Recomem me Len for D70

[Watcher]

I sympathize with Beachboy, given his limited budget. Yes, we all want (or wish) to have pro lenses.

However, each of us have different $ in the bank and different financial constrains. Given that Beachboy is just starting out, he may not appreciate the pro lenses or even need it.

My advice:
- D70
- SB600
- AF-S 24-85 (first hand $580, second hand around S$400-450, espn-> Watcher. Look at the list price lah)
or
- AF-S VR 24-120 (first hand around $970, second hand $750)

I would recommend the second lens even though I own the first one. I was using the AF-S 24-85 for quite a few shoots like my Cheong Sam shoot. Some examples:

http://202.42.122.15/images/cheongsa...151126-web.jpg
http://202.42.122.15/images/cheongsa...152150-web.jpg
http://202.42.122.15/images/cheongsa...163742-web.jpg

I am still using this lens when I need the short zoom or for office events. If you find the 24-120 too steep, the 24-85 can cater to your needs for the first 6-9 months till you save enough $$$

[sykestang]

Originally Posted by espn You can get the Nikkor 70-300mm stack a TC to get 600 and still get your shot, but the image & sharpness will be all due to your heart's contentment, if you can get past it, that's all that matters

EPSN, I might want to correct you on this issue... the 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6D Lens might not be able to focus with a 2x TC that will yield you 600mm... the f-stop will be f/11!!! I believe even the D2H might have a problem to focus at f/11.

Originally Posted by espn For the kit lense, I wouln't term it kit lense, as my dictionary for kit lens means low end lenses for very very basic usages, I believe the 18-70 is more then just kit lense. If you're on a budget strain, the AF-S 24-85 and the AF-S 24-120VR are two ideal lens to own. The AF-S 24-85 can be had for $600 2nd hand.

Yes, agreed. The 18-70 is not a kit lens, but a new Nikon DX lens. Please do not mixed it up with the cheapo 300D kit and its kit lens. Note that this baby even have ED elements in it. This lens is abt $500+ when it launches, unlike the Canon's cheap kit lens that comes with the 300D, can only fetch $100 at brand new.

Originally Posted by espn I'm not pushing you to buy expensive lens, but just trying to tell you that contentment on image and sharpness begins within your own mind & heart

Agreed. Different people have different perceptions on image quality. I believe some of you can remember that we ever read funny posts in CS like the recent one on Portrait Shooting, a fellow CS member stress on always using a small aperture in taking portraits, just for the reasons of not to waste the background details. Obviously the nice 'bokeh' is not to be consider in such context. Thus for this user, I believe his perception on image quality is any lens with a f/8 and above, is a good lens, why spend extra $$$ on f/2.8 lenses?

Sorry SmallAperture for being straight in this issue...

[espn]

Pai seh... keep thinking AF-S 24-85 is $600 2nd hand, sorry ah, somemore I just told jOhO to get 2nd hand one at $450. LOL. Sorry.

Small aperture good. Use f/22 best. Or use f/64, f/128!

[sykestang]

Originally Posted by Watcher I sympathize with Beachboy, given his limited budget. Yes, we all want (or wish) to have pro lenses. However, each of us have different $ in the bank and different financial constrains. Given that Beachboy is just starting out, he may not appreciate the pro lenses or even need it. My advice: - D70 - SB600 - AF-S 24-85 (first hand $580, second hand around S$400-450, espn-> Watcher. Look at the list price lah) or - AF-S VR 24-120 (first hand around $970, second hand $750) I would recommend the second lens even though I own the first one. I was using the AF-S 24-85 for quite a few shoots like my Cheong Sam shoot. Some examples: http://202.42.122.15/images/cheongsa...151126-web.jpg http://202.42.122.15/images/cheongsa...152150-web.jpg http://202.42.122.15/images/cheongsa...163742-web.jpg I am still using this lens when I need the short zoom or for office events. If you find the 24-120 too steep, the 24-85 can cater to your needs for the first 6-9 months till you save enough $$$

Agreed stronger with what Watcher said above... There is no cheap and good lenses around. Basically what options is opened for you is:

1. Get a camera + mid-range lenses, then save up to go Pro....
Advantages - you'll get to play with a lot of lenses and really see that your pictures will improve with every upgrade.

Disadvantages - you'll tends to lose more $$$ with the buy and sell with every upgrade.

2. Get a camera + 1 or 2 Pro Lenses.
Advantages - you'll get good images quality produced by the good optics that the Pro lenses offer you. In the long run you actually save.

Disadvantages - High initial investiment cost.

