Isn't there a lightweight rangefinder?

[StreetShooter]

Been trying out a few rangefinders as and when the opportunity came up.

I've noticed that they're mostly pretty heavyweight cameras. I thought that one of the advantages of rangefinders are that they're easy to carry around, but besides being compact, weight should also be kept low.

Maybe I'm spoilt by my Olympus mju (135g), but even my alternative "small" system (EOS300 + 28mm f2.8 lens) is only about 500g. Most rangefinders start weighing in about 700g onwards (except maybe the Canonet, which is still > 600g).

Any suggestions for small and light rangefinders?

[Simon]

Originally Posted by StreetShooter Been trying out a few rangefinders as and when the opportunity came up. I've noticed that they're mostly pretty heavyweight cameras. I thought that one of the advantages of rangefinders are that they're easy to carry around, but besides being compact, weight should also be kept low. Maybe I'm spoilt by my Olympus mju (135g), but even my alternative "small" system (EOS300 + 28mm f2.8 lens) is only about 500g. Most rangefinders start weighing in about 700g onwards (except maybe the Canonet, which is still > 600g). Any suggestions for small and light rangefinders?

Rollei 35mm, Contax T2, Ricoh GR1v etc.

[Red Dawn]

Hi

well the Leicas are heavy simply cos they are made of pure metal. (mostly - my M6TTL has a plastic shutter knob, and the Leica purists were decrying it ) the only other rangefinders i've tried are the Canonet and the Bessa R2s - not sure if they are all metal but their weight feels right to me.

I guess there's no 2 ways around it - if u want quality construction its got to weigh a little more...

i know wat u mean about the EOS 300 + 28mm f2.8. I held my fren's Nikon f55 + standard zoom in my hands and was quite alarmed at how light it is... but remember that's all plastic............. the feel just isn't there. it know this sounds weird, but i actually found it hard to handhold steadily if it is too small and light.

ps: i have a M3 and a 50mm summicron for sale...interested?

[Red Dawn]

Originally Posted by Simon Rollei 35mm, Contax T2, Ricoh GR1v etc.

eh the GR1v is a compact camera leh, not a rangefinder.....

[Parchiao]

Why the need for vintage rangefinders whe we have far more reliable cameras like Contax T3 or Ricoh GR1v? Sure, they are cheap and they do not require any batteries save those for the light meters, but the maintenance is expensive, and a major CLA can come up to about SGD150 to SGD200. Add the cost of the old rangefinders (approx USD80 for one in reasonably good condition), and we are not far off the mark from a second hand Contax or Ricoh PnS.

To answer the question on weight, we have to compare apples with apples. Imagine your EOS300 + 28/f2.8 made with the same type of metal exterior and dense bakelite like plastics of the vintage rangefinder.

But if the comparision is made between a modern day rangefinders plus one lens with modern day compact SLRs plus one lens (regardless of materials used), I will choose the rangefinder setup over the SLR as there is a very high possibility that the image quality of the modern day rangefinder will exceed that of the modern day compact SLR. The weight advatage will kick in only when we consider more lenses.

[chgoh]

Originally Posted by Parchiao Why the need for vintage rangefinders whe we have far more reliable cameras like Contax T3 or Ricoh GR1v?

I guess the only reason I would choose vintage, let say a Canonet 17, over a modern PnS would be because of the 40/1.7 lens. I don't think that you could get a faster lens in any of the currently available PnS.

Of course, if we go to interchangeable lens rangefinder systems like the Leicas (M or LTM) and Bessa, then the whole ball game changes and one does have quite a fair number of combinations to choose from.

Maybe for a light weight system one could choose an old LTM body fitted with one of the ligther weight CV lenses. I think it should not go above 500 grams in all (could be wrong here though).

chgoh @ 8:36am on 25 Jan 2004

[rubric]

Streetshooter, there are lots to choose from! Check these out: http://www.cameraquest.com/com35s.htm
http://homepage.mac.com/mattdenton/p...gefinders.html
http://homepage1.nifty.com/fukucame/
http://www.erikfiss.com/foto/cams/

and if you've got dough to spare,
http://www.photozone.de/2Equipment/range.htm

[y0gi0h]

"Any suggestions for small and light rangefinders?"

Small & light RF, nothing quite comparable with a Leica IIIf, IM(not too)HO Solid built, superb tiny Elmar lens (same formula as Tessar lens), full manual control (not battery), and accurate RF focusing. Hope the link below works:

Immortal Leica IIIf

[ed9119]

my Contax G2 is 560g and a 35mm/2 Planar 150g for a total of 710g.

my EOS 33 (not even an EOS 3) is 575g while and equivalent focal length 35/2 is 210g for a total of 785g.

this aside, for me the issue is not just in weight savings but in the compactness of the system as well. Its value lies in its low profile and unobtrusive nature.

