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Thread: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

  1. #1
    Senior Member velasco's Avatar
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    Default Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    If you are active in Flickr, you will definitely come across talented young girl who creates outstanding photographs, Rosie Hardy. Till one day, someone posted a discussion on how she copies other artists from Deviantart. So now, she had received notice on how her words can have a lawsuit against her.
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/rosie_hardy/


    A blog has been set up to provide evidence of such "copyright infringement".
    http://rosiehardyplagiarism.tumblr.com/

    I digged up some old thread, this one is posted by kandinsky.
    What is Not Protected by Copyright?

    Subject matter not protected by copyright include:

    * ideas (e.g. a new business idea that has not been documented);
    * concepts (e.g. an idea for a new game show that has not been written down);
    * discoveries (e.g. a research finding that has not been known before);
    * procedures (e.g. the steps involved when applying for a travel visa);
    * methods (e.g. the unique solution to a mathematical problem);
    * subject matter that has not been made tangible in a recording or writing (e.g. a speech or a dance that has not been written or recorded); and
    * subject matter which is not of original authorship (e.g. works which contain information in the public domain such as standards and the like).

    http://www.ipos.gov.sg/leftNav/cop/
    If the statement above is legit, she hasn't done anything wrong , has she?
    I perceive the works she posted as a mere emulation. There's no law/rule that says you have to credit an artist that inspires you.It is not wrong in attempting to reproduce other works in an effort to understand the process.

    If this is copying, then we should restrict works for only the first. The first guy who shoots a sunrise at Changi, the first one who shoots a Persian cat on top of a couch. The first one who captures a girl on top of a hill with red balloons, no? Since everything else which arrives later is copying their concept.


    Spill your thoughts , please.
    Last edited by velasco; 24th February 2009 at 08:35 AM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    like that die already,

    whoever go to punggol beach first, probably 8000 years ago and started painting or doodling on his happy leaf can claim artistic license for everything done with regards to capturing the scene after that.

    people are really getting so very huffed up unnecessarily about intellectual property rights. maybe she emulated the idea. maybe the concept was even spot on parallel. who cares? i only care about the result. i'm sure most of the original people also couldn't give a half-ass about whether she copied or not. after all, they've done it already, and reaped the benefits. of course if they didn't, then too bad, they had inferior marketing.

    life is unfair, the sooner one gets accustomed to the idea and the fact that presentation, not just ideas gets people somewhere.. the sooner one will be happier.

    by the way, is the joker of the site who is making all these plagarism claims even confident that the so-called originals are really original? it will be such a slap in the face if they weren't. i clicked on the works, one is posted in JUL 2008, taken 2007. if i can find a photograph person wrapped up in cloth and hanging from the ceiling that is earlier than that, it would be immensely immensely ironic, since that particular work has no credits either.

    you should take a look at landscape photographs of certain location, like antelope canyon. or even fashion ideas. there are so many cliches and overdone concepts, and no one levies these needless, personal accusations that lead nowhere.

    there is a difference between "stealing" ideas and replicating them. no one faults japan for innovation, but when it comes to ideas in this oh-so-crappily artistic new age it seems to easy to take the higher moral ground and act all huffed up like it isn't the same everywhere.

    that site just seems to me like sour grapes, and borders on sounding like a needless obsession, i.e. stalking.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    “She” owes DeviantART artists an apology and she has to give credit were credit is due.
    oh, so now deviantart is full of artists. roll eyes.

    some of the examples are grabbing at thin air, if you want effects like the ones on page 2..

    those are a dime a dozen. whoever started that brilliant attempt to provide examples of copyright infringement simply succeeds in making himself or herself seem like an uninformed country bumpkin who doesn't look at photographs on the internet too often.

    this quote springs to mind, by benjamin franklin, incidentally:

    “Originality is the art of concealing your sources."
    Last edited by night86mare; 24th February 2009 at 08:52 AM.

  4. #4
    Senior Member velasco's Avatar
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    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    can i "copy" your rebuttal and post on the discussion? so apt! hahaha

    AN: oh haha you already did! thanks alot! now im like her fanboy or something haha
    Last edited by velasco; 24th February 2009 at 08:58 AM.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    Quote Originally Posted by velasco View Post
    can i "copy" your rebuttal and post on the discussion? so apt! hahaha

    AN: oh haha you already did! thanks alot! now im like her fanboy or something haha
    i have posted the rebuttal already, along with examples of exactly what i mean.

    an idea is something, no doubt, but there are ideas, and there are opportunists. and no one should fault the opportunist for making full use of ideas, because without them, the world would be full of people with castles in the air, with no one realising anything.

