View Poll Results: Is this a fair deal?

Voters
14. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes. It was a mutual trade between two parties.

    8 57.14%
  • No. It was misleading on the seller's part.

    6 42.86%
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 21 to 36 of 36

Thread: Tell me if this is fair.

  1. #21

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    Thanks for the well versed reply.

    I'll heed you to look at the facts again.

    Inspired is not a common understanding that it is a copy, atleast to me.

    Yes caveat emptor is practiced, but the seller should make reasonable effort to remind that the product is NOT by Gary Fong, and should use a picture of the actual item that is for sale, and not Gary Fong's picture to present his item, it will be misleading and cause misrepresentation.

    And the fact that I did not ask for any form of refund, petrol to his place is already $2, to meet at his void deck.

    Look,

    1) He posted this thread first, stating it is OEM and with (puffer) which is a trademark of Gary Fong
    2) I'm looking to clarify not to get refund.
    3) I gave him the benefit of doubt

    If the seller still remains to be hostile with his words, I'll then see what is deem suitable for this case.
    Last edited by kryptonik; 19th December 2009 at 02:50 PM.

  2. #22

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    dude - i learned the hard way too - by buying an "inspired" tiffany necklace for my gf on ebay! and guess what - i didn't get my money back and i havent spoken to her since giving it to her.

    my advice is try using it and see if you can tell the difference btw original and this product?

    if u dont like it, throw it away and it will cost you 3 plates of chicken rice.

  3. #23

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    Yea dude, I know, but sometime its a matter of principle to clarify that he is indeed misrepresenting, and I'm not asking for refund.

    I do not know the difference between the original and his non original one, so I can't tell which one is better.

    My point to bring across is that he misrepresent his product and still have the cheek to post the thread seeking redress, which is very funny, because I have absolutely no intention to get the refund.

    OEM, Puffer in title, Gary Fong's Puffer picture, what he sell is totally different from what the picture is.

    Who would sell something that is a few years old for the price that it is sold right now? Like what one of the member mentioned in this post, new ones are only $12, why would I buy a non original product 2nd hand used at the price of a new non original product?

    Clear cut case of misrepresentation.

    Seller : You are too impulsive.

    From TS : "If you are the former, let me tell you that most buyers won't even bother picking up their phones after the trade. and FYI, you are using WIKIPEDIA to quote the OEM - a source that cannot be relied on.

    I am also not sure myself whether this was a true gary fong product to begin with when i bought the product. The main point is - if it serves my purpose, then i'm cool with it."

    I think you mean seller in the first sentence, well, If most sellers won't pick up the phone, it means most sellers are very irresponsible person, thank you for being a responsible person to pick up my phone call, but the way you are resolving it, no words can describe.

    You are not sure it was a true gary fong product to begin with, then don't sell it as OEM Puffer, if it served your purpose, good for you, because right now I'm looking at an imitation OEM Puffer of gary fong.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Last edited by kryptonik; 19th December 2009 at 03:12 PM.

  4. #24
    Member Burnings's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Singapore, Singapore, Singapor
    Posts
    152

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    In industry term, OEM means it comes from the same factory. The specs should be exactly the same to be qualified. So use it carefully.

    "OEM pop up diffuser" = same product as Gary Fong, marketed under different brand
    "Pop up diffuser inspired by Gary Fong" = It is a remake of a product that copies the design of Gary Fong.

    Which in this case, it is stated as "OEM" and presumed to be exact as Gary Fong's. Besides, the picture is also from Gary Fong's orginal product and that reaffirms that it is indeed an OEM.

    Just my 2 cents.

  5. #25

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    To the buyer, you might wish to post a pic of what you have bought, since you made the statement "what he sell is totally different from what the picture is".

    At least, it will help us to determine whether it is in fact OEM or not.
    Tangfolio, 9mm; CZ75 Shadow, 9mm; S&W 686, .38

  6. #26
    Senior Member CS TAN's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Hong Kong
    Posts
    3,663

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    Quote Originally Posted by Burnings View Post
    In industry term, OEM means it comes from the same factory. The specs should be exactly the same to be qualified. So use it carefully.

    "OEM pop up diffuser" = same product as Gary Fong, marketed under different brand
    "Pop up diffuser inspired by Gary Fong" = It is a remake of a product that copies the design of Gary Fong.

    Which in this case, it is stated as "OEM" and presumed to be exact as Gary Fong's. Besides, the picture is also from Gary Fong's orginal product and that reaffirms that it is indeed an OEM.

