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Thread: The Laments of a Photog

  1. #1

    Default The Laments of a Photog

    Years to learn the craft... spend the early mornings and late evenings looking for right light to photograph and perfect your skills... You are confident of your skills after a few years of starting to learn the Craft,,,

    By then you have spent a fortune on your equipment and you are carrying practically anywhere above 5 to 8K worth of equipment on you any time...

    Along comes a "Gentleman" and offers a job and he says "Can do for free?"




    When will these "Gentlemen" learn that skill always comes at cost ?

  2. #2

    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Why not make equivalent request (in terms of value) to him as well? Most probably he'll feel it too.
    P e r s p e c t i v e

  3. #3

    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    By then you have spent a fortune on your equipment and you are carrying practically anywhere above 5 to 8K worth of equipment on you any time...
    i don't think anybody cares about this.

  4. #4

    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    One of these days, I think I will do it... Ask the "Gentlemen" to "Sell their product to us for free"... how about that...

  5. #5
    Moderator chngpe01's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    i don't think anybody cares about this.
    Yes it is true.

    Will my client cares, if I tell them that I am paying a monthly rental of $3k for my studio and equipment worth more than $100k?

    All they care is that you do a good job within the budget that they are willing to pay.

    For those (clients) who do not wish to pay or not willing to pay for what is worth then just don't take the job. That's the reality and a fact one has to face when going full time.

    Getting offers to do a job for low or no budget is common, same with knowing that there are ppl doing it for free or even pittance. That's the reality here no point harping over it, just concentrate on how to do it better and get more and better paying jobs/assignments.

    If not then find a stable monthly salaried job and be a part time photog to earn spare $.
    Last edited by chngpe01; 21st November 2009 at 11:05 PM.

  6. #6

    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Quote Originally Posted by chngpe01 View Post

    All they care is that you do a good job within the budget that they are willing to pay.

    For those (clients) who do not wish to pay or not willing to pay for what is worth then just don't take the job. That's the reality and a fact one has to face when going full time.
    precisely, if i am a client looking for small images.. i won't really care whether a good quality lens was used.. because IQ will not be required to be top end, etc.

    in any service industry, there are free loaders. it's just that photography is one where the line blurs too often between a part-timer who is doing it as an afterthought, and a full-timer who does it for a living.

    after all, you can always say "no".

  7. #7
    Moderator chngpe01's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    precisely, if i am a client looking for small images.. i won't really care whether a good quality lens was used.. because IQ will not be required to be top end, etc.

    in any service industry, there are free loaders. it's just that photography is one where the line blurs too often between a part-timer who is doing it as an afterthought, and a full-timer who does it for a living.

    after all, you can always say "no".
    Yes, learning to say "no" to cheap assignment is not difficult, after a while.

    Do not be mislead by ppl who will often promise more assignment and recommendation if you do it, not only cheap(if possible free) and good. Cos it will never happen.

  8. #8

  9. #9

    Angry Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Quote Originally Posted by soeypixels View Post
    This is a typical conversation that I would love to have with those 'Gentlemen' out there....

  10. #10

    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Quote Originally Posted by photograpix75 View Post
    Years to learn the craft... spend the early mornings and late evenings looking for right light to photograph and perfect your skills... You are confident of your skills after a few years of starting to learn the Craft,,,

    By then you have spent a fortune on your equipment and you are carrying practically anywhere above 5 to 8K worth of equipment on you any time...

    Along comes a "Gentleman" and offers a job and he says "Can do for free?"




    When will these "Gentlemen" learn that skill always comes at cost ?


    Put it crudely, consumer camera brands such as Canon, Nikon and Sony have made modern day cameras so easy, people actually think photography is easy. You walk down the streets these days, and you will see teenagers in their 15s with a DSLR around their neck. If the operation of a DSLR was as complicated as cameras of the past, the appeal wouldn't even be there. Let's face it, people love to do things that appear easy.

    As of today, the ones who truly wish to stay in the market must do beyond what any dslr-tottling hobbyist can do. If whatever you are doing can be found on a youtube video, it's either you move out of this industry or find new ways to re-invent yourself as a thinking photographer. Typical standard portrait/product shots are no longer portfolio-worthy material due to this sudden movement. Any photographer that wants to be remain as a professional should know this.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Quote Originally Posted by chngpe01 View Post
    Yes, learning to say "no" to cheap assignment is not difficult, after a while.

    Do not be mislead by ppl who will often promise more assignment and recommendation if you do it, not only cheap(if possible free) and good. Cos it will never happen.
    So damn true!

    As I keep on telling people, I won't even get out of bed for less than 1K a day. Pay peanuts and you get a monkey, pay good money and you get good work, it's very simple.

