question about autofocus points

[Yew Fai]

hi. regarding autofocus points for nikon bodies, i know you can use a selector to choose any of the focus points when you are framing a subject to focus on that area; alternatively you can focus on the subject using the center focus point and lock the focus/exposure and recompose the photo without choosing a different focus point.

but if i have more than one face to capture, is there any option for me to lock on all the faces and keep all of them sharp? at the moment, i do not know how to do it - i only know that i have to decrease my aperture size accordingly if i want to keep more than one subject sharp.

i hear about face recognition features in pns and the many autofocus points in the dslr. i currently have a d3, and though i think i may have gone thru' most of the user guide, i am not sure if i have missed anything with regards to any functions that allows me to capture multiple faces and keeping them sharp and in focus.

any advice would be greatly appreciated, thanks a lot!

[jnet6]

current dslr's technology doesn't have face recognition features, if you want all faces to be sharp.
Please read more about aperture.

You have a very good camera body, please use it wisely.

[huggable]

You can focus on the person nearest from the camera, and select the appropriate aperture to get DOF for the rest to be in focus too.

[blue_quartz]

Originally Posted by jnet6 current dslr's technology doesn't have face recognition features, if you want all faces to be sharp. Please read more about aperture. You have a very good camera body, please use it wisely.

Actually some DSLRs have face recognition when using Live View...

[jnet6]

Originally Posted by blue_quartz Actually some DSLRs have face recognition when using Live View...

please advice which model?

[sammy888]

Originally Posted by Yew Fai hi. regarding autofocus points for nikon bodies, i know you can use a selector to choose any of the focus points when you are framing a subject to focus on that area; alternatively you can focus on the subject using the center focus point and lock the focus/exposure and recompose the photo without choosing a different focus point. but if i have more than one face to capture, is there any option for me to lock on all the faces and keep all of them sharp? at the moment, i do not know how to do it - i only know that i have to decrease my aperture size accordingly if i want to keep more than one subject sharp. i hear about face recognition features in pns and the many autofocus points in the dslr. i currently have a d3, and though i think i may have gone thru' most of the user guide, i am not sure if i have missed anything with regards to any functions that allows me to capture multiple faces and keeping them sharp and in focus. any advice would be greatly appreciated, thanks a lot!

GOSH a Nikon D3???? For the kind of money you spent on that calibre of Pro camera, I would impress on you to invest in a proper Photography class so that you could aquire the skills to get your money's worth on that gear. I say this with all good intention to ya as from the question you asked, it does indicate that you are a very much a newbie. Okay nothing wrong with a newbie with the means to get the Ultimate DSLR camera from Nikon. Enjoy your toy. It has alot to offer you.

Getting back to your question. Don't always believe all the MARKETING CRAP you see out there about cameras with face recognition BS. Even the face recognition thingy to fight terroism is BS most of the time as the technology is not even accurate. And that is for video! So imagine on your PnS camera which certain brands has been marketing that dribble to you....well it does not always work. When you snap a shot with your camera, your lens has to be focus on a certain distance yes? Now imagine you have people standing at varying distance.

One who is 3 feet from you, another who is 6 feet away, another at 10 feet away and another even further like say 20 feet away. Just snap of shot of that grouping and see if even with facial recognition, you can get everyone's face to be sharp and in focus. No way that is possible. There are alot of limits to that facial recognition claim in the ads I can tell you. Trust me. I know. I am in Marketing and Advertisement.

When you start to understand the concept of "depth of field" and Aperture setting and choice of lens, you will come to know, it is not always possible. Picked the wrong lens and light condition and you are lucky to get only one person sharply focus while the rest are blurred. Or with another lens you get maybe 2 or 3 that are sharp or relatively sharp and then with another lens and depending on the lighting and how near or far you stand to the group...you could get everyone sharp. Of course if you are shooting a scene with everyone standing in a line and all are at about equal distance to you, that would be alot easierl to just pick the person in the middle as your referenc and then click to fire the shutter.

So will you find facial recognition feature in future cameras like the expensive ultra pro D3...well I doubt so. The face recognition you find in those PnS can make that claim to some extend as it has a wide len capability. By looking detecting images that resemble a face and measuring how far or near each one are, it will computate the best Aperture setting and maybe it has to be in wide mode and not telephone mode in order to archieve that. So it is using the best depth of field aperture setting to "try" to archieve that. No way a camera in just one shot frame can capture each focal range of a few faces at varying distances and put them all in one photo shot in a sharp manner.

