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Thread: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

  1. #21
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    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    to TS,

    that mean to say the lense was not tested on the spot? but bought & brought back home then test?
    have u seen the "light" yet?

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    hi bro,

    in the eyes of the law, he is not wrong. He has the right to increase price after the repair is done. Likewise, you also have the right to reject the goods after it is being serviced.

    However, I do feel that the sense of sales ethic is not there ( not a man of his words ).

    move on buddy, move on...

    cheers,
    Billy

  3. #23

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    All in all, I still prefer the CS BnS way better than E(vil)Bay. There are bad cases, like the OP's, but the latter option is a cesspool of horror stories.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dream Merchant View Post
    I am all for the honor system, enforced and self-policed with assistance from moderators for forum classifieds becuase I've personally seen it work on the largest sports forum in the US and where a huge amount of trade gets done on a daily basis.
    what works elsewhere does not mean it will work here...
    have u seen the "light" yet?

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    480 vs 550 = 70 dollars difference. ok. In my opinion, its wrong to do so having pay something I have not committed to. At the point of time, it was agreed 480 in good condition. Sounds not logic, maybe allow me to quote a simple example.

    You order a plate of wanton mee, dry. Uncle say $3. Later uncle say not enough wanton, give you extra char siew ok. How much did you pay? $3 or $3.50 or even $4? Even for services.

    DM, I understand you feel shortchanged if you had bought it at a higher price, I have stated my point of view. But we need to move on, luckily you didnt buy the lens at 480 in that condition, otherwise it will be more than $70.

  6. #26
    Senior Member denniskee's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    well, if it is an ad in cs b&s, it wouldnt be difficult to find the nick of the seller would it. just use "search" function.
    photography makes one sees things from all angles.

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Anyone who is looking to buy a lens of the same model..check the serial number..
    Make sure its not price more than $480..lol
    This is an electronic post which requires no signature.

  8. #28
    Senior Member denniskee's Avatar
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    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    may be seller trying to pull a fast one on newbies, selling faulty lens, but he dam sauy and meet an old salt like u.
    photography makes one sees things from all angles.

  9. #29

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Quote Originally Posted by lkkang View Post
    hi bro,

    in the eyes of the law, he is not wrong. He has the right to increase price after the repair is done. Likewise, you also have the right to reject the goods after it is being serviced.

    However, I do feel that the sense of sales ethic is not there ( not a man of his words ).

    move on buddy, move on...

    cheers,
    Billy
    Depending on how you look at it.

    There once (and still is in some places) where the verbal agreement and the handshake is regarded in a court as a legally binding contract, but such systems only work when you deal with honorable people and where suchs systems are enforced. As I've mentioned, I do know of one of the largest sports forums in the US where the 'a man's word is his contract' honor system is applied, and used very successfully.

    But here, I guess it's still the Wild Wild West and see who shoots who first and gets away with it.

    I won't waste time or brain cells past today on this, don't worry.

  10. #30

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Quote Originally Posted by 3in1c View Post
    480 vs 550 = 70 dollars difference. ok. In my opinion, its wrong to do so having pay something I have not committed to. At the point of time, it was agreed 480 in good condition. Sounds not logic, maybe allow me to quote a simple example.

    You order a plate of wanton mee, dry. Uncle say $3. Later uncle say not enough wanton, give you extra char siew ok. How much did you pay? $3 or $3.50 or even $4? Even for services.

    DM, I understand you feel shortchanged if you had bought it at a higher price, I have stated my point of view. But we need to move on, luckily you didnt buy the lens at 480 in that condition, otherwise it will be more than $70.
    I know. Lucky.

  11. #31

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Quote Originally Posted by denniskee View Post
    may be seller trying to pull a fast one on newbies, selling faulty lens, but he dam sauy and meet an old salt like u.
    Actually seller seemed to be genuinely nice, and not technically inclined, which was why had to call the friend who was the 'advisor', who also gave wrong advise and stated that the MDF was such, when it wasn't.

    I seriously sense that seller doesn't understand the principles of fair trade and feels that hey, 'must come out money to repair so must charge more if not loose out because already have to pay for repair'.

    Seller has forgotten that lens was faulty, and if seller tries to sell a lens as 'faulty', chances are no one even wants to buy, or will only buy at a much much lower price (cost of repair and risk factors involved).

  12. #32

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Quote Originally Posted by cy_j View Post
    All in all, I still prefer the CS BnS way better than E(vil)Bay. There are bad cases, like the OP's, but the latter option is a cesspool of horror stories.
    Actually, and sad to say, I've had much more enjoyable and pleasant/trouble-free (I would rate it as 99.99%) experiences on e-bay (mainly US, Aust and Canadian traders) and from US forums than buying used locally.

  13. #33

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    DM, there are these kinda of unethical ppl who are the black sheep in the B/S. Wat to do? Really suck thumb at times lor. No choice. But one thing u can help is if this guy is selling his same gear and claiming mint condition etc or wat, juz give a warning or send to mod to report etc. I once have a fren wanting to get a lens that he wan to buy from B/S but i did a check on his history and found that that guy has juz bought the lens from another CSer who sent for service and is selling away at higher price than bought claiming also mint condition. I also sold a bag to another guy and he in turn sold the bag at a higher cost to other guys. There are such ppl out to earn money one. We cant stop them one...
    Hmm... you do not deserve this... sad that there is always ppl like that ~ a complete waste of time.

    Hope u get what you wanted soon.
    Thanks for the thoughts guys.

