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Thread: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

  1. #21
    Senior Member Leong23's Avatar
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    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    I can only write my support here......but it is really quite hard to 清理门户......

    Photography is somehow becoming a tool to those GWC to use art as an excuse to fulfill their fantasy.

    For those who know me personally in CS, they will know why i never post my portrait works here...............there are simply too many sicko around.........

  2. #22
    Senior Member Pablo's Avatar
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    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    so, what can we do about clearing up??
    Hi,

    As you know, I am not living there and do not have the same problem with what I do.

    BUT

    I do understand what is happening and what this is all about. Thus my reason for making suggestions that I hope will assist in some way.

    So, to your question catchlites, I have this suggestion.

    Ask people such as NineEleven, DP, yourself, Goat ... etc to put together a list of ideas and ask the MODS and ADMIN to review them.

    I think also that those that do contribute to the list of suggestions given to the Mods/Admin also are prepared to spend some time assisting the outcome..

    It is OK to be pi55ed of about it, but if it is really an issue for you then you must be prepared to assist in the problem.

    Simply writing in a forum is not enough.

    .................................................. .................................................. ..................

    If I come across as being un-friendly with my words, please don't take it that way.

    I (when a boy) used to go on at my father about what I thought was wrong in the world and he would say, " don't tell me about it .... do something about it"

    Cheers
    Time, is an effortless construction :)

  3. #23

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    FYI, only registered members can view our Portraits and Poses forum.

    and so far nobody complaint about this, and I think many members also support about this.
    wa, i didn't know

    thanks for mentioning this, it makes the case of turning services offered/wanted section even stronger , since the infrastructure for doing so is already in place.

  4. #24

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by Leong23 View Post
    Photography is somehow becoming a tool to those GWC to use art as an excuse to fulfill their fantasy.
    well, i do not think much of gwc,

    but doing stuff like adding females on msn, and then ka cheow them to go out on dates, ask them blatantly for sexual services, keep joking about sex, or hounding models for nude shots when they already state that they are not open to doing so.....

    that is one level up from gwc, i have a feeling some of them do not even have camera, that is how bold they are.....

    one word : pervert

  5. #25
    Senior Member
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    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by raptor1988 View Post
    what if CS were to be made into a forum where if you're not a registered/verified member, you cannot see any posts at all?
    Then this will increase more members...

    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    is there a way to verify what have posted in the thread is The Truth, The Whole Truth, and Nothing But The Truth?

    Might not be the truth, but its like business emails out there, everything black and white cannot siam...
    Gallery|Baby gallery
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  6. #26

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by Pablo View Post

    I think also that those that do contribute to the list of suggestions given to the Mods/Admin also are prepared to spend some time assisting the outcome..
    ‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’

    i promise that i will take the trouble to follow on this via pm with the admin

  7. #27

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    is there a way to verify what have posted in the thread is The Truth, The Whole Truth, and Nothing But The Truth?

    actually, i was thinking about this too. maybe the thread shld be started by the mod itself, and models being harassed shall send screenshots of the emails / conversations to the mod, and if the mod agree that the guy is obviously a pervert after going thru a simple investigation, he'll post up the emails and details of the person?

  8. #28

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by flowerpot View Post
    Might not be the truth, but its like business emails out there, everything black and white cannot siam...
    yes,

    plus if you think about it, what benefit does a model get from sliming people, if there is hard concrete evidence based on screenshots/emails, etc

    then even the act of doing so, though it may serve no tangible purpose in the long run, is the power of dissuasion.

  9. #29
    Senior Member Pablo's Avatar
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    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Hi there,

    This is a little off topic but might at some time being relevant to this thread.

    As with some serious threads, some decide to post humerous comments (yes I do find some funny) ... but they bring down the reason of the thread.

    This is a thread that I hope to see contributed to by like minded people.

    So, my thought is this....

    Is it possible for Admin to create a closed forum ?

    By this I mean a forum that only say Seniors, Models, Organisers etc can have access to ?

    Within this forum, those that have access to it can nominate (by drop down menu) who can participate in the discussion of their thread ?

    Is this being discrimating ? yes !.... so ?

    There is the RSL here, it used to be for returned servicemen.

    You could only become a member if you were one or were nominated by one and agreed too.

    It is now open to the public .... but....

    You try to get into the Officers club at any Airforce without being an Officer

    You try going to the womens toilet if you are male by saying "no descrimination"

    This forum has the right to include or exclude who ever they see fit ( I do not state this as a legal fact... because I may be proven wrong ).

