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Thread: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

  1. #101
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    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Quote Originally Posted by surrephoto View Post
    Film is an excellent medium for photography education if it is a supplement. I'm sure students will also appreciate the unique appearance of grain and beautiful colours that cannot be replicated on digital...

    You seem to support PnS cameras alot...
    Yes I do, because it seems like there are a lot of people who repeatedly say they can only learn using dslr. I learn composition with film PnS. I did not buy film DSLR because I do not want to burden my parents as a student. That film PnS just have ISO setting - everything else is preset! yet, I can still learn.
    Of course there is a limit of that learning with such equipment, but before more money is spent, it is better to use what is available (or cheap) before splurging.
    I am only using DSLR after I have enough money to buy mine. Then I splurge on lense & accessories.
    By the way I dont have hi-res eyes with 5.5degree myopia so I cannot really see the diff between film and digital photo. And largest print I have done is 8R (and I print like once a year only).

  2. #102

    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Quote Originally Posted by aryanto View Post
    Yes I do, because it seems like there are a lot of people who repeatedly say they can only learn using dslr. I learn composition with film PnS.
    i think the point is being missed on both sides actually.

    my point is clear; if there are no viable options, and your budget is limited, then buying a p&s with manual function (or semi-automatic functions like av/tv priority even) , still allows one to learn photography sufficiently well.

    if your budget is not, no one says that you HAVE to buy a p&s, you CAN buy a dslr, whether cheap or expensive, also dependent on your budget.

    there are many, many reasons not to get a dslr/slr if your budget is limited:

    1) maintenance issues: shutter breakdown, nonsealed nature means that dust cleaning is necessary, etc

    2) for old dslrs, fine and dandy, they can be used to learn no doubt.. but what of repairs? old film slrs lagi worse sometimes.. might not be even repairable when they just go koyak (especially the manual slrs which are less modern). i would not see it unreasonable for a person to want to get modern offering which will have theoretically a lot more technical support from the company in case of errors.

    3) i think it is fair to say that film slr looks cheap ($48 for body, maybe $50-$100 for cheap lenses).. but p&s with manual function with decent performance can get at same price second hand.. with minimal (mainly battery charging) marginal cost for taking each subsequent photo. every film shot you take translates to more money, each frame includes buying film and processing. not to mention scanning, if you want to photoshop or experiment with photoshop.

    so it isn't exactly a one-sided battle. there are arguments for both sides.

    naturally, everyone has their own preference.. just remember to consider both sides, make an informed decision, so that you know what you want, that's what i'm saying.

  3. #103

    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Hi all, sorry havent been able to reply you all one by one.
    Have been busy compiling all info and writing a draft proposal just in case.
    But just let all of you know that you have the deepest thanks from the whole of the photography club.
    I have tried to talk to teacher two days ago, but did not go well.
    Had a meeting with all members today and we decided to all try again.
    If it doesnt work we are going to try to talk to principal.

    Once again, thanks all for your support, suggestions, comments and encouragement

    Hopefully with all these support and most of all, encouragement, my cca will be able to convince the school to pour funds into photography!
    Inline Culture (:

  4. #104

    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Quote Originally Posted by monolime View Post
    1. Passion, without it nothing is possible
    Basically, I'm just repeating what others have said. Do you have passion for photography? Or do you have a passion to improve photography cca? What about the members? Do they have the passion? If there's insufficient equipment, what would someone with passion do? Suppose a not well to do student saves up to buy a camera, supose he skips his meals in order to get a camera, is that passion?

    Basically, you are at point A, you want to go to B. And without passion, it's impossible. And if everyone in a team has passion, it will make it easier to reach B. This is teamwork.

    2. Passion, with it you don't have to work a day in your life
    Supose a waiter, he has passion for his job. What happens? Basically, he's not working anymore. Why? Because it's not a job anymore. Go for outings, just shoot more, participate in fun activities as a team. Build bonds. Have fun. Enjoy photography. Don't worry too much about the lack of equipment or what equipment u have/ or have not.
    Far too many people become photographers because they love cameras and film and computers and all the gadgetry Ö but Ansel Adams didnít make stunning photographs of Yosemite because he loved cameras! He made stunning photographs of Yosemite because he loved Yosemite!
    -anonymous


    Conclusion
    Once u have passion, others will see/feel it. CCA will expand. Funding might be easier to get. Competitions might even be won. A year from now, say if the CCA expands, got new equipment, 10 D3Xs, spacious studio, darkroom, Leicas, whatever, you reached point B but the level of your passion is still the same as before. But without passion, what's the point?
    Quote Originally Posted by foxtwo View Post
    Can't you photograph the school compound at sunset/sunrise from an opposite HDB, print out a nice big photo, frame it and present it to the Principal? Just make sure it's a cheery inspirational photo, not dark and gloomy la. Which other CCA can give an advertisment 24/7. NPCC cadet guarding the door or potted plants from the Gardening Club maybe?

    Accept the fact the photography club is there to support other CCAs. Since you're not getting real support you should make the case that you all do good work and are indispensable to the school. Go through each CCA and shoot a good portfolio of images. Approach their teacher-in-charge, share the pics and get their support for you. If they can tell the Principal "Hey the Photography Club shot these great pictures!", "I want to use them on so-and-so event" Isn't that free advertisement also. When they put up the photographs in the website, ask the webmaster to credit the club. It's just 1 small line per page, I'm sure he won't mind.

    Experimenting with smoke and water drops are fine to attract the club members but they should know the current situation isn't to their advantage. Hiding away in the clubroom is not going to get the affirmation you need from the school board. Be seen and recognised! You guys have Tees now right, all the better no? As long as you all are active, not hiding somewhere doing your own things, people can see you're hardworkers. Have a plan, have a schedule. If you must, meet with your teacher-in-charge and Vice-Principal/Principal. Say this is the Club's direction, we have a schedule and these are the activities we're implementing. Stress you have no funding, but will make results nonetheless. Then next time lament, this is good but you'll be better with funding. They are like some parents lor, if you can give concrete reason for spending they will allow for it. Get serious with the adults and they're forced to take notice. Show who's in charge.

    The pictures do not have to be record shots. All CCAs have their equipment, uniforms, etc. The school itself has so many other goodies. The science labs, design & technology workshop? Play dress up or something, get the teachers involved. Learn composition and lighting that way. No flash, use continous light, use natural light. 50+ pple in the club someone can surely do something. So much manpower, use them first. If they don't want to do or play punk then kick them off the club. Have your core team send them out for mini-projects or something. Tell them you need lights to shoot the science lab but have no money for flash, go do research how to solve the problem. Solve time, location and resources. No camera to shoot does not mean no brain to imagine, or eye to see. If they prepare everything, maybe the incentive is they get to do the shoot, one of you to supervise. The result may be campy or unrealistic, it doesn't matter. That's the whole photographic process to me. Developing film or learning DoF is a very small part.

    Work triple hard first, when you get the funding and all, then enjoy the fruits of labour and shoot whatever you like. Cheers and good luck!
    *salute*

  5. #105

    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Good luck to sonyboy TS and repty,
    I believe even if you guys failed to convince the school,
    you guys have gained something that the others of your same age/generation doesn't!

    from the bottom of my heart

  6. #106
    Member sonyboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Quote Originally Posted by LomoPhotographer View Post
    Good luck to sonyboy TS and repty,
    I believe even if you guys failed to convince the school,
    you guys have gained something that the others of your same age/generation doesn't!

    from the bottom of my heart
    Thanks alot.

    We are planning to talk to our teacher once again.
    If not respond , we will talk to the principle.

    Once again , thanks all!
    SAMSUNG HMX- H100
    Videography :)

  7. #107

    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Hi all, just a update on our situation again....
    Talked to cca teacher TWICE, but both failed.
    It was pointed out that:
    -We are part of infocomm
    (Cannot spilt out, must have cross training on video and web etc. But never once hear the teacher mention that we will have cross training on photo...)
    -No more new eq
    (Funds used for "something else already")
    -A compromise is made
    (His compromise was that he allow us to have extra lessons......... Something we have been doing since January)

    So yeah, the talks FAILED.
    However, we didn't give up.
    We went to ask around for advice and will be going to talk to the cca HOD tomorrow if possible.
    If all talks fail, we will be booking an appointment with the vice principal.
    If anyone got any ideas/suggestions, feel free to post again.

    Thanks all. Kinda losing hope already.
    The teacher like totally don't approve anything we say, except got free training for us.
    (Who can resist free things?)
    Other than that... No progress, kind of demoralising.
    Inline Culture (:

  8. #108
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    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    lol. First thing you gotta do is show the higher-ups why it is profitable (be it through photos or being able to self fund after you get new gear) to purchase the new equipment. If that doesn't work, you gotta show that you guys are enthu about photography while the higher ups watch.

    One thing you can do is propose a photoshoot of sorts to help the school some way. Like you can do strobist style photoshoots of small groups of other CCAs and shoot in a way that it goes along with what the other CCAs do. You can go borrow / rent / (personally) buy the radio triggers and flashes for this. Ask a higher-up to sit in during one of the photoshoot sessions to watch you all in action, and show the teachers the photos thereafter.

    If they're impressed by your attitudes or photos, they might be willing to make the photog club independent, park some money into gear and training, and support you guys in other non-monetary ways.
    Our pictures are our footprints. Itís the best way to tell people we were here - JoeMcnally | Flickr

  9. #109
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    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    maybe teachers are afraid being stomped, thus they will resist any attempt to form this cca? LOL.

  10. #110
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    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    you must first do something to impress them
    only then will they sit up and listen to proposals

  11. #111
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    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Quote Originally Posted by ortega View Post
    you must first do something to impress them
    only then will they sit up and listen to proposals
    yes. i agree. I find that if you have nothing to stand on, no one will listen. You need to show potential before asking for support.

    I would suggest you to ask your teacher for things like seminars, workshops etc that are free, like http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=559588

    and i suggest looking at the Noise Singapore? Not so sure about how they work but you can give them an email and maybe ask for an instructor or smt?
    http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/showthread.php?t=561323
    Nikon.
    Nuff said.

  12. #112
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    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Hi there,

    Don't be disheartened. I used to chair my photography club too and we faced our own sets of problems. Look beyond the details of gear, membership, seniors, etc etc.

    See the big picture. For my team, we had 2 goals: 1) Service to school 2) Learning for personal development

    In service to school, we sent a photographer to each school event. Be it sports, arts or any cultural event we had "coverage". This was film era so we only had 2 film SLR with no-brand external flash. We captured a few rolls of each event, sent for developing, and then the week after we would paste all the photos on a huge noticeboard near the canteen. Needless to say, this board would be the center of attention whenever new photos are up, we being narcissistic as we are. So we expanded and allowed people to pen down orders for each picture for a nominal fee, and we got a small profit from this and used it to fund outings/new equipment or filters. Our photos were also used by the school magazine on a regular basis. In other words, market yourself to make yourself indispensable and value add*value add*value add*. Just because we're in a digital age doesn't mean a notice board full of event photos won't gather interest...

    Second, make sure you guys are learning. You will be surprised at the number of prominent local photographers who will come and give short lessons...for free. Many will be flattered by the invitation. Not good for me to list names online, but if you ask around i'm sure many helpful photographers would gladly offer their time as long as you ask. We had monthly field trips all over Singapore. No need to charter a bus. Public transport will do. And we shared 3-4 people to a film SLR. No arguments, in fact it helped with bonding. You don't need professional/paid lessons to become good. Practice, and creativity make a good photographer.

    think big!
    Cheers.

  13. #113

    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    at least you have a photography club.
    unlike my school.

    all the best.

  14. #114
    Moderator ortega's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Quote Originally Posted by allsmilez View Post
    Hi there,

    Don't be disheartened. I used to chair my photography club too and we faced our own sets of problems. Look beyond the details of gear, membership, seniors, etc etc.

    See the big picture. For my team, we had 2 goals: 1) Service to school 2) Learning for personal development

    In service to school, we sent a photographer to each school event. Be it sports, arts or any cultural event we had "coverage". This was film era so we only had 2 film SLR with no-brand external flash. We captured a few rolls of each event, sent for developing, and then the week after we would paste all the photos on a huge noticeboard near the canteen. Needless to say, this board would be the center of attention whenever new photos are up, we being narcissistic as we are. So we expanded and allowed people to pen down orders for each picture for a nominal fee, and we got a small profit from this and used it to fund outings/new equipment or filters. Our photos were also used by the school magazine on a regular basis. In other words, market yourself to make yourself indispensable and value add*value add*value add*. Just because we're in a digital age doesn't mean a notice board full of event photos won't gather interest...

    Second, make sure you guys are learning. You will be surprised at the number of prominent local photographers who will come and give short lessons...for free. Many will be flattered by the invitation. Not good for me to list names online, but if you ask around i'm sure many helpful photographers would gladly offer their time as long as you ask. We had monthly field trips all over Singapore. No need to charter a bus. Public transport will do. And we shared 3-4 people to a film SLR. No arguments, in fact it helped with bonding. You don't need professional/paid lessons to become good. Practice, and creativity make a good photographer.

    think big!
    Cheers.
    that is a good idea

    do something first, then let the school ask you for a favour (eg free pictures)
    then they will notice you and your cca, take it from there

  15. #115
    Member sonyboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Hello guys,

    Repty and other member talk to the principle.

    The teacher in charge also promised 2 nikon flash guns.

    Principle seems very supportive.

    Knowing that we are going to plan a out door photography trip , he even said expenses will be sponsored by the school

    Principle also suggesting making a wall for us to put our pictures
    A room with 2 high end computers for images editing.
    Equipment and even request us to make a school book featuring school life and so on.

    Short form , coffee book.


    Everything in club is getting better.

    We also want to thanks the new instructor from clubsnap , who offered to teach us with a single cent.

    Mr nicholas koh. Thanks!


    We will update you guys further! Keep track!

    Thanks!
    SAMSUNG HMX- H100
    Videography :)

  16. #116

    Default Re: Suggestions on how to improve photography cca

    Well, guess i should clear this up.
    Like what sonyboy has said.
    Everything is rolling now.
    Thanks for all the suggestions.
    It has been a great help.
    Together with the school, we have been able to reach a mid point.
    It is good. I reckon things weren't as bad as they actually seemed.
    So well, once again all, thanks for everything.
    You all have played a great role in this

    On a side note: Guys, if you guys like something out there but find it hard to achieve. I say go for it. There are many things i would like to say but am unable to. I am glad that i have not given up and gone all the way. Sometimes you lose some things to gain some.
    Inline Culture (:

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