    Just my 2 cents.
    You have hit the nail right on the head in this case.

    Normally, OEM products are exactly the same as the branded one. The different is just the brand name. Take a look at this thread:
    http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showt...hlight=samyang
    Inside there are pictures of 5 different lenses that are made by Samyang but they are being sold in 5 different brands. That, I would call it OEM lens.

    If OEM is the key word, then unless the seller knows that the non-garyfong puffer came from the same factory, he is misrepresenting the product. And from what I understand in this case, the product is different from the original so the word OEM should not have appeared in the WTS post.
    Canon 5D Mark II | 24-105L | 35L | 85L II | 135L | Samyang 14mm 2.8

  7. #27

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    ok now so the TS will closed the thread? ,,, christmas around the corner and 2010 in coming ... cheers to all
    to continue press hex key , to return to main menu press star

  8. #28
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Singapore, Bedok
    Posts
    1,129

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    1. If OEM means it should be of the same quality right..

    Or, even it is made by an entirely different company (imitation product), if the quality (same or comparable material used) is the same or very similar, then at least it is not so bad. As an example, IMHO, 3rd party len hoods is definitely not considered as "comparable quality" to original canon hoods. Not sure how the quality of the puffer compares. I had the pirated version, and it definitely feels cheap.. but at $10 for 3 colours and new, there's nothing to complaint about.

    2. The "pirated" version of the puffer, can be bought for $10, New, with 3 colours.

    At $12 for a 2nd hand item, it is reasonable for the buyer to have made the assumption(which turns out to be wrong) that it is original product. Of coz on close examination of the thread there is no mention of "original" product. But IMHO it is very easy for someone to have assumed it as original product if they are "not careful".

    IMHO, $12 for a used "pirated" (or what is the correct term?) puffer is highly overpriced. But this is totally subjective and YMMV.

  9. #29

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    Thanks all for the input.

    Exactly, this is not the ORIGINAL EQUIPMENT MANUFACTURER made, if it is totally same, and is a rejected good, it is still an OEM product by Gary Fong but in this case, it is not.
    OEM Puffer unless it is made from the same factory as Gary Fong.
    Thanks for the input guys, seems that newbie are still human in this forum. When we are talking about right and wrong, we don't talk about seniority.
    Dear seller, why so harsh and impulsive?

    Pictures as requested (romeo) :






  10. #30

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    Misleading is kind of a strong word to use here, but TS's post is certainly ambiguous at best.

    1. The combination of the words 'OEM' and 'Puffer' means something specific. When you use OEM (e.g. OEM Win XP, OEM MH-18a charger) you will know that you are getting the genuine thing, albeit under a different name. But saying 'OEM pop-up flash diffuser' raises an issue - are all the pop-up flash diffusers in the market made by the same manufacturer? It is just like saying you are selling an OEM fan, OEM TV. But when you included the name 'Puffer' that does point somewhat in the wrong direction.

    2. The line "inspired by Gary Fong" does not clarify things, because we don't know if Gary Fong designs all the products under his name, or his assistants designs part of the products based on his models but still brand it under his name. So this does not state whether it's a Puffer or generic pop-up flash diffuser either.

    3. Picture used was Gary Fong's Puffer, and not the real product which looks slightly different. Misleading.

    4. I believe "reviews on the net" applies to the Puffer, and not the generic pop-up flash diffuser, unless both are of the same quality, which Cartman2000 pointed out otherwise.

    5. But then TS mentioned that he was not sure of the product to begin with. How can a seller who is not familiar with what he is selling not be ambiguous on his part?

    6. In defense of the TS, he didn't put the title as "Original Gary Fong's pop-up flash diffuser" or the like, which I usually see in B&S when Gary Fong's product is being sold -> this may be the deciding factor for some that it is not a Gary Fong original, but then again it may not - people do use different wording for the same thing.

    7. As to the argument that "oh you can see from the price that it is not a Gary Fong product", that is shaky at best. You see, I buy textbooks from Amazon quite often, and a lot of times I can get a new one which is 40% cheaper than the price I pay in bookstores. Yet those books are perfectly legit.

    Thus, with no offense to TS (I believe you didn't have ill intentions), I conclude that it is ambiguous. Some part implies a generic diffuser, other part a Gary Fong's. Reading the post (without placing too much weight on 6), one would be rather confused as to whether it is Gary Fong's or just a generic, but without going straight into the conclusion that it is Gary Fong's.