    The reason for this idea is so that for discussions such as this it can be kept away from the public.

    Unless the same can be set up for PM's

    Cheers and hope this has some merrit
    Time, is an effortless construction :)

  10. #30

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by Leong23 View Post
    I can only write my support here......but it is really quite hard to 清理门户......

    Photography is somehow becoming a tool to those GWC to use art as an excuse to fulfill their fantasy.

    For those who know me personally in CS, they will know why i never post my portrait works here...............there are simply too many sicko around.........
    Me too. Will never post portrait stuff.

    Some even join some photography group, which are really into proper photography, to get the chance to shoot models and stuff.

  11. #31

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by Pablo View Post

    Is it possible for Admin to create a closed forum ?

    By this I mean a forum that only say Seniors, Models, Organisers etc can have access to ?

    Within this forum, those that have access to it can nominate (by drop down menu) who can participate in the discussion of their thread ?
    i think it not a huge problem for the admin to come out with a closed forum for those who really keen on this and have register with them.

    As for the access, it must be purely for those who registered with the Admin, be it Model or photographers, it's not about "Seniors Member" in the avatar.

    As for Mod, then that will be Admin's job to see which Mod will be a better choice to moderate the threads there.
    Dreams at Photoaid! Contact me, pls!

  12. #32

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    And one addition thing that it might sound funny or what. I believe many of you know about Exposer thread as one must expose themself before they could TCSS there.

    Personally, i find it might able to work for those register members for the "closed thread" and there will be a "member lists" of them with their photos, name and what their role in the thread, like Models, Organizer or photographer etc....

    Then at least they will know who they talking too before any shoot or what.
    Dreams at Photoaid! Contact me, pls!

  13. #33
    Senior Member Pablo's Avatar
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    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by Tupi Guy View Post
    i think it not a huge problem for the admin to come out with a closed forum for those who really keen on this and have register with them.

    As for the access, it must be purely for those who registered with the Admin, be it Model or photographers, it's not about "Seniors Member" in the avatar.

    As for Mod, then that will be Admin's job to see which Mod will be a better choice to moderate the threads there.
    Yes, I agree with what you are saying

    I only mentioned "Senior" as a point of referrence

    So, as such, I agree with what you wrote..
    Thanks and Cheers
    Time, is an effortless construction :)

  14. #34

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by Tupi Guy View Post
    And one addition thing that it might sound funny or what. I believe many of you know about Exposer thread as one must expose themself before they could TCSS there.

    Personally, i find it might able to work for those register members for the "closed thread" and there will be a "member lists" of them with their photos, name and what their role in the thread, like Models, Organizer or photographer etc....

    Then at least they will know who they talking too before any shoot or what.
    hrm

    yes, this is viable, but i can think of a number of reasons why people might not want to do so

    if you have seen what hardwarezone has done to people's photos..... they not happy, they will kope, and then throw slime nonstop on the person, using his photo as reference.

  15. #35

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by Pablo View Post
    Yes, I agree with what you are saying
    I only mentioned "Senior" as a point of referrence

    So, as such, I agree with what you wrote..
    Thanks and Cheers
    Ya, cos maybe some Senior is the culprits or even higher level? We also dont know, right?

    chills
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  16. #36

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    hrm

    yes, this is viable, but i can think of a number of reasons why people might not want to do so

    if you have seen what hardwarezone has done to people's photos..... they not happy, they will kope, and then throw slime nonstop on the person, using his photo as reference.

    THat the reason why it must be like that, that prove only those who really serious about the shoot will join and if one has nothing wrong or what, no worry about their photos being posted and more over it a closed thread, even it "leak" also easier to be trace?

    It just for the closed members, MOD and Admin. What ever discussion or what will be there. But then posting of their work will be another story, where all parties must be agreeable to post on the public thread. Especially those more "sexy" stuff etc..... that will depend the parties how it could be work out.

    Just look at the P&P thread, all kind of pics of the "models" all over. Even it's the photographers' works but did they think of their models that they been working with? Did they think of the "safety"?

    We know that here is a photography forum where individuals want to learn and excel ourself in a very best way. But as for this case, it has been brought many "unhealthy" cases and even on Media. As we never know who is watching, there are plenty of lurkers around and many just love to make a copy of others' photos or works.