"But a MJU's/Ricoh's even smaller and lighter!" Yes you're right...it is. But at a price.

[y0gi0h]

If one were to include "electronic RF" as RF, then all P&S are RF?

OTOH, if RF means conventional RF as we know from science book (see Range Finder ), then:

Canonet is a RF ;
Contax T is a RF, but not T2 nor T3 nor G1, G2
Rollei 35 has a VF but no RF
...............

Anyway, not v impt lah

[whoelse]

Originally Posted by y0gi0h If one were to include "electronic RF" as RF, then all P&S are RF? OTOH, if RF means conventional RF as we know from science book (see Range Finder ), then: Canonet is a RF ; Contax T is a RF, but not T2 nor T3 nor G1, G2 Rollei 35 has a VF but no RF ............... Anyway, not v impt lah

Rangefinder is one that make use of a rangefinder screen that focus on the viewfinder hence make it more versatile. A P&S mainly only focus at fix distance to infinity mah. Better/most rangefinders has interchangeable lens too while P&S only has fix len. Any P&S has interchangeable lens?

[ed9119]

thanks for the link...

either through the simple method as explained by the link provided or through an electronic processor, the theory remains unchanged.....the use of trigonometry to determine distance.

[StreetShooter]

Got a GR1V. Amazing little camera.

[y0gi0h]

Originally Posted by ed9119 thanks for the link... either through the simple method as explained by the link provided or through an electronic processor, the theory remains unchanged.....the use of trigonometry to determine distance.

Agreed.

The problem with electronic RF is that there is no visual confirmation in the VF if the subject is indeed in focus. Take Contax G1 as an example, (which I used before), its electronic RF works fine for the wide and normal lenses but it's less accurate when I used the 90mm tele lens. I got OOF image when I saw the print (but already too late by the time!) I was told the G2 has a much improved RF but I am not sure abt that.

[kahheng]

Originally Posted by StreetShooter Been trying out a few rangefinders as and when the opportunity came up. I've noticed that they're mostly pretty heavyweight cameras. I thought that one of the advantages of rangefinders are that they're easy to carry around, but besides being compact, weight should also be kept low. -snipped- Any suggestions for small and light rangefinders?

How about a Leica IIIf? With one of those small pancake sized LTM 35/2,5 cosina made lenses, it would be quite compact and not as heavy as an M3 with a Summicron.

The thing about the M2/3/4/6 and the MP is the wonderful hair trigger quality of the shutter release. Everyone talks about the lenses, yeah, of course they're interesting, but it's the whole one-ness with the camera that I like about the M series, because of the shutter release speed.

FWIW: The interesting thing is that my old OM-1 Olympus SLR has that same "hair trigger" shutter release quality. Not as fast as an M Leica, but hell, compared with all the other MF SLRs (e.g., FM2, all the later OMs), it's on knife-edge all the time. With the 50/1,8 or the 21/3,5, it's an awfully small package for carrying around. Pity the horribly dim viewfinder of yesteryear though - you can rectify that with a screen replacement to some extent.

[Red Dawn]

Originally Posted by StreetShooter Got a GR1V. Amazing little camera.

Hi

congrats! that has one very sharp lens i hear!

[kingpin]

Originally Posted by StreetShooter Got a GR1V. Amazing little camera.

Ya have one too. It is a v good camera and is definitely a good camera for all travels. Its 28mm is a good angle and perspective.

[StreetShooter]

Originally Posted by y0gi0h Agreed. The problem with electronic RF is that there is no visual confirmation in the VF if the subject is indeed in focus. Take Contax G1 as an example, (which I used before), its electronic RF works fine for the wide and normal lenses but it's less accurate when I used the 90mm tele lens. I got OOF image when I saw the print (but already too late by the time!) I was told the G2 has a much improved RF but I am not sure abt that.

The GR1V uses trigonometrical RF. You have to look for vertical lines to focus on, a bit more trouble than the active AF of the usual P&S cams, but much more accurate. The viewfinder WILL indicate whether the intended subject is in focus or not.

Read more about it here:

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/the_leighs/

[Parchiao]

On top of the GR1v and the Contax T3, another more than worthwhile camera to mention is the GR21. A sharp 21mm f3.5 lens on a PnS body. Controls and looks are exactly the same as the GR1v except that the lens does not fully retract into the camera body. It has been about a year since I sold it, and I still regret doing so. When bonus time comes, or if i ever pay Hong Kong a visit again, I will definitely acquire it once more.

[samforce]

Hi,

Got this fantistic piece of a camera last month.

Just develope first roll of FP4 from first shoot, and found some pretty impressive sharp pictures.

Meter is not calibrated to the available 1.5LR44 battery so shoot without battery, using my light meter.

LIGHT??? yes
weighing in at 450g and small in dimension too.
Fully mechanical and quiet too.

See for yourself.
http://homepage.mac.com/mattdenton/p...icoh_500g.html