Usually if you use a wide lens (eg..18mm) you can at least make that happen since wide lens tend to have greater depth of field due to the nature of what it is used for and the way wide lens are made then say compared to a telephoto lens like 70mm or longer.

This is just the tip of a very large ice berg. You have a super DSLR there. After investing such a large sum on the gear, investing in a photography course and you will really be learning alot more and faster then trying to source for answers each time you have a newbie question. Hand on lesson with a pro will help you alot quicker.

[iso100]

Originally Posted by jnet6 current dslr's technology doesn't have face recognition features, if you want all faces to be sharp. Please read more about aperture. You have a very good camera body, please use it wisely.

According to what has been advertised, Nikon D90 has the Face Detection System.

[luna_sea83]

Yes the D90 has the face detection system, but it does not make ur subject faces sharp automatically.
It only detects the face and thats it, sharpness still relies on ur techniques and lens.

[uranium2k]

I do admire the fact that you have a pro-level D3, and are asking this question. Haha. Go and play with it and explore it thoroughly. You'll be impressed...

[blue_quartz]

Originally Posted by luna_sea83 Yes the D90 has the face detection system, but it does not make ur subject faces sharp automatically. It only detects the face and thats it, sharpness still relies on ur techniques and lens.

I have a D90 but I have no experience with using face detection while shooting. I'm only quite amused how it detects faces during playback and you can quickly shuffle through the faces using the secondary command dial. Olympus and Canon have their fair share of offerings. Do they focus on the faces then? I forgot about other brands' cameras liao...

[Yew Fai]

Originally Posted by sammy888 GOSH a Nikon D3???? For the kind of money you spent on that calibre of Pro camera, I would impress on you to invest in a proper Photography class so that you could aquire the skills to get your money's worth on that gear. I say this with all good intention to ya as from the question you asked, it does indicate that you are a very much a newbie. Okay nothing wrong with a newbie with the means to get the Ultimate DSLR camera from Nikon. Enjoy your toy. It has alot to offer you. Getting back to your question. Don't always believe all the MARKETING CRAP you see out there about cameras with face recognition BS. Even the face recognition thingy to fight terroism is BS most of the time as the technology is not even accurate. And that is for video! So imagine on your PnS camera which certain brands has been marketing that dribble to you....well it does not always work. When you snap a shot with your camera, your lens has to be focus on a certain distance yes? Now imagine you have people standing at varying distance. One who is 3 feet from you, another who is 6 feet away, another at 10 feet away and another even further like say 20 feet away. Just snap of shot of that grouping and see if even with facial recognition, you can get everyone's face to be sharp and in focus. No way that is possible. There are alot of limits to that facial recognition claim in the ads I can tell you. Trust me. I know. I am in Marketing and Advertisement. When you start to understand the concept of "depth of field" and Aperture setting and choice of lens, you will come to know, it is not always possible. Picked the wrong lens and light condition and you are lucky to get only one person sharply focus while the rest are blurred. Or with another lens you get maybe 2 or 3 that are sharp or relatively sharp and then with another lens and depending on the lighting and how near or far you stand to the group...you could get everyone sharp. Of course if you are shooting a scene with everyone standing in a line and all are at about equal distance to you, that would be alot easierl to just pick the person in the middle as your referenc and then click to fire the shutter. So will you find facial recognition feature in future cameras like the expensive ultra pro D3...well I doubt so. The face recognition you find in those PnS can make that claim to some extend as it has a wide len capability. By looking detecting images that resemble a face and measuring how far or near each one are, it will computate the best Aperture setting and maybe it has to be in wide mode and not telephone mode in order to archieve that. So it is using the best depth of field aperture setting to "try" to archieve that. No way a camera in just one shot frame can capture each focal range of a few faces at varying distances and put them all in one photo shot in a sharp manner. Usually if you use a wide lens (eg..18mm) you can at least make that happen since wide lens tend to have greater depth of field due to the nature of what it is used for and the way wide lens are made then say compared to a telephoto lens like 70mm or longer. This is just the tip of a very large ice berg. You have a super DSLR there. After investing such a large sum on the gear, investing in a photography course and you will really be learning alot more and faster then trying to source for answers each time you have a newbie question. Hand on lesson with a pro will help you alot quicker.