3. Get a camera + 50mm f/1.8 lenses, then decided properly what you actually wants before buying Pro lenses. My advise, get 2nd hand Pro lenses

Advantages - Steady your shooting skills and get used with the camera first with the Std Lens. For info, the AF50 f1/8 lens produces comparable Pro quality images with the Pro lenses at 50mm focal length. You will actually save a lot of $$$ in the long run

Disadvantage - Slow in the upgrade process... many often you'll envy other photographers that shoot together with you. Normally feel being stuck with the 50mm...


What we can do here is only to guide based on our personally experience with Photography. I believe most of us feels the same when we first start out, unless you have a budget of $5000+ to spare or a rich daddy to sponsor our purchase.

Always remembers on rule in mind, ie, Equipment is only to help us get the job done. It is our own personal skills that produces good pictures, not the equipment. Many award shoots were taken using simple point and shoot cameras, as most of the time, we would not have our heavy gear with us. Also in most competition, judges look on composition and storyline not what camera or lenses you're using.

For equipment purchase, the rule in mind is, 'A camera is a tool to take pictures, it tends to be replaced with better models and upgrades in a short period of time, there is no a single camera that can last a life time'

But lenses is different, 'it is an investment of many generation of camera upgrades' well kept lenses can last thru many generations, thus choose them wisely.


Maybe you can start out by letting us know what sort of budget you have in mind to start with, your specification and expectation on image quality, your kind of photography that you will project yourself to be shooting with your new camera, etc. It will definitely helps us to recommend you an ideal package that falls within your budget.

[sykestang]

Originally Posted by espn Pai seh... keep thinking AF-S 24-85 is $600 2nd hand, sorry ah, somemore I just told jOhO to get 2nd hand one at $450. LOL. Sorry. Small aperture good. Use f/22 best. Or use f/64, f/128!

Make sure I see you using f/22 in your next Astin shoot

[Beachboy]

Thank you guy here for give me so many advice.. REALLY THANK YOU ALL

after read so many reply from your guy i have decided my mind.

as for my budget to invest in the camera is about $3800 total, that is max what i can invest at one time, probaly i will invenst again in 6-12 month (D70 camera and one zoom lens).

my mins set is rather to pay abit more to get the good equipment but it has to depend on my buget.

i wan the camera which can take Portraits and bird (lens which can zoom because i always travel so i need lens which zoom to the object directly).which is the basic normal photography will do

what sykestang said is true (lenses is different, 'it is an investment of many generation of camera upgrades' well kept lenses can last thru many generations, thus choose them wisely). is there any website can talk more about Nikon lens ? because i am realy new in this photography so i prefered those website with the picture is the best. by the way i still not really understand the meaning of f/2.8 f/3.5 and so on.....

there is a big question in my mind is how much actually will the price of the D70 cost. the body only and the kit.

Izit the kit lens its really that good ? if not i probaly will just buy the body(might be cheaper) then i can spend more on my lens.
so i probally will choose this
D70 $1900
AF 80-200f/2.8 $1580 are you reffe to this lens
this
AF50 f/1.8D $180 (but can this lens take the normal picture ?Portraits & group photo)
so total will be $3660
is this good enought ?

my second option is
D70 kit $2300
AF 80-200f/2.8 $1580 are you reffe to this lens
total is $3880

is there any other option for me ?

i really cant invert the lens which over than $1.5k

Thank you all guy here in advance !!!!!!!!

[Watcher]

'Chia' Sykes coffee at Spinelli and he will talk your ears off We can even make you very gian for the lenses

The rest of the questions can be answered easier offline...

[espn]

So, when are we meeting at spinelli's with our gears and helping BeachBoy make a decision?

BeachBoy, do not forget to factor in items like CF card ($450), extra batteries ($80) and an external flash ($650). The D70 shouldn't come packed with any CF card as it's literally useless to pack a 32MB or even 64MB.

For what I see, the first combination is good. Regarding your question for 50mm for group photos & portraits, yes. It's a very ideal lens to start your shooting hobby with.

A quick guide on the f stop thingie, f/x.x refers to the aperture that the lens can shoot maximum at. For the AF-S 24-120VR f/3.5-5.6 means at 24mm, the aperture max is f/3.5, at 120 it's f/5.6. You can go smaller aperture like f/6.3 f/8 etc, but the max is as stated on the lens. The larger the aperture the more light falls through.

It would be wise to consider the 50 f/1.8 as a professional lens for at the price $160, you get an aperture of f/1.8. Thus you can see why the AF-D 80-200 f/2.8 is to expensive, due to the lens ED elements & also throughout 80mm to 200mm the aperture max is f/2.8.

Hope it helps.