    Personally, i find it not hard for those who really want to excel in this direction nor it will be difficult for them to go a little more further to make this happen and it's all about their own benefits and safety too.
    Dreams at Photoaid! Contact me, pls!

  17. #37
    Senior Member luna_sea83's Avatar
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    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Make every photographer EXPOSE themself if they are portrait shooters

  18. #38

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    It is the laws of economics at work here. If there is demand, there will be supply.
    In reality, there is really very little one can do about it because there are countless ways people can keep themselves in the shadows and lurk behind multiple pseudonyms.

    However, by starting this thread, it can create awareness and allow real victims to know that they don't have to take the crap from perverts. Sometimes people kept such harassments to themselves due to several concerns:
    1. will people believe them
    2. are they the only victim
    3. is this the norm, or are they being prudish
    .
    .
    .
    the list goes on.

    It is already quite obvious from those incidents and encounters that were thrown into the light that such self-proclaimed 'photographers' are just sex fiends in disguise. Unfortunately, we cannot also deny the existence of pseudo 'models' who are more than meets the eyes. Black sheep, mind you, not goats, in the midst of the community will henceforth tarnish the reputation and will lead to a downward spiral when words spread. Just like rubbish attracting houseflies, we need (XMM) to close-up on them and expose them! j/k.

    As with all suggestions, I think we need to expose both the perverts seeking extra services, as well as models who enjoy soliciting.
    First, if they know that they will be expose, they may think twice.
    Second, those of the same feathers can flock together and contact one another elsewhere, rather that trying their luck in PMing and harassing uninterested parties.

    After all, it is free will and if those who are harassed, they should expose them or maybe lodge a report to the police. Though one may feel it is useless, but it sends a signal that one is not to messed with.
    Dreams at Photoaid! Contact me, pls!

  19. #39
    Member tortise's Avatar
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    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    i just chanced up on this thread. found it intriguing as there have been many posts about bad experiences with pretty preverted behaviour during shoots, and on msn etc, but seemingly no effective solution to reduce such occurrances.

    i see logic in the different approaches to the issue, that the admin/mod feel that this is a free forum, we are adults and have to bear the risks of the transactions and information we choose to release here, and excessive controls may be a too 'singaporean government' approach to inconvenience the masses for the sake of deterring a few black sheep.

    on the other hand, i also agree that if i am truly an honest photographer with no hidden agenda in participation in the events or transactions on clubsnap, there is nothing to fear or hide of feel ashamed about in stating my personnal details, contacts and even photos before being certified/allowed to participate.

    Some possible concerns might be if (1) there are inconsiderate, immature troublemakers who choose to pick on silly things like "what an ugly photo you have!" or "wah uncle act cute and use such cute nicknames", or "how come this guy so old already still don't know nuts about his equipment and techniques" etc... there must be watchmen to curb such behaviour promptly. Also (2) as mentioned by others, if there is a misunderstanding between two parties during an event or transaction etc, and the photos and details are used in a public smearing action, adequate avenues for proper investigation, mediation and redress must be available. Otherwise, like many say, lots of people will really be scared off for fear of getting into trouble without even really being at fault.

    Do we rather have a small community of honest photography-loving members or a large community of a wide mix of people, good and bad? I frankly don't know, for the former might make this community too exclusive and unfriendly to newbies?

    Oh yah, and bosses can match us to our nicks and catch us on CS during office hours.

    So alot of the protective measures might in the end make the forum very user-unfriendly which is the last thing it wants to achieve. If MSN has so many limitations beyond personnal control, i believe there would be lot less users. Also makes the whole job for the admins really complicated. They don't have an easy time, having to investigate infractions, mediate in threads, and putting themselves in this position where they have to be on-the-ball all the time, or otherwise face alot of comments on "what are the mods/admin doing?" despite all their efforts.

    anyway after my many $0.02, i do support making the personal services offered/wanted section protected just like P&P.

    It's great when we stand up and speak up for things we feel are not right, and offer our views. We might not reach a solution in the end, but in the process of all the idea-bouncing and comments, someone might just happen to point the way to a great solution.
    Slow...yeah, steady... not really
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  20. #40

    Default Re: a more open discussion: CLEANING UP

    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    I support services offered/ wanted viewable to REGISTERED MEMBER only.
    Quote Originally Posted by catchlights View Post
    and I also agree with Pablo, ones should not try to hide their real identity for engaging a shoot, regardless is in a group or private shoot.
    Totally agree !!
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