    The bottom feeders and those who employ them if it's on a commercial basis learn soon enough that the low cost option usually ends up costing them a lot more in the long run.
    The Ang Moh from Hell
    Professional Photography - many are called, few are chosen!

  12. #12
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    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Quote Originally Posted by photograpix75 View Post
    Years to learn the craft... spend the early mornings and late evenings looking for right light to photograph and perfect your skills... You are confident of your skills after a few years of starting to learn the Craft,,,

    By then you have spent a fortune on your equipment and you are carrying practically anywhere above 5 to 8K worth of equipment on you any time...

    Along comes a "Gentleman" and offers a job and he says "Can do for free?"




    When will these "Gentlemen" learn that skill always comes at cost ?
    Hate to say this but 5-8K buys you one professional level camera body or a couple of smaller lenses or part of the cost of a super-tele, or a good set of sticks and ballhead or a couple of good studio flash units (or a controller).

    As chngpe said elsewhere in this post, he's got over 100K in studio gear.

    I daren't even add up my total cost, but it won't be far off 1 million in gear or a bit over, and that's Aussie dollars (1.3 million SGD). The amount of gear you have doesn't reflect ability though. This morning I'm off to shoot for fun and will take around 50K's worth of gear, 2 lenses and 2 bodies, half a dozen CF cards. It's all to aid a local cricket club whom I'm a patron of. They do get my services for free, for 3 matches a year, but ONLY if it doesn't conflict with my paying clients and their work.
    The Ang Moh from Hell
    Professional Photography - many are called, few are chosen!

  13. #13

    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    I'm a photography major and have already gone past the 15K mark. Obviously, what I own barely scratches the surface. I have other friends (students) who are willing to take a lower pay simply because it pays. Some of them are producing fairly decent work. It's understandable for their situation. At the end of the day, you can't control what others want to charge. Neither can you control the freeloaders.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Kit's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Quote Originally Posted by photograpix75 View Post
    Years to learn the craft... spend the early mornings and late evenings looking for right light to photograph and perfect your skills... You are confident of your skills after a few years of starting to learn the Craft,,,

    By then you have spent a fortune on your equipment and you are carrying practically anywhere above 5 to 8K worth of equipment on you any time...

    Along comes a "Gentleman" and offers a job and he says "Can do for free?"




    When will these "Gentlemen" learn that skill always comes at cost ?
    It's time to learn the craft of running a business.

  15. #15

    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Quote Originally Posted by havocidal View Post
    At the end of the day, you can't control what others want to charge. Neither can you control the freeloaders.
    That may be true. But it would be useful to raise the awareness of those around us who need to resort to that:

    "Going lower than the bottomline would mean the new bottomline would be even lower tomorrow"

    This 'solution' is killing the industry slowly but surely, especially so from the bottom end.

  16. #16
    Deregistered rgy1993's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    TS, can i suggest you look at this rather insightful thread here.

  17. #17

    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    as much as we want to lament, sometimes we also have to think whether we are giving people their money's worth.

    that is a responsibility, i feel - if you have any form of work pride, that's something to think about.

    so as much as you want to complain about freeloaders, i think most people who hire photographers would not have invalid reasons for doing so if they say that the quality and standard of work of some freelancers is not up to par. so sometimes, the chinese saying 自己照镜子先 (please look in the mirror first) applies.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    5 K, 8 K or whatever... you know a pro when you see one shoot. Up to today, i am still very impressed with Chngpe01's work!

    That 100 K that he mentioned is nothing. Its his experience that is priceless.
    Don't brag about your accomplishments; Show us your future works.

  19. #19
    Moderator chngpe01's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Quote Originally Posted by JacePhoto View Post
    5 K, 8 K or whatever... you know a pro when you see one shoot. Up to today, i am still very impressed with Chngpe01's work!

    That 100 K that he mentioned is nothing. Its his experience that is priceless.
    Thanks for your compliments.


    Actually the $100k is just a figure to illustrate the point that "the clients do not cares how much one spend on their equipment or inventory except that the photog deliver the quality and within the budget."

    Not to point out that I have a $100k worth of equipment - I do not have that much what I have are peanuts.

  20. #20

    Default Re: The Laments of a Photog

    Quote Originally Posted by chngpe01 View Post
    Thanks for your compliments.


    Actually the $100k is just a figure to illustrate the point that "the clients do not cares how much one spend on their equipment or inventory except that the photog deliver the quality and within the budget."

    Not to point out that I have a $100k worth of equipment - I do not have that much what I have are peanuts.
    oh comon,

    i am not a pro photog and all my gears already near 100k, including studio lights+ 8 dri cabis.
    so i'm very sure your gears for a professional is much more than that.

    dont try to be humble.
    "guo du chien xu bian xu wei!"

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