sammy, thanks for your detailed reply, especially on how the 'face recognition' feature works, and to all those who replied

yep, i am a newbie with a good gear, but that doesnt deter me from asking questions and learning from others. i do not have formal training in this field, and i learn from taking photos and learning from my own mistakes, as well as from others' experiences. i may be shortsighted (and short of cash), but i am not sure what i can learn in a formal course that i cant gleam from materials that are easily available online these days, no offence to those who did and could afford it.

yep, i did mentioned earlier the only way i know how to keep most faces sharp and in focus is to reduce the aperture size and increase the dof. because i heard of 'face recognition' features in d90 and other pns and didnt have a chance to try out those cameras, i felt compelled to bring out this question, in case there are other ways i can get sharp photos when trying to frame multiple subjects' faces.

afterall, d90 came out way after d3, and with video features and such, i was thinking that they might have a breakthrough with the 'face recognition' feature that can do easily with a switch what you would normally need to do with much adjustment to your aperture and some trial and error shots.

thanks for your comments and encouragement - i will keep shooting and make the most out of my gear

[redwine]

no expert here,
but what i would suggest:

Assuming u have 10 pax in a straight line in front of you,
Try to focus lock on the 3rd or 8th pax and then shift the focus point back to the center.
Stop down your aperture as much as it allow without risking handshake.

[lsisaxon]

Originally Posted by Yew Fai yep, i did mentioned earlier the only way i know how to keep most faces sharp and in focus is to reduce the aperture size and increase the dof. because i heard of 'face recognition' features in d90 and other pns and didnt have a chance to try out those cameras, i felt compelled to bring out this question, in case there are other ways i can get sharp photos when trying to frame multiple subjects' faces. afterall, d90 came out way after d3, and with video features and such, i was thinking that they might have a breakthrough with the 'face recognition' feature that can do easily with a switch what you would normally need to do with much adjustment to your aperture and some trial and error shots. thanks for your comments and encouragement - i will keep shooting and make the most out of my gear

Yes, you are right about stopping down the aperture to get a greater DoF to get more faces sharp. Even face detection technology does not work magic. The thing about PnS being able to do it is that the focal length is very short because of the tiny sensor size and therefore having a great DoF compared to SLRs. So between FX and DX, FX would have a shallower DoF for the equivalent picture angle at the same aperture because a longer lens is required.

It is important to know your equipment and motivations for going FX or even medium format. Don't just adopt something because people are hyping about it. I find DX a good compromise when DoF is concerned. Of course there are times when an FX is useful but generally, I think DX suffice.

The other way to get sharp faces is to make the subjects stand very still and do a 'focus bracketing' on each of the subjects's face and stack the images in PP. This is what is being done for some photomicrography. Of course you will need a tripod to keep the framing still, you may need to manual focus on each of the subject's face of the AF area doesn't coincide with any of the faces.

[Lord Soth]

Originally Posted by Yew Fai ................................ i hear about face recognition features in pns and the many autofocus points in the dslr. i currently have a d3, and though i think i may have gone thru' most of the user guide, i am not sure if i have missed anything with regards to any functions that allows me to capture multiple faces and keeping them sharp and in focus. ................

Firstly, congrats on getting a very good Nikon camera!

I recommend that you get the complete D3 guide from Thom Hogan
http://www.bythom.com/nikond3guide.htm

I got the equivalent D700 guide from him for my own camera and really learnt how to make the best use of my camera from his guide book.

The official Nikon manual only scratches the surface. It still doesn't explain all the reasons "WHY" certain things should be turned on or off. This is where Thom Hogan's guide books come in!

Since you have already invested so much money in your D3, I recommend that you pay a little bit more (only US$50) for the guide book.

You will find the answers that you seek by a Pro photographer in the section called "The Pro Approach to Autofocus" by Thom Hogan.

For me, the section on how to interpret Histograms alone was worth every penny I paid for that book.

[Yew Fai]

thanks for all your replies - and a happy new year to all