    Phew...

  11. #31
    Member iMac08's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Tiong Bahru,Singapore
    Posts
    1,122

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    Another classic example of ambiguous situation to self justify own action. Is right or wrong these days so hard to differentiate? Fake means fake,real means real. If there's a prob better inform before selling,after that everything is just excuses. I am quite impress with how some of u guys can playwith words,pity u guys not lawyers...

  12. #32

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    Quote Originally Posted by kryptonik View Post
    I wouldn't sell a watch in a way like

    Title : OEM Watch with Chronograph Function (Daytona)

    Content from thread:
    Advertisement Category: Want To Sell (WTS)

    Equipment Type: Others
    Equipment Brand: OEM
    Equipment Model: Daytona
    Price (S$): 5,000
    Description:

    Selling the Daytona Watch, Inspired by Rolex

    based on ur wiki's defination,
    ur fake ad is misleading,
    where the seller of the OEM 'puffer' is simply wrong to assume his product is OEM

    rolex don't buy their watch from someome else n re brand it,
    which is common in other manufacturers.
    for instance my dell printer is a lexmark renamed.

    doubt GF has a plant to produce his staff,
    for all u know,
    urs might just be an OEM item.

  13. #33

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    Quote Originally Posted by kryptonik View Post
    Thanks all for the input.

    Exactly, this is not the ORIGINAL EQUIPMENT MANUFACTURER made, if it is totally same, and is a rejected good, it is still an OEM product by Gary Fong but in this case, it is not.
    OEM Puffer unless it is made from the same factory as Gary Fong.
    Thanks for the input guys, seems that newbie are still human in this forum. When we are talking about right and wrong, we don't talk about seniority.
    Dear seller, why so harsh and impulsive?

    Pictures as requested (romeo) :





    pretty similar to my 'original' GF,
    bro, how is the end results?
    any colour shift (too blue or yellow)?

    what i really want u to do is
    ignore this thread n just go n enjoy ur cam bro.

  14. #34
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Singapore, Bedok
    Posts
    1,129

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    My pirated puffer tends to have a warm cast..

    Quite disappointed with it that I rarely use it. Not sure how is the performance of the original like..

  15. #35

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    Quote Originally Posted by kryptonik View Post
    Thanks all for the input.

    Pictures as requested (romeo) :

    Hi TS,

    There are 2 areas that are not quite the same :

    a) The "hook", while the original one is quite squarelish, the "OEM" is roundlish
    b) the side of the filter is different

    That's all I can conclude. A picture is worth a thousand words.
    Tangfolio, 9mm; CZ75 Shadow, 9mm; S&W 686, .38

  16. #36

    Default Re: Tell me if this is fair.

    to buyer : I don't understand why you kept mentioning that I was harsh and impulsive. In the first place, you called me with a very negative tone [ I was about to reply your message and you called me in a matter of seconds.. ] and naturally I was already turned off by that. I did not expect things to turn out like this because as what other forumers say - this product is really just plain plastic, no rocket science involved, and does not burn your pocket hole.. so I did not expect any "form of complaint" or whatsoever.

    In any case, I can only admit that I was ambigious with my definition of OEM - I'm used to linking it with a generic product - this is especially common for people selling computer hardware imo.
    However I must say that the phrase, "design inspired by Gary Fong" was enough to prove that it is a knock-off. In the world of marketing, nobody goes around saying "hey, this is a fake, buy my product!".I believe there is more ambiguity in most marketing tactics than mine. but anyway.. I wasn't sure whether it was a real product to begin with, which was why I stated it as a "generic" diffuser. I did not risk it by stating its a genuine Gary Fong diffuser.

    buyer : driving a camry and wearing a rolex means nothing to me. What matters most is you wear what you own. I'm not driving at anything(no pun intended), but I can't stand people who drive big cars and claim its theirs, when it's their dear daddy's hard-earned money. Ultimately, if those are all yours, I'm sure $27 will look like 27cents to you - you should have just bought straight from garyfong instead?

    To some other replies that I briefly read through : I actually bought it for around $20 last time on ebay. only used for a few times and as you can see from the pictures that he posted, it's as good as new. That was the reason i sold @ $12. Reasonable enough imo.

    Alright, enough explanation. Since you're not looking for a refund and I'm tired of replying and wasting everyone's time, I will close this thread - it will still be here for everyone to see if anyone is interested.

    Thanks.

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •