View Poll Results: Are we being taken advantage off?

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  • Yes we are killing ourselves.

    242 34.82%
  • No, this will benefit the newbies.

    142 20.43%
  • I dunno.

    42 6.04%
  • Its all part of the game.

    269 38.71%
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Thread: Has ClubSNAP become a sourcing spot for cheap photographers. Are we being taken adv?

  1. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by zaren
    at least with a defective car u can get it replaced, but a bad photo (e.g. wedding photo) cannot be replaced, assuming it was a photo taken during the event. i suppose a bad studio shot can be re-done, but at great inconvenience.

    True but after spending a sum of money.... why should I have to spend again? But I guess it's the same for all professions as well.... u get some bad hats and some good ones...

  2. #242
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    And the flame continues........



  3. #243
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    Default Bottom Line

    In summary, if you feel that you deserves to be paid for a shoot...ask for it. No one is forcing anyone to take on the job. It's a free world where one is allowed to seek free services and if that service is given willingly, I find it very childish to go online and complain that you deserve to be paid. I equate this saga to a job interviewee....if a sum of money is offered to have your services and was accepted, why complain that you deserve more after you have signed along the dotted line?

    Bottom line is if you accept a non paying job with your eyes wide open, don't complain thereafter.

  4. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by chynakym
    In summary, if you feel that you deserves to be paid for a shoot...ask for it. No one is forcing anyone to take on the job. It's a free world where one is allowed to seek free services and if that service is given willingly, I find it very childish to go online and complain that you deserve to be paid. I equate this saga to a job interviewee....if a sum of money is offered to have your services and was accepted, why complain that you deserve more after you have signed along the dotted line?

    Bottom line is if you accept a non paying job with your eyes wide open, don't complain thereafter.

    Agree! It's an open market afterall. Too many regulations stifle competition and artificially inflate costs...

  5. #245

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    Quote Originally Posted by szekiat
    i'm not blaming the clients. Heck, as a company, if i can save i will. If there are a bunch of guys willing to do a 400dollar job for free and can deliver the same quality, i'd pick them too. I'm just wondering if the ppl taking up the jobs are killing the market, and themselves.
    "once you provide free/cheap service, its going to be difficult to start charging later. Look at the web and learn. Web sites have problem charging for services after " Esp to the same ppl whom u offered the last time.
    Totally agreed, some probably got much lower overhead and maintenance cost and they think they can survive in doing that, but honestly speaking this type of business usually just come and go, especically your customer is also hunting for cheaper rate, so dun even talk about loyalty.

  6. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by szekiat
    As above. I've come to notice that there are a lot of ads for free photogs recently, with the photographer getting the bare min. No pay, no copyrights etc. Are we being shortchaged around here? More importantly, are we spoiling the freelance market in sg? I remembered back when freelancers could command up to 100/hr, now u'd be lucky for 50. Is it because places like clubsnap have become a sourcing pool of free and GOOD photographers? Are we underpricing ourselves?
    The rule of thumb is that you cannot beat the market.

    As long as the overly expensive photographers cannot distinguish their work from the cheaper ones, the market will choose the latter.

    This happened in the web-publishing business as well.. as long as photography is getting more accessible to everyone, prices will fall and continue to do so.

  7. #247

    Thumbs up

    this is going to a record breaking thread...

    all service industry is the same...

  8. #248
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caspere
    this is going to a record breaking thread...

    all service industry is the same...
    OT: GO GO GO!

    OT2: Have we "killed" the UW thread?

  9. #249
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    Quote Originally Posted by AJ23
    OT: GO GO GO!

    OT2: Have we "killed" the UW thread?
    help you abit.

  10. #250
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obzervr
    a friend of mine had his wedding solemnised a couple of months back. the bride and groom engaged a Pro each. So on the solemnisation, there were 2 pros. Then, between them come friendly competition to capture the 'moment of acceptance' by the groom (the most important requirement by the couple). Unfortunately, both ended up without THE moment.

    what can be done? the scene cannot be reenacted. Fortunately, a friend of his offered free service to be a sideline photographer and guess what? he got the moment! He offered the neg over to the PROs to be included in the wedding binder but neither wish to take it up. He ended up offering nieghbourhood lab quality prints, FOC, just to see the couple smile. I think not all 'shoot for free' photogs are 'monkeys'. Without the pressure of undue expectations, competent newcomers may well achieve better results that will help their skills grow.

    just my opinion though.
    Maybe the couples' friend got in the way of the 2 pros & that's why they couldn't get THE shot??

  11. #251
    Senior Member Sion's Avatar
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    I think initially an amateur is prepared to take on a job on the cheap e.g. to build up his portfolio, to gain practical experience, to get a foot in the market etc etc. You have to start from somewhere.

    I wouldn't expect him to go on doing it once he has gained the confidence, the experience and a great portfolio. It's pay-back time. It's not being exploited. It's making use of the opportunity.

    When this crop of amateurs graduate to bigger and better things, there'll always be a stream of eager new comers to take their place.

    However if someone wants to pay $25 an hour to man a shopping mall Santa photo booth, ask what you can be gained by doing it. Wouldn't it be better spending the time shooting something else you are passionate about?

  12. #252

    Default Chicken, the Egg and the Hungry Fisherman...

    The realty is as the poll, "its all in the game."

    As price barriers break, there are bound to be a bunch of hungry men, be they rising talents, or mere hobbyists "inclined" to turn semi-pro to supplement (or even replace..) their current income.

    This trend is INEVITABLE, taking into reference the boom of the Computer Era back in the 70s-90s, where nearly everyone's set now a DIY (who buys a Packard Bell/Sherry?), though much less common the QUALITY (aka Apple, least superficially..) thats is another area, like digital photography skills AND digital blackroom manipulation, is improving ACROSS the board as time goes. chicken vs the egg, the "cheapness" cultivate "tryouts/wannabees" that again promote the "cheapness" on the next cycle...etc etc tell it to the Sim Lim salesman

    Do you know how much taxi drivers are paid in China to ferry someone 5-10km across town/CBD? 5-8yuan max equiv S$1-S$1.50 ("What ERP?...")

    Do you know how much does 24hr broadband cost in vietnam? S$20 a mth

    Do you know how much a complete breakfast set can cost in Bangkok? S$0.40-S$2.00 (by norm, the last is nearly a buffet that should hold you up thru lunch plus 2 toilet breaks)

    My belief is simple economic AND social sense...as my ex-boss once put it, "the HUNGRIER man WILL catch the fish first or either, he can do that when he is hungrier."

  13. #253
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    Quote Originally Posted by rueyloon
    there is a usual misconception about a photographer's working hours, you need to factor in post and pre shoot work.

    as as Jed mentioned, it is NOT about time (although it is part of the factor), the overall value is in the artistic quality the photographer is able to produce.
    Some job might seem easy on the surface, but lots of research and hard work with long hours are required behind the scene.
    One would only know how is it like when himself is involve in the trade.

    Therefore it is hard to justify how much a professional should get. If the client are willing to pay that much for how the pro is worth, then i dont see a problem with whether he is charging $1200 for 8 hours or $12,000 for 8 hours, as long as the client is happy. isnt it?

  14. #254
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    just adding to the count...

  15. #255
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    this thread is STILL ALIVE!!!

  16. #256
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    Goodness gracious, it's still around.... well, I'll just add to it then.....

  17. #257
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    Quote Originally Posted by SniperD
    just adding to the count...
    u got a PM

  18. #258
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    Just live with it. Everybody wants cheaper stuff including you and I. If we can get something cheaper then I guess we will take it...even at a risk of lower quality. Don't fight the market. A good example is web design. You can get good stuff for peanuts....so not everybody are monkeys.

  19. #259
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    Cheap is one thing but free? How many 'Come shoot our stuff & build up your 'portfolio' for free while we reserve the right to use your photos for no payment 'opportunities' have we seen?

  20. #260
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    yeah!! someone revived the thread

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