    doing a quick search on handprints, incidentally, reveals a HORSE with 2 handprints on flickr posted 04, let's make feed him more apples to make sure he's credited: www.flickr.com/photos/shadowplay/100076549/

    then someone did it in 07, in flickr again, probably not as artistic though..
    www.flickr.com/photos/guccino/347336940/

    and finally the presumed "original cream of the crop" was produced in aug 08, as cited on abovementioned blog:
    xequemate.deviantart.com/art/Strange-Creature s-94938988

    amazing things, these ideas.
    Last edited by night86mare; 24th February 2009 at 09:13 AM.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    people are really getting so very huffed up unnecessarily about intellectual property rights. maybe she emulated the idea. maybe the concept was even spot on parallel. who cares? i only care about the result. i'm sure most of the original people also couldn't give a half-ass about whether she copied or not. after all, they've done it already, and reaped the benefits. of course if they didn't, then too bad, they had inferior marketing.
    I tend to agree with this. There may be some vagueness, but in some cases it's not fair to call something a "copy/plagiarism" outright. I personally think the jet photo with the stranded girl is a much better and significantly different idea than the original: better or not, they tell totally different stories. Or is is the case that no one but Denis Olivier is allowed to take photos of single humans figures with a jet taking off from now on?

  7. #7
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    I think if someone wants to sue for copyright infringement, they will have an uphill struggle, at least in Singapore they would; under Singapore laws.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    like that die already,

    whoever go to punggol beach first, probably 8000 years ago and started painting or doodling on his happy leaf can claim artistic license for everything done with regards to capturing the scene after that.


    like this everyday, a lot of people will tio sue

  9. #9
    Senior Member velasco's Avatar
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    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy


  10. #10

    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    Last edited by airforce1; 24th February 2009 at 01:33 PM. Reason: delete
    Think of concepts and work towards it.

  11. #11
    Senior Member velasco's Avatar
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    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    Quote Originally Posted by airforce1 View Post
    omg thats horrible. And the culprit is a Singaporean photographer. I feel embarassed.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    Quote Originally Posted by airforce1 View Post
    same argument applies.

    whoever said that a winner of a competition had to be original?

    a photograph should be judged on its merit, if originality is part of the equation demanded by the competition, then fine and dandy. otherwise, there is zero issue.

  13. #13
    Senior Member velasco's Avatar
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    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    Quote Originally Posted by night86mare View Post
    same argument applies.

    whoever said that a winner of a competition had to be original?

    a photograph should be judged on its merit, if originality is part of the equation demanded by the competition, then fine and dandy. otherwise, there is zero issue.

    well in this case, there is a stipulation.

    Here is one of the rule :
    3. Legal requirements
    By submitting an entry into the competition, you warrant to Future that the entry is wholly original to you and not wholly or substantially copied from any other material and that the entry does not defame, cause injury to or invade the privacy of or otherwise infringe or violate any statutory, common law, regulatory or intellectual property rights of any third party. You agree to fully indemnify Future and any of the official partners, sponsors or associates of Future relating to the competition in respect of all royalties, fees and other monies owing to any person by reason of your breaching this rule.
    Last edited by velasco; 24th February 2009 at 04:25 PM.

  14. #14
    vince123123
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    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    I feel the pictures are sufficiently different.

    Quote Originally Posted by airforce1 View Post

  15. #15

    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    Quote Originally Posted by velasco View Post
    well in this case, there is a stipulation.

    Here is one of the rule :
    well, the thing is,

    once again, are we going to say that a picture taken of children near any waterfall is unoriginal?

    in that case, all the landscape photographs are dead, most of them are of seas with drama and rocks.

  16. #16
    Senior Member zac08's Avatar
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    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    Even if you attempt to replicate some of the old iconic photos... can you get the same feeling?

    it's just different IMO, after-all... we're gonna be taking the same photos everywhere in the end. The locations are largely similar for most of the landscape shots....

    Mebbe it's better to stick to macro insects, no one can accuse you of shooting the same butterfly (they have short lifespans anyway)
    Michael Lim
    My Flickr Site

  17. #17
    Senior Member redstone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    It's funny like people say Singapore Flyer is a copy of London Eye, but then again London Eye is not the first observation wheel in the world.

    And you can say every building with grand "Greek" columns ( like our City Hall, Madeleine Church in Paris, etc) are copies of the ancient Greek temples like Pantheon.

    And you can say every formal portrait is a copy of other formal portraits, every sit-down-and-smile portrait is a copy of the previous one, etc etc

  18. #18

    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    Quote Originally Posted by airforce1 View Post
    damn ... i'm really disappointed

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Plagiarism or simply inspired? The Rosie Hardy controversy

    I love stealing great ideas. Its very contagious. Pass it on and make it better. LOL!

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