[Beachboy]

Originally Posted by espn So, when are we meeting at spinelli's with our gears and helping BeachBoy make a decision? BeachBoy, do not forget to factor in items like CF card ($450), extra batteries ($80) and an external flash ($650). The D70 shouldn't come packed with any CF card as it's literally useless to pack a 32MB or even 64MB. For what I see, the first combination is good. Regarding your question for 50mm for group photos & portraits, yes. It's a very ideal lens to start your shooting hobby with. A quick guide on the f stop thingie, f/x.x refers to the aperture that the lens can shoot maximum at. For the AF-S 24-120VR f/3.5-5.6 means at 24mm, the aperture max is f/3.5, at 120 it's f/5.6. You can go smaller aperture like f/6.3 f/8 etc, but the max is as stated on the lens. The larger the aperture the more light falls through. It would be wise to consider the 50 f/1.8 as a professional lens for at the price $160, you get an aperture of f/1.8. Thus you can see why the AF-D 80-200 f/2.8 is to expensive, due to the lens ED elements & also throughout 80mm to 200mm the aperture max is f/2.8. Hope it helps.

thanks for the info, iss there any good website for lens ?
as for the CF i probally will use my 128mb first (duno enought for the monent because i plan to upgrade to 512mb$ard $200 for twinmost. as for $450 which of CF card are you refering to ?)

for other stuff maybe later on stage i will upgrade.

[espn]

Originally Posted by Beachboy thanks for the info, iss there any good website for lens ? as for the CF i probally will use my 128mb first (duno enought for the monent because i plan to upgrade to 512mb$ard $200 for twinmost. as for $450 which of CF card are you refering to ?) for other stuff maybe later on stage i will upgrade.

Can try www.kenrockwell.com www.bythom.com for lens review, but please take them with a pinch of salt

Regarding CF, a JPEG large will take 2.6MB of space. You do the math 512MB should be just sufficient.

$450 I was referring to the Lexar 40X 1GB CF. It comes with Write Acceleration for Nikon DSLRs.

[Beachboy]

Originally Posted by espn So, when are we meeting at spinelli's with our gears and helping BeachBoy make a decision? BeachBoy, do not forget to factor in items like CF card ($450), extra batteries ($80) and an external flash ($650). The D70 shouldn't come packed with any CF card as it's literally useless to pack a 32MB or even 64MB. For what I see, the first combination is good. Regarding your question for 50mm for group photos & portraits, yes. It's a very ideal lens to start your shooting hobby with. A quick guide on the f stop thingie, f/x.x refers to the aperture that the lens can shoot maximum at. For the AF-S 24-120VR f/3.5-5.6 means at 24mm, the aperture max is f/3.5, at 120 it's f/5.6. You can go smaller aperture like f/6.3 f/8 etc, but the max is as stated on the lens. The larger the aperture the more light falls through. It would be wise to consider the 50 f/1.8 as a professional lens for at the price $160, you get an aperture of f/1.8. Thus you can see why the AF-D 80-200 f/2.8 is to expensive, due to the lens ED elements & also throughout 80mm to 200mm the aperture max is f/2.8. Hope it helps.

last week missed out with you guy... so when is your guy meet so that i can join in .

my final decition is
D70 kit
80-200 lens equal to 120-300 (can this lens wirk with teleconvetor, if can probally i will buy it so that i can get more zoom in there future good for my bird shot)
but hear lots of review 80-200 lens is really big, i dun have a change to hold in my hand yet.

[burnaway]

How about using the CREATIVE NOMAD MUVO² (4GB) taking the card from the player and that only cost 400 for 4GB .Is it suitable for D70?

[weihui]

It's not CF as far as I know. It's Micro Drive.

Originally Posted by burnaway How about using the CREATIVE NOMAD MUVO² (4GB) taking the card from the player and that only cost 400 for 4GB .Is it suitable for D70?

[burnaway]

Yes it is mirco drive .How is it good?

[weihui]

Originally Posted by burnaway Yes it is mirco drive .How is it good?

Micro drive is generally slower than a 24x CF. Beside, you can get a 4GB microdrive in Sim Lim square anytime, why bother buying a Creative MuVo and extract the drive from it? You are paying a much higher price and throw away all the electronics...???

[burnaway]

ok thanks

[Beachboy]

Originally Posted by weihui Micro drive is generally slower than a 24x CF. Beside, you can get a 4GB microdrive in Sim Lim square anytime, why bother buying a Creative MuVo and extract the drive from it? You are paying a much higher price and throw away all the electronics...???

how much is the 4GB microdrive at SimLim and which shop are salling it ?
is this verion of microdrive is faster that creative Muvox ? and its faster


Thanks

[sykestang]

Originally Posted by Beachboy how much is the 4GB microdrive at SimLim and which shop are salling it ? is this verion of microdrive is faster that creative Muvox ? and its faster Thanks

errrr.... the use of microdrive is a subjective issue. I've currently a 4gb Microdrive plug out from a MuVo2 as a backup media when I shoot RAW. Here is my personal view on the Microdrive:
Advantages
- Cheap, $470 for the MuVo2 for a 4GB Media & a MP3 compared to the same price, you'll only ended up with a 1GB CF card. For info, I paid additional $48 to get a 128mb CF card to use on the MP3 player after plugging out the 4gb Microdrive.

