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Thread: when to use iso

  1. #21

    Default Re: when to use iso

    Quote Originally Posted by bomby929 View Post
    Its pixel density... a D40 with only 6 mp also give good noise control, and it is not a Full frame camera.
    Everything being equal, will a higher megapixel gives more noise for the same ISO?
    Idea got, execution not!
    APAD|Travelogue

  2. #22

    Default Re: when to use iso

    Quote Originally Posted by two200 View Post
    Everything being equal, will a higher megapixel gives more noise for the same ISO?
    This is a tricky question depending on which "everything" you keep equal. There's no way to keep absolutely everything equal while having a different megapixel number. If the microlens design is kept "equal", then you will need a larger sensor for higher mega pixel. In this case, there shouldn't be any additional noise for the RAW. In fact, the final processed outcome could have lesser noise because given the same initial per-pixel noise amount, noise reduction algorithms work better when they have more pixels to work with.

    If you keep the sensor size fixed, then higher megapixels means smaller microlens size or smaller gap in between the lenses. So "everything being equal" doesn't apply here.

  3. #23

    Default Re: when to use iso

    Quote Originally Posted by estel View Post
    This is a tricky question depending on which "everything" you keep equal. There's no way to keep absolutely everything equal while having a different megapixel number. If the microlens design is kept "equal", then you will need a larger sensor for higher mega pixel. In this case, there shouldn't be any additional noise for the RAW. In fact, the final processed outcome could have lesser noise because given the same initial per-pixel noise amount, noise reduction algorithms work better when they have more pixels to work with.

    If you keep the sensor size fixed, then higher megapixels means smaller microlens size or smaller gap in between the lenses. So "everything being equal" doesn't apply here.
    So I guess whether noisy with higher ISO is actually dependent of the on-board software
    Idea got, execution not!
    APAD|Travelogue

  4. #24

    Default Re: when to use iso

    Quote Originally Posted by two200 View Post
    So I guess whether noisy with higher ISO is actually dependent of the on-board software
    it's a combination of microlens+sensor construction, pixel density, number of megapixels, image processor, exposure time, and lot of other factors. But we are verging on OT here.

  5. #25

    Default Re: when to use iso

    Quote Originally Posted by two200 View Post
    Everything being equal, will a higher megapixel gives more noise for the same ISO?
    Read this.. http://www.dpreview.com/learn/?/key=pixel_density

    Higher mpx does not mean higher pixel density due to difference in sensor size.. but higher mpx against same sensor size means higher pixel density, but that also does not translate to better noise. because

    1) The actual sensor size matters
    2) Type of sensor matters
    3) On board technology and picture processing matters

    Note that pixel density should not be used as a predictor for image quality but instead as a parameter to help understand the sensor. But having said that, so far, all low pixel density sensor exhibits low noise at high iso due to the sensor being space futher apart and therefore improving the sensor sensitivity to light.
    Nikon D90

  6. #26

    Default Re: when to use iso

    I am not good at these technicals but my understanding is, image noise are produced when signal are boost electronically. Not to be confused with detail loss from stray lights in small sensor or denser pixel per area. Larger sensor has the advantage of more light hitting the surface giving more energy signal (don know what to call). It will suffer from loss of detail rather than noise when density increases.

    IMO, comparing into past model is not accurate because of technology. I have not seen it but I believe D40 might not be able to achieve 3200 low noise quality because of technology.

    F30, LX3 and F200EXR, if you notice produce low noise images but at the expense of detail.

    Foveon (for now) has no problem with sensor surface area but suffered from a technical problem of requiring much more light than Bayer bec of multi layers, thus generating more noise and lose of color in lower light.

  7. #27
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    Default Re: when to use iso

    Quote Originally Posted by Rashkae View Post
    Full frame has nothing to do with it.
    Quote Originally Posted by bomby929 View Post
    Agreed.. it more to do with pixel density on the sensor..
    Guys ..
    lets have a common consensus, full frame Dslr = high end camera ?

    if so .. of coz he has no problem with a higher ISO .. lolx ..

    try using a 350D and see if there's any noise .. i would say tons of it .. vs a 50D .. same iso setting ... same subject ..

    *sigh* i wish i can afford a 5DmII ..

    cheers
    Canon 50D| 28-75mm 2.8 : 50mm 1.8 : 85mm 1.8 | 580EX-II |

  8. #28

    Default Re: when to use iso

    Quote Originally Posted by sukevin View Post
    Guys ..
    lets have a common consensus, full frame Dslr = high end camera ?

    if so .. of coz he has no problem with a higher ISO .. lolx ..

    try using a 350D and see if there's any noise .. i would say tons of it .. vs a 50D .. same iso setting ... same subject ..

    *sigh* i wish i can afford a 5DmII ..

    cheers
    Nope. You're still getting it all wrong. For example, very high end Hasselblads don't go above ISO400!

    High end camera does not imply clean high ISO. It's a very very very silly thing nowadays for everyone to be fixated on high ISO when they would not normally shoot at high ISO anyway.

    You're going to comapre an old and outdated 350D vs. a new technology 5dMkII? The differences in image quality will come from modern technical advances rather than "high end vs low end" thinking.

    Also, if you actually look harder, you'd realize the 5DmkII gets "clean" high ISO at the expense of contrast and detail. Images become softer.
    Alpha

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