contrast for example last month I bought a 14-24mm off eBay. The lens was a week old, with the invoice from a major online retailer to prove it. All the stuff was intact and the lens was flawless. I paid 908, compared to 1295 from the same retailer or 1269 or thereabouts which is the cheapest you can find it new.

    Working on the retailer's price, that's more or less a 30% discount for a lens that is a week old. And bear in mind eBay in large countries is generally a seller's market when it comes to photographic items.

    If any of you are thinking, yeah but that's eBay and there's a lot of risk involved - there is yes but there is plenty of buyer protection that would help if the lens arrived with a huge ding, and as for unseen damage, there's absolutely no difference than buying one you can look at first.

  11. #31
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    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Incidentally compare those 14-24 figures with those in Singapore.

    In the UK, converted to S$, I got my one week old lens for S$2029. Compared to a new retail of S$2894.

    In Singapore there are people trying to sell their six month old lens for S$2500. Compared to a new retail of S$2750.

    A couple of months ago I was coming back to Singapore and was looking to get a camera converted to IR. Despite the fact that cameras cost more when new in the UK, after trawling CS for second hand D80s I discovered it was cheaper for me to buy one second hand in the UK!

    The buyers are as much to blame at the end of the day; you can't fault someone for trying to sell something for as much money as he or she can get for it. The problem is the buyers that will pay for it.

  12. #32

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Quote Originally Posted by Jed View Post
    Incidentally compare those 14-24 figures with those in Singapore.

    In the UK, converted to S$, I got my one week old lens for S$2029. Compared to a new retail of S$2894.

    In Singapore there are people trying to sell their six month old lens for S$2500. Compared to a new retail of S$2750.

    A couple of months ago I was coming back to Singapore and was looking to get a camera converted to IR. Despite the fact that cameras cost more when new in the UK, after trawling CS for second hand D80s I discovered it was cheaper for me to buy one second hand in the UK!

    The buyers are as much to blame at the end of the day; you can't fault someone for trying to sell something for as much money as he or she can get for it. The problem is the buyers that will pay for it.
    that is why all my stuffs are first hand. haha! Don't want to lose sleep over those few bucks different from getting a brand new one from shop.

  13. #33

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Just get a new one bro.. I was looking around for a 50mm 1.4... some of the prices quoted are just out of wacc with the market...

  14. #34

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Quote Originally Posted by vlg134 View Post
    that is why all my stuffs are first hand. haha! Don't want to lose sleep over those few bucks different from getting a brand new one from shop.
    Yup agree. Warranty is key!

  15. #35
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    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Quote Originally Posted by Jed View Post
    , and the unfortunate fact is for some reason there are people out there that will pay close to new prices
    and thats the reason ... something that totally beats me...and to add to it, i asked a few buyers how much did you buy it for and got no PM back.

    another thing that you can never tell is how many hands the lens has exchanged..he might have himself bought it for X and no selling you for X back, claiming he is the first owner and has very conveniently lost the receipt
    Last edited by deepanshus; 9th January 2010 at 08:02 PM.
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  16. #36
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    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    have you seen the 1-year old 24-70s going for $2000? hahaha i want to know what those sellers are smoking!

    is a 2 year old 5D with grip going at $2150 with additional accessories considered "out of whack"? just wondering..cos i'm selling one
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  17. #37

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Quote Originally Posted by antacid View Post
    have you seen the 1-year old 24-70s going for $2000? hahaha i want to know what those sellers are smoking!

    is a 2 year old 5D with grip going at $2150 with additional accessories considered "out of whack"? just wondering..cos i'm selling one
    Not as out of whack as the 6 million ppl who sell their 2nd hand LX3 for $600 and have buyers!! When you can get a new one (with equivalent accessories) from SLR R for $660....

    Who says Singaporeans are poor? no wonder our cost of living increase every year.

  18. #38

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Quote Originally Posted by sci80899 View Post
    Not as out of whack as the 6 million ppl who sell their 2nd hand LX3 for $600 and have buyers!! When you can get a new one (with equivalent accessories) from SLR R for $660....
    have carrot, will chop!

  19. #39
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    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Quote Originally Posted by sci80899 View Post
    Not as out of whack as the 6 million ppl who sell their 2nd hand LX3 for $600 and have buyers!! When you can get a new one (with equivalent accessories) from SLR R for $660....

    Who says Singaporeans are poor? no wonder our cost of living increase every year.
    oh is it? i want to sell mine too! hehehehe ok lah, $580!
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  20. #40

    Default Re: how do you calculate the resale value

    Quote Originally Posted by antacid View Post
    oh is it? i want to sell mine too! hehehehe ok lah, $580!
    then I buy from you and sell for $20 profit... Lol

    Put 600 lah, sure got ppl buy from you

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