  14. #34

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Quote Originally Posted by sORe-EyEz View Post
    to TS,

    that mean to say the lense was not tested on the spot? but bought & brought back home then test?
    No, that wasn't the case.

    Short Version:

    - Wanted to buy a lens.
    - Price settled on $480.
    - Assured in writing that lens functions perfectly.
    - It was spoilt. Cannot reach MFD no matter what mode.
    - Seller agreed to send lens for repair, and offer discount if the lens can be repaired. - I did the gentlemanly thing and promised to honor my end of the bargain if the lens can be repaired.
    - Now lens back, wants to INCREASE price to $550, let alone donít honor promise to give discount.
    - Wait nearly one month is not the problem as I wanted to walk the talk and act honorably, but seller insists itís sellerís RIGHT to charge more and told me to go elsewhere if I thought it was unreasonable.

    Do you think this is a fair way to trade, and is it ethical behaviour?

  15. #35
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    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dream Merchant View Post
    No, that wasn't the case.
    i see, but from a consumer's point of view there is little 1 can do. unless CS is taking a tougher stance against those black sheeps.
    have u seen the "light" yet?

  16. #36

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Quote Originally Posted by sORe-EyEz View Post
    i see, but from a consumer's point of view there is little 1 can do. unless CS is taking a tougher stance against those black sheeps.
    Yes, that appears to be the case, but one good thing is that as compared to the past, more members are now willing to come forward to air their bad experiences.

    I'm sorry I can't remember the person's nick and actual name, if not I would post it up for other member's caution.

  17. #37

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Sorry to hear your plight. From your lengthy posts, can tell you feel very short-changed. I would too.

    But what's the point of posting a long thread here to air your grievances? It takes time and energy to spill out all these.

    You should have just spent the time looking elsewhere for another used lens or even think about buying a new one?

    Things don't always go our way, and we will always encounter people whom we wish would be nicer. If you want to spend your precious time grieving upon bad experiences, you will be very tired and I see no aim in the final outcome you will get out of this.

    Ultimate he is the seller and he has the full rights to dishonor his earlier claims. It is an informal transaction and has nothing to do with whatever court order, etc you seem to suggest. If he chooses to live his life like that, let him be. Whatever result comes out of such a character, it's his life. You have no right to dictate how he should behave, although we all certainly value honesty and honor.

    Just like in STOMP we see time and again people posting pictures of inconsiderate commuters taking up more than 1 seat or not giving way to the elderly. It comes to a point of being boring or even lame for those who post those pictures. So what's new with encountering sellers or buyers who are not to our expectations?

    Learn, move on, and be thankful for the many other blessings that you have in life.

  18. #38

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Quote Originally Posted by kiwi2 View Post
    Sorry to hear your plight. From your lengthy posts, can tell you feel very short-changed. I would too.

    But what's the point of posting a long thread here to air your grievances? It takes time and energy to spill out all these.

    You should have just spent the time looking elsewhere for another used lens or even think about buying a new one?

    Things don't always go our way, and we will always encounter people whom we wish would be nicer. If you want to spend your precious time grieving upon bad experiences, you will be very tired and I see no aim in the final outcome you will get out of this.

    Ultimate he is the seller and he has the full rights to dishonor his earlier claims. It is an informal transaction and has nothing to do with whatever court order, etc you seem to suggest. If he chooses to live his life like that, let him be. Whatever result comes out of such a character, it's his life. You have no right to dictate how he should behave, although we all certainly value honesty and honor.

    Just like in STOMP we see time and again people posting pictures of inconsiderate commuters taking up more than 1 seat or not giving way to the elderly. It comes to a point of being boring or even lame for those who post those pictures. So what's new with encountering sellers or buyers who are not to our expectations?

    Learn, move on, and be thankful for the many other blessings that you have in life.
    You're absolutely correct!

    However, I try to be detailed where arrangements are concerned. Most people are too lazy when it come to details, and you know the old saying, "God is in the details".

    It's also good to have an outlet, and also to warn other members in case they're ever offered a used
    Sigma 24-70mm f/2.8 EX DG lens bearing a serial number of 3003880.
    At lest they now know the history of this lens.

  19. #39

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    Woaaaa.... now the seller is going to have a hard time selling....

    I'm not sure how the seller treated you. Was he rude r made you feel like you were being cheated?

    I think he has every right to change his mind about not selling you the lens at the same or cheaper price than b4. There was no written contract. Just verbal promise right? Maybe after he paid $ for the repairs, he felt heart pain and decided to change his mind by increasing the price?

    If he acted cocky and rude, then I understand your frustration and desire to shame him.

    But if he explained to you nicely or in a neutral manner, or even apologized for changing his mind, I'm not sure you have done the right thing in seeking revenge by revealing the details here.

    Anyway, good luck in your new search for the lens.

  20. #40

    Default Re: Do you think this is fair or ethical?

    You don't have to be rude or cocky to act in a dishonorable manner.

    They're entirely seperate issues.

    Please le me be clear about one thing: I derive no pleasure from being forced to post this thread to begin with.

    It's NOT about revenge. I wanted to find out if my intepretation of the situation was correct, and to inform others about the history of this lens.

    If I wanted "revenge", as you put it, and something I am totally not fond of, a different course of action might have been required.

    Why do people have to mistakenly think of 'revenge'?

    Whatever happened to 'accountability'?
    Last edited by Dream Merchant; 28th March 2009 at 01:36 AM.

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