Disadvantages
- It is slower in the following instance:
i. Start up, cos I believe the Microdrive Harddisk need time to spin up.
ii. When the cam went to power saving, abt 30sec not taking any shoot, the Microdrive will need abt 5-10 sec to spin up again when you wanted to take again.
iii. Buffering writing only abt 2-3 shots as compare to CF, I can shoot abt 6-7 shoots before the camera need time to write.

The above is tested using RAW mode of shoot, if you use JPGs it would perform better. Above all, it is till a very cheap solution to storage media for digital photography.

As for prices, I understand that Hitachi has run out of stock for the 4GB Microdrive. The last price for this 4gb Microdrive is around $600. Thus the creative MuVo2 is really a good investment.

Sorry BeachBoy, last week I am a little busy, maybe we can meet up on a Saturday afternoon. I can bring out my 80-200 lens to let you have a go with it. Yes you are rite, the 80-200 is a big and heavy lens, as for TC, I am also looking for a original Nikon TC that can work with this lens with all the AF function intact, however sadly to say, it seems that Nikon did not come out with any except to modify the current TC2Eii this is designed for the AFS Lenses. This I am quite reluctant to do, cos it involve some metal cutting and filing. However I was told that Kenko Pro TC can work with this lens except that it's built is not as good as the Nikon original TC.

Hope this info would be able to help you and any newbie out there to decide on what he/she actuall need.

Regards.

[Beachboy]

Originally Posted by sykestang errrr.... the use of microdrive is a subjective issue. I've currently a 4gb Microdrive plug out from a MuVo2 as a backup media when I shoot RAW. Here is my personal view on the Microdrive: Advantages - Cheap, $470 for the MuVo2 for a 4GB Media & a MP3 compared to the same price, you'll only ended up with a 1GB CF card. For info, I paid additional $48 to get a 128mb CF card to use on the MP3 player after plugging out the 4gb Microdrive. Disadvantages - It is slower in the following instance: i. Start up, cos I believe the Microdrive Harddisk need time to spin up. ii. When the cam went to power saving, abt 30sec not taking any shoot, the Microdrive will need abt 5-10 sec to spin up again when you wanted to take again. iii. Buffering writing only abt 2-3 shots as compare to CF, I can shoot abt 6-7 shoots before the camera need time to write. The above is tested using RAW mode of shoot, if you use JPGs it would perform better. Above all, it is till a very cheap solution to storage media for digital photography. As for prices, I understand that Hitachi has run out of stock for the 4GB Microdrive. The last price for this 4gb Microdrive is around $600. Thus the creative MuVo2 is really a good investment. Sorry BeachBoy, last week I am a little busy, maybe we can meet up on a Saturday afternoon. I can bring out my 80-200 lens to let you have a go with it. Yes you are rite, the 80-200 is a big and heavy lens, as for TC, I am also looking for a original Nikon TC that can work with this lens with all the AF function intact, however sadly to say, it seems that Nikon did not come out with any except to modify the current TC2Eii this is designed for the AFS Lenses. This I am quite reluctant to do, cos it involve some metal cutting and filing. However I was told that Kenko Pro TC can work with this lens except that it's built is not as good as the Nikon original TC. Hope this info would be able to help you and any newbie out there to decide on what he/she actuall need. Regards.

thanks sykestang for give the review of the creative muvo, maybe later i will go down to funan to purchase the Muvo2 so i can enjoy the MP3 player before i convert it to data storage for my D70
as for the meetup maybe i will go down to peninsular weekday because i cant make it at saturday(noneed to bring your camera if it really troble you) we can go for a cup of tea then can get to know you guy at there.
just sms me if you happend to go down to peninsular this weekday by the way i already pre oder my D70 (thank Watcher for advise me ) hopefully can get my camera next week

[sykestang]

Originally Posted by Beachboy thanks sykestang for give the review of the creative muvo, maybe later i will go down to funan to purchase the Muvo2 so i can enjoy the MP3 player before i convert it to data storage for my D70 as for the meetup maybe i will go down to peninsular weekday because i cant make it at saturday(noneed to bring your camera if it really troble you) we can go for a cup of tea then can get to know you guy at there. just sms me if you happend to go down to peninsular this weekday by the way i already pre oder my D70 (thank Watcher for advise me ) hopefully can get my camera next week

Where did you order your D70... if it is CP, let us know, cos most of CP staff know us, thus may be able to help you get a slight discount, especially if you are